Young Widow Forum

Socializing => Relationships/Remarriage => Topic started by: arneal on January 22, 2017, 05:42:56 PM

Title: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 22, 2017, 05:42:56 PM
Hi, all!

I hope I am not out of line by starting this thread. Thanks to SunshineFL, I realized that a different space to share thoughts on budding relationships might be helpful :)

So, I suspect I am not alone here -- there is a relationship space that is between being single and desiring a connection and being in a fully committed situation. To give a bit of my own story, I met NG online and we hit it off; we have been seeing each other since May 2016. He and I talked about our past relationships and he shared that he tends to take things slowly now (as someone who's been widowed twice, I totally get it!). Our situation doesn't fit the 'new relationships - post photos' area since neither of us does much picture-taking. We each have pretty full work lives and spend some part of our weekends together unless out of town for work. Public affection a norm and we are sexually involved.

We are navigating this thing and there are occasionally strange hiccups, like my boy dog (a 3-year-old 80lb Black Malinois) nips at NG. It's like he is trying to be the house alpha. He's also still a big puppy, which gives NG a bit of anxiety (who wouldn't be anxious about a large dog acting wild?). Other than that, things are pretty good :)

So, what kinds of pitfalls and pinnacles do others find themselves experiencing as they are growing new relationships? What do you want? What do you not want? Funny stories? Questions? Warnings?

Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on January 22, 2017, 07:38:32 PM
Almost 11 months.  1 hr 15 minutes away.   Manage every other weekend time, once during the week and sometimes with our kids on a weekend. Divorced dad with his schedule with kids.  My active 13 yr. son.  WE have activities to contend with that prevent us from getting together.  That is a drag.

Talking it all out.  Good.  Respectfully.  NG is retired Lt Col. and rugby player,  so super masculine.  Gives advice about son respectfully.  I can handle it but also disagree. So far, so good. 

WE just spent the weeknight together.  I pulled up the 36 questions to ask to "fall in love."  We are already open about loving each other, but this was a real intimacy activity.  I feel so much more connected and stable in the long term, which we talk about but seems so far away.  I knew a lot of his answers already, but still, it helped to do this. 45 minutes but we took 2 hours.  So, good conversation.  Also, verified to me it is much more than our physical relationship.  I am enjoying that part, but wondered if I really didn't have the depth in the relationship, but I do.  Good weekend.

I can talk about DH, and he tolerates it well.  Quoted some movie about a man dating a widow, which meant he really dated her and her late husband.  But he has said he hopes as the future goes, DH will e mentioned less and less.  I think so as new memories are made.  Did put away all pics in the bedroom at his request and only had a family one.  Living room okay due to son, also. 

No photos.  Not ready for that.  Don't know why.  Just not.

PS.  Sadiversary was Friday and tomorrow is funeral date, 5 year milestone.  I have managed it better than any other year.  Anticipation is the worst.  FB lots of stuff and family did too, and it was okay.  NG had heads up for it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 22, 2017, 08:23:53 PM
I suspect the LH/NG dynamic might be an area of careful navigation, tybec ... NG (while not a widower) and I shared our previous relationship stories fairly early. He wasn't freaked out by the fact that I'd been widowed twice, which is refreshing. He had an ugly situation with his ex-wife and I think I may have posted about that conversation here somewhere. He was so nervous to tell me what happened. He asked me to sit down one night (it used to be that we often stood in my kitchen when we talked. Don't know why). Trust me when I tell you I thought we were about to have the breakup before the relationship conversation! He was literally shaking and said that he had been worried about telling me and was so glad to have gotten it off his chest. I felt bad that it had concerned him so much. However, the good that came of it was that he feels very open to letting his hair down about everything, so to speak. I suppose we automatically react in certain ways because of how we've been treated in the past. I am a generally easy-going person and I don't think he was used to that. I don't know if he remembers, but some time ago, he said I was 'easy on the heart'. I thought I would melt when he said it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on January 23, 2017, 10:08:15 AM
NG told me I am "calming to his soul."  (swoon) 

Maybe funny, maybe not.  Get a glass of bourbon in him, and he spills his heart to me.   ;) Mr. Analytical stone cold sober.  Crunches numbers all day as MBA military contractor. Interesting stuff!

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 23, 2017, 10:33:21 AM
tybec -- I hear you! NG is a technician by day. He is very laid back but you can tell he analyzes and thinks a lot. I like that he lets his hair down with me :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on January 23, 2017, 02:43:08 PM
I don't know if we qualify as budding anymore, as BF (N) and I have been together a little over a year. But the new(er)ness of it is one of the things that makes it very different from my relationship with Dan. I think we've moved, and are moving, at a very healthy pace. Dan and I were together for almost 15 years, lived together for nine, married for five. We started dating at twenty one, and we were only eleven days apart in age. There was a security that we built over that time. A reassurance that one fight or bad mood wasn't going to end it, a confidence that we were both in it for the long haul. And frankly, I miss that.

I think some of my anxiety stems from the fact that N has never been married or cohabited with anyone. So I worry about being too clingy, or pushing too hard. I don't remember worrying about those things as much in my early twenties. Maybe I should have, but I don't know that I did.

In many ways, I think N and I are more compatible. Or maybe it's a result of my widowhood and the circumstances surrounding it, that make me work harder at letting things go, which makes the relationship seem easier. Maybe it's both. Dan spent a lot of time I think trying to toughen me up; he didn't hold back and sometimes it came off hurtful. His perspective would be, "Why are you being such a bitch?" Because I really think he thought, "You're better than that." N's approach is different. Yesterday I was really stressed out, emotionally overwhelmed about some things. We were on an outing with his family. He noticed and commented that I seemed stressed out. I apologized, and he said there was no reason to apologize, he just wanted to make sure I was okay. Then when we got back to the house and I mentioned I hadn't really eaten much that day, he made me eat some pancakes.

For me, one of the hardest things has just been dealing with how radically different my life is from before Dan died. Our daughter was just three months old, so parenthood is a huge part of that change. Most of our life Dan and I were childless. I have a different job, am living in another state, am estranged from most of my old friends and family. And I have a boyfriend. I love him very much. But I also love Dan, and wrapping my head around that is hard sometimes.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on January 23, 2017, 03:42:48 PM
Thanks everyone for sharing.

I'm still limping along with BF dealing with his depression. I've worked hard on getting him to a better place, but it's very slow going. I've made up my mind to give it until March and then make a decision on whether to continue or not.

You'd think after going on 2 years together we would know each other more deeply. I felt like we did, but so many things have come to the surface in the last two months. I realize there is so much we don't know about each other, and we have to learn how to communicate in a healthy way.

Maybe because we are past the "honeymoon" period? I married DH after only 6 months of knowing him, and that was a huge mistake. So I am glad to be going at a better pace this time.

He also finally shared something with me, that he had a short 3 month relationship with a married woman before we were together. And that has been a shocker and something I don't really know if I can get past. I just feel so disappointed and disgusted with him about it. Obviously he says all the right things now and shows me he regrets it, but to have such low moral boundaries, idk. We've gone over and over and over it though over the last month, so I need to decide if I can forgive and move past, or if it's a deal-breaker for me. I'm still not sure.

So yeah, this relationship stuff is pretty rocky right now. A big part of me knows it would be more healthy for me to move on, but then a big part of me loves him and I know he loves me, we need each other, we are good together. Ugh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 23, 2017, 04:42:34 PM
MrsDan -- I completely get your point about children; NG's youngest daughter lives with him but he's been talking more and more about moving further east (closer to work); she doesn't want to go because she would be further away from her mom and where she works. He is estranged from his oldest daughter and has been for quite some time. He shared about his kids early on and so did I; having a special needs adult child from an abusive marriage and being widowed twice would be a glaring deal-breaker for many so before I invested much I needed to share it. I don't see or speak to my son much but want to see him this year; he knows I am dating and asks me how it's going when I talk with him (it's felt weird having this conversation with my son and then I remember that he will be 22 in a couple months lol). Like you, this is a very different relationship. I married the first husband after ... I don't know what to call it -- it wasn't really dating, I guess just young and stupid connection. My second husband and I lived together for a few years since he was legally separated when we met and then got married; 16 years together and then it was gone.
The online gig was weird and now that NG and I have found a regular rhythm, I pray not to go back to it. Seeing him is cause for anxiety but it's fun as well. Like the teenage stuff I never did ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 23, 2017, 05:01:04 PM
DoE -- So sorry you are having some bumps with your NG. Yeah, determining the make-or-breaks is not as easy as some might think. Many of us have written about those things in terms of initial meet-ups and online dating (e.g., age differences, activity levels, and hobbies) but there are some things that don't come out right away, which is a double-edged sword as well. If we have something that might be considered a little touchy by others, we might keep them hidden or be reluctant to share it because we don't want to be rejected. Maybe whatever it was, was a poor decision, a mistake or on purpose. Regardless, we must have standards. Don't sell yourself short -- if you are uncomfortable, do what you need to do, friend -- either way.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: wecouldbeheros on January 24, 2017, 12:56:56 AM
Dof, don't think it's a "morality" issue that he had a short alliance with someone who was married. He has come forth and told you. Maybe she was looking to divorce, i.e. They were not getting along, etc. it's in the past, he obviously wants to be w you. If you don't let that fully go, you won't get past it. Me, I don't think one should say, well let's see how the next three months go, it is putting barriers up. If someone is not stuck on partners or situations of the past, it seems having doubts will only resurface, and negatively affect the future. Just a thought.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: serpico on January 24, 2017, 12:38:37 PM
He also finally shared something with me, that he had a short 3 month relationship with a married woman before we were together. And that has been a shocker and something I don't really know if I can get past. I just feel so disappointed and disgusted with him about it. Obviously he says all the right things now and shows me he regrets it, but to have such low moral boundaries, idk. We've gone over and over and over it though over the last month, so I need to decide if I can forgive and move past, or if it's a deal-breaker for me. I'm still not sure.

Wow.  The fact that you're still going 'over it and over it' tells me this could be impossible to let go of.  And yeah, I agree with you about it being a reflection of his moral boundaries.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: fairlanegirl on January 24, 2017, 01:38:41 PM


He also finally shared something with me, that he had a short 3 month relationship with a married woman before we were together. And that has been a shocker and something I don't really know if I can get past. I just feel so disappointed and disgusted with him about it. Obviously he says all the right things now and shows me he regrets it, but to have such low moral boundaries, idk. We've gone over and over and over it though over the last month, so I need to decide if I can forgive and move past, or if it's a deal-breaker for me. I'm still not sure.


I understand if it is a deal-breaker for you; it is not very admirable behaviour, but then again the guy is only human, and he was not the married one by the sound of things. Over the years I've had girlfriends involved with married men who never thought they would be. It has never turned out well, but none fit the image of the 'scarlet woman' and all have gone on to happy marriages themselves. Sometimes life isn't black and white.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 24, 2017, 07:50:40 PM
Great point, fairlanegirl: I never expected to be widowed twice ... it's tough to share that with friends, much less a potential new love interest. We never know what will be a deal-breaker for someone  :-[
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on January 25, 2017, 07:55:55 AM
DoE, I understand your difficulties with the revelation. It would be a moral issue for me as well, but I suspect I would have as much of a problem with him keeping it to himself until now. My BF kept something HUGE from me until after the first few dates. I completely understand why he did; the circumstances were complicated and such that it makes sense why he held off. Plus, he had no obligation to me on those first few dates. He did want to tell me, and after a few dates and phone conversations he did. I am very understanding about it, but still, I wish it hadn't needed to be that way. In your case, I mean two years? That would bug me. I'm sure it wasn't easy to tell you, but after everything I've been  through, "It's hard" doesn't really fly with me as an excuse.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on January 28, 2017, 09:19:04 AM
I am feeling a bit better after this week. I had a counseling session for the first time in about 3 years with the counselor who helped me get through some grief stuff. It went well. BF got the paperwork turned in and has a counseling appt set up for the week after next. We had a big talk on Monday where I laid down some things that were not acceptable that were going on (drinking too much, complaining and dwelling on all the negative constantly) and he's made an effort this week to improve. So I'm a little more hopeful.

We had a really great night together last night watching movies and cuddling+ in bed, and that is something I really cannot let go right now either. I need the connection I have with him that way. DH was my first and only, and it just wasn't good, it was something I avoided as a chore. With BF it gets better and better even 2 years into things, he's taught me so much about what it means to make love, not just have sex. Even if we don't work out long term I will be forever grateful for that.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on January 28, 2017, 01:51:49 PM
Can totally relate, daysofelijah; my first husband was abusive and was my first. I learned nothing about intimacy from him and like you, avoided it. My second husband taught me a lot but I think the residue of experience from my first marriage prevented me from really enjoying myself. Plus, with his health conditions, our sex life had been nonexistent for quite a few years. I really appreciate spending time with NG in that way :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Captains wife on February 01, 2017, 08:54:43 AM
"So, what kinds of pitfalls and pinnacles do others find themselves experiencing as they are growing new relationships? What do you want? What do you not want? Funny stories? Questions? Warnings?"

Good questions ! I have found myself in an interesting place after 4 years of serial dating and finally now in an early committed relationship that I think has the potential to be long term. But its so interesting getting to know someone intimately again, from scratch. And you never know what you'll find out during this journey. So far, so good - but who knows ? (Ive honestly seen almost everything at this point so I try not to think too far ahead). Daysofelijah - I hear you on the intimacy part....its so great to really find that.

BUT one thing I am finding out is that I have become so comfortable on my own with my son that I find the prospect of co-habitating again quite daunting. (Does anyone else feel this way?) I also remember the number of issues I had living with my LH and I'm in no rush to repeat that. I wish I could see NG more but there is also something nice about having my own space, and space with my son alone. I'm pretty independent, including financially. NG is a quirky guy (health nut, kind of eccentric, into his certain routes and way of doing things) so that has taken some getting used to since he has been staying over - but I like him a lot so it hasn't phased me really. He has brought up potentially co-habitating down the road but I feel myself very, very cautious about doing this (or even thinking about it) - especially as I can see that it would be me having to do all the accommodating (ie moving his way, which is even farther away from work for me, given his situation with his son and his ex). And given all the time I have invested in developing relationships in my community and given my son is in a great school (plus I don't deal well with change these days), I have doubts about wanting to relocate for someone - even if it is down the road and even if I am crazy about him. This is a big question mark that I don't know how to handle but I guess will cross that bridge when I really come to it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on February 01, 2017, 10:33:34 AM
Captains wife, as someone who is recently cohabitating I can relate to all of your concerns.  I am definitely set in my ways and fiancé lived as a bachelor until age 47 except for a few short married years.  I worried about him not only sharing space and routines with me but with my 3 kids full time and his 2 parttime. 

We have definitely had some adjustments and compromises to make but honestly it is really nice to have another adult in the house to talk to, to eat dinner with, to share chores with and to fall asleep next to.

2 years of dating and then a few months of gradual "sleep overs" helped us but we didn't face any big decision of location.  His kids go to school in my town and he lived one town away so moving in with me was not a logistical issue. 

Glad to hear things are going well!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 01, 2017, 05:11:28 PM
Oh, boy, yes! The space thing!  ;D

When LH died, I panicked and at first considered hiring a live-in because I didn't want to be here alone. My son had been placed in a care home for men with special needs a year before LH died, my stepdaughter lives with her mom back east, and so this family of three humans dwindled to a family of one human in quick fashion. Also, I felt trapped all by myself, with no outlet because no one was around to care for my pups if I were to decide to take off. I posted elsewhere about having a conversation with my stepdaughter about coming to live with me and soon realizing that was a mistake (she is 30 and not particularly financially independent). I got past that and soon became VERY comfy here alone. I have my schedule and also have a great sitter for my animals now after developing connections with neighbors (you know I trust her if she has a set of keys and her own alarm code).

However, like you Captains wife, I find myself wanting to spend more time with NG. He often stays here overnight on weekends and once we spent a couple days together because I was taking to the airport for a work assignment. Full disclosure -- when he hugged and kissed me good bye at the airport, I cried on the way home. I soon started laughing about it, but wow, I never thought I would be so sappy! Anyway, he has mentioned wanting to buy a house but the market is hideous here. I haven't been so bold as to suggest he live with me, even though I've thought it. Then I think about how much I love my space. Then I think about the fact that I would still have it because he works all day and I work from home; the only things we'd have to negotiate time-wise would be my 4:30am mornings when I get up to go to the gym three days a week. And parking, since both my vehicles are in the driveway (I even figured out a way to solve that). Our acquaintance won't reach its year mark until Memorial Day weekend, so it's still very early in this thing and I am willing to let it play out as God will have it do so.

As a side note, today marks exactly one year since LH crossed the Rainbow Bridge. As much as I love(d) him, I woke, thinking 1) it's the first day of my birthday month and 2) of NG. Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 02, 2017, 09:24:26 AM
I just passed 5 years the 20th.  I spent that weekend night with NG which helped tremendously.  Last weekend, he had his kids.  So, we did a blended weekend night with my son. My son and I stay in the MIL suite upstairs at this point with his boys being little, and that is most comfortable for now.  Anyway, went to church on Sunday, and I have been several times now with him.  But not with his kids. I am with my son, his kids and him, and I was so sad.  It was 5 years to the date I would have attended church on my own for the first time without my DH.  Why my brain was going there, I don't know.  Widow world......

So, at the end of the church, they sing an upbeat version of "I'll Fly Away."  I am holding it together.  My son is checking me out, and then gives me a hug.  This is the last song sung at DH's funeral, upbeat, by my two nephews.  Many have told me it was the perfect song for DH, and they will never hear it again without thinking of him.  NG is clueless of this, and singing and smiling and so happy hearing it. He is whistling it on the way back to his house.  HOW can this wonderful new relationship still have such strange times of sadness at unpredictable moments?  Just our world....

I am passed that feeling, thankfully, and we had our middle of the week time together. I guess it is just going to be that way.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on February 03, 2017, 10:01:29 AM
Tybec it is strange. And yet, it just is.

I am moving into this phase where I am really missing Dan's friendship and just him as a human being, not just as my husband or my daughter's father. I am very happy with my boyfriend, he is absolutely wonderful and it feels more and more, I don't know, normal to be in this relationship at this time of my life. But still, I miss Dan. I just miss him being in the world. I miss other people getting to spend time with him. I feel like I am feeling his family and friends' loss more acutely than ever, and, strange as it sounds, I'm finding it incredibly sad that he and my boyfriend will never meet.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 03, 2017, 10:49:19 AM
MrsDan, 
 
You nailed it on so many levels. I know you shared you have moved elsewhere, too.  I think about how moving forward and away from my 22 yr. old home, community, and NO ONE knows my DH.  And, yes, I think NG and DH would have been friends.  And I miss the parts of DH that were so complementary of me that are not me.  How can it be, so much still comes to my head and heart?  How can you love a new person and have this attachment, story with another? 

I know others work through this with the board responses. Thank you for that.

PS Widow friend who lost her DH almost one month prior to my DH's death to a car accident, too.  She has been a relationship for 3 years. Lots of pictures on FB.  Well, 5 years just passed, and she put on her FB page they are in a relationship. We all know, as they are open.  But for some reason, that status change matters to somebody, maybe not her. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on February 03, 2017, 02:40:24 PM

BUT one thing I am finding out is that I have become so comfortable on my own with my son that I find the prospect of co-habitating again quite daunting. (Does anyone else feel this way?) I also remember the number of issues I had living with my LH and I'm in no rush to repeat that. I wish I could see NG more but there is also something nice about having my own space, and space with my son alone. I'm pretty independent, including financially. NG is a quirky guy (health nut, kind of eccentric, into his certain routes and way of doing things) so that has taken some getting used to since he has been staying over - but I like him a lot so it hasn't phased me really. He has brought up potentially co-habitating down the road but I feel myself very, very cautious about doing this (or even thinking about it) - especially as I can see that it would be me having to do all the accommodating (ie moving his way, which is even farther away from work for me, given his situation with his son and his ex). And given all the time I have invested in developing relationships in my community and given my son is in a great school (plus I don't deal well with change these days), I have doubts about wanting to relocate for someone - even if it is down the road and even if I am crazy about him. This is a big question mark that I don't know how to handle but I guess will cross that bridge when I really come to it.

We've talked about this very generally, basically that we've both thought about it potentially happening down the road. In our case, unless we decided to both relocate together, we would come to live with me (He lives in a rental with his brother and I have my own house). We've talked about the fact that it would have implications for his custody arrangement, but haven't really discussed it further than that.

We only live about thirty minutes apart, and he works nearby a few days a week (he has several jobs). Because of his work and the fact that we're both single parents, we don't get to see each other as much as we would like. Currently he usually spends the night about once a week. He has said he would like to more, and I would like that too. I love being with him. For me, it's not so much a question of giving up space, but rather autonomy. I mean, I make all the decisions about my house, my dogs, my kid. Dan and I sometimes clashed about décor, or repair priorities, or the dogs. This place is really my own, and I recognize that I would have to adjust to giving up some of that. If he lived in the house with them, I feel like he'd also have the right to have more of a say in my dogs, and that I think would be a bigger adjustment for me.  We are slowly getting him more involved in DD's discipline. They have a good relationship, but I've recently given him a bit more room in terms of correction and discipline after he expressed that he didn't want to overstep. And of course, the two weekends his daughter is with him would be with us as well. Which would be an adjustment for us all as well. What would our parenting look like? Would we continue to be the main point person for each or our kids? Or would we trade off on parenting duties, regardless of who's kid it is, like getting up in the night when they have bad dreams, for example?

Of course with the sacrifice of autonomy comes a whole set of rewards. I have control of the house, but that means all the stuff goes wrong is on my shoulders. It would be nice to share that burden.

And quite frankly, despite the fact that I have about a billion other responsibilities, I like taking care of him. And being taken care of. Making him lunch on those days after he's spent the night. Him making phone calls to find out things I need to look into but can't find the time. I do think the benefits are such that cohabitation seems possible, even likely down the road.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 03, 2017, 03:45:07 PM
MrsDan -- your post made me smile about the dogs. My boy nips at NG; he's about 80lb and even though he is three, he's just a big baby. He likes thinking he's the Alpha. I had no problem telling NG to pop him on the snout if he nips again, but thinking of the possibility of sharing space, of sharing the pups 24/7, is an interesting premise. I gave that more thought, honestly, than I did to introducing NG to my son (who doesn't live with me)  :D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on February 04, 2017, 07:39:55 AM
So our dog has always been extremely attached to me, wouldn't go downstairs in the morning unless I went down too, wouldn't go up to bed without me (he sleeps in his bed on my bedroom floor), wouldn't eat unless I was in the kitchen.  You get the idea.  I was always his #1 and DH and the kids were not even a close second.  Now enter fiancé and I have been tossed to the curb!  Ok, I am a close second but fiancé is clearly #1. The dog literally jumps up and hugs him when he comes home and is attached to him at the hip.  Who knew an 8 year old dog could change his allegiance so easily?!  Honestly it makes me love fiancé that much more, nothing sexier than a guy who loves kids and dogs😉
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on February 04, 2017, 10:29:52 AM
The dog thing is funny. I'm on the opposite side. BF has a big, hairy, spoiled 80 lb. dog. I tolerate him and try to be nice, but being pet-less for the last 5 years has made me less accomodating of them. Dog thinks I'm great though and is always trying to snuggle, sniff, and love on me. I don't know why. BF says he just wants me to like him, lol.

I hate that the dog is allowed everywhere though, on all furniture and sleeps in BFs bed. Yuck, but again I tolerate b/c I know BF loves that darn dog.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 04, 2017, 12:49:23 PM
That is interesting, daysofelijah -- I used to let my dogs go everywhere, including sleep on my bed. I had to keep them out when LH got very sick because he was on oxygen and whatnot. I started again after he died because that California King was just too empty. However, when NG started coming over, I knew they weren't used to other people. They are for my protection, after all. It's only recently that he's talked to them and most of those have been accidental (when they would break out of their enclosure and rush him ... not a good impression  ;D). I keep them out of my bedroom now, even when I'm by myself. I want him to like them but I also want to respect his feelings about how he engages with them.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 06, 2017, 03:11:34 PM
Uggghhh.....  this new relationship stuff can be so hard.  NG and I have spent pretty much every kid free weekend he has together since starting to date in March.  Coming up a year!  So, this past weekend, my kid had stuff Friday night, Sat. all day, Sunday morning and then Sunday night.  Busy.  I couldn't leave town truly.  He had made commitments for Sat. morning and Sunday night, too.  So, he didn't come see me though I could not get to him, which I choose to do mostly.  I am bothered he didn't choose to come see me.  He drives daily 77 miles one way to work.  I know he gets so tired, and I don't ask him to drive to see me, another 70 miles.  My head tells me it was just logistics, and he needed to rest, and he did all kinds of catch up things, too.  My heart feels sad he didn't choose me, still.  SO Middle school like but nevertheless, still feeling it.  Blah....

PS  My two kittens I got a year ago last Christmas have issues with NG.  When he is here, the male one, who is big, scratches and meows sometimes every hour on the shut bedroom door.  The cat does not when I am in here by myself.  It is awful.  Stupid cat.....but me and my son love them.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on February 07, 2017, 07:24:03 PM
Tybec I hate those middle school feelings, and I am prone to them, I think, because I tend to bend over backwards to degrees that others won't. My boyfriend has to do a lot of driving. He has several jobs and has to ping pong around a lot. A couple nights a week he works near me, so I usually get to see him then, and then I usually get a sitter once a  week. Because of his work schedule, the nights we see each other tend to be clustered together, like Thursday Friday, then not again until the following Thursday. Which we've both stated we don't like but there it is. We only live about 30 minutes apart, but I can't pick up and go over there unless I have a sitter. And because he's a music teacher, he has to spend a lot of his off time, prepping, responding to emails. He's busy, stretched to the limit. I get it. But I miss him. I was supposed to get a sitter tomorrow night, but DD is sick so depending on how she's doing that might not happen.

BF loves dogs but hates when they kiss or lick and my boy dog is the biggest kisser in the world. My girl, she's more stealthy about it, like she'll casually rest her head on your lap then lick your knee. And BF just does not like it. I don't get it. I mean, I know it's gross, but I just don't understand the level of disgust.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on February 08, 2017, 11:16:06 AM
I've gone from a non-caring attitude, to having some dating success lately.  I love the idea of love, being in a relationship, the intimacy, closeness, sharing secrets, history, turmoil and joy.  I need a man that can take control, make plans, follow through, be there.   I found a guy - he's my foodie soulmate, we're socially and politically on the same page, read and discuss similar books.  He's active, funny, polite, a great Dad from what I can tell.  All this I've discerned in a couple of weeks.  Damn though ..... I'm not attracted to him.  I've given this a chance, but nothing.  There's no desire for a kiss, I don't want to jump his bones.  Sad to have to let this one go - sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 09, 2017, 11:21:18 AM
Oh, trying ... {{hugs!!!}}
One of the dating info sites I read had a post a few days back. The desire for the other person was #1. The 'expert' wasn't saying that sex is the main thing, but if there's no attraction, chances are that there won't be. Without some level of attraction, the idea of that guy being 'the one' is slim.
The not spending a lot of time thing. Ugh! So I had to travel for a speaking engagement from Monday-Wednesday this week. After an overnight away weekend before last where NG was sick, I got sick. It was totally a stress cold. I did my darnedest to get better before leaving as I was hoping to see him before I left. He was still sick so it didn't happen. I was sad about it, even though we texted and whatnot. I got over it quickly because it would have been hell if I had gotten sicker before going to present, right? Silly. However, this was a cathartic trip -- the first one taken where I had no one at home to call and say "I made it' and no one waiting for me at the airport when I got back. That was tough. I cried when the plane was coming in for landing and had to close my eyes when I was on the way to grab my checked bag because there was a husband there, waiting expectantly for his wife. I saw her as she rushed to him for a kiss and just ... felt empty for a moment. I had been happy when I arrived at the airport on Monday though; I hadn't told NG exactly my itinerary, other than I was leaving Monday and would be back Wednesday. When I was getting out of the shuttle, I heard my phone and when I looked, he had texted me -- as if he knew the time! -- to say have a safe trip and he'd see me when I got back. Swoon, right? I texted back once I got through TSA to say I'd let him know when I landed, which I did. We had a couple messages on social media in between and then he seemed happy to know I got home safe and said he'd see me soon. So then I posted a photo and wrote about my teary landing on social media; his response? 'I would have picked you up but didn't know when' Swoon again! So I kept it light and said something back about him being a hard worker who drives like 29 hours a day, that this was something I had to go through, but now that I had, I might hit him up for that ride next time :) We'll see what this weekend brings as it is my birthday on Sunday :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 09, 2017, 01:21:00 PM
First, Trying2breathe.  Yes, there has to be some chemistry, I think.  With my NG, after talking on line and phone for about 10 days, met up.  I wrote him I knew there had to be something there, as looking good on paper didn't always mean anything.  I believe that, why some folks couple up, and it makes no logical sense but works. So, Good Luck finding someone that meets your dreams AND some chemistry.

Arneal, Happy Birthday Weekend!  Hope you and NG can celebrate it together!  Yes, things like not having someone to text you to make sure you made it on a trip are just sad.  Not having that person.  The pick up at the airport.  So glad NG is willing and able next time!

MrsDAN, Thanks for the validation.  Glad I am not alone with this. 

PS Big cat left me alone all night two nights ago.  Last night with NG here, 4, 4:30, 5:00 a.m. banging, scratching, meowing at the door.  Ughh..........  But on the upside, NG and I had a great time together, especially since we skipped last weekend.  He continues to talk long term, now, me moving closer, blending families.  Too bad the ex wife is such a control freak.  Not gonna think about that today.....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 09, 2017, 02:16:01 PM
Thanks, tybec -- does the cat like NG? Is he trying to get in for some extra cuddles? My baby boy dog is like that with NG. He's nipped at his fingers and because he's sort of wild, he makes NG anxious, which doesn't help matters. I am hoping the two of them can find some equal ground.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on February 09, 2017, 04:32:28 PM
I too miss the travel texts and the airport pickup.  There's an emptiness there when it doesn't happen, these days it's DD that I text and that seems to fill the void somewhat. 

I'm giggling about your puppy, arneal.  Mine is similar in that she's big and energetic, and it will be interesting to see what happens when I introduce her to a man someday. 


As for me, back to square one.  I guess I should look for some chemistry before making an effort.  Hopefully I'm back in this forum again sometime soon.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 09, 2017, 04:52:27 PM
Feel free to update us, trying -- we are all here for each other! Yes, chemistry of some sort early on is important. I was so corny about NG when I first saw his profile. I wish I had been a real stalker because I would have loved to have copied/pasted the contents so I could look at it now to see what it was that I liked so much. We had very good written conversations on the dating site right away and in the chat he said something like 'it seems like we have some chemistry here'. I suggested meeting and the rest is history. I know I thought he was cute right off, but besides that, there was something in his writing and eventually in his conversations. But the cute certainly didn't hurt!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 10, 2017, 10:13:58 AM
The cats.  I asked on-line at very beginning if deal breaker as some folks have severe allergies and/or hate them.  I actually got on line when I got the two kittens for Christmas and decided I could not be a crazy cat lady.  I wanted a man in my life.   :P

NG likes animals, but not a cuddler of animals.  So, not petting or talking to them but tolerating them.  He would have a dog in a heart beat.  I love them, but my life style is not for a dog's care. 

Big cat is mellow as can be, but also cuddles on his terms, so not in our laps or anything.  Not sure of the behavior except testosterone?  Idk......
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 11, 2017, 05:08:17 PM
Yes, tybec ... I think it is the testosterone challenge lol! My girl dog is generally sweet to NG and actually my boy is too, but he nips. He does that to men and women, but seems particularly into doing it at each chance with NG, who thinks it's the pup's way of trying to be Alpha. My cat is a boy, but as you note, cats do their own thing, regardless it seems of gender. They tolerate us :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on February 15, 2017, 08:39:59 AM
Oh wow, do you know what he did? He made me a book of all our OKCupid messages and the text messages up until our first date (which all took place over the course of six weeks). He included pictures of us and the restaurant where we had our first date. He then tallied the number of days we've known each other, and the number of text messages we've shared. It is so, so sweet.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 15, 2017, 11:46:13 AM
Love that, MrsDan! I have a book I made as well but I haven't shared it. I included things like movie and event tickets, along with a little description, a big leaf that was on my windshield after I stayed at his place New Year's Eve into New Year's Day, and little remembrances. It is my own keepsake that maybe I'll share one day. But I don't think I'll ever give it to him  ;D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: SunshineFL on February 16, 2017, 06:49:06 AM
Oh wow, do you know what he did? He made me a book of all our OKCupid messages and the text messages up until our first date (which all took place over the course of six weeks). He included pictures of us and the restaurant where we had our first date. He then tallied the number of days we've known each other, and the number of text messages we've shared. It is so, so sweet.

So caring of him, thoughtfully inspired and created,  and such a loving gift to you both on so many levels @MrsDan ... so sweet. Can feel you beaming and happy!

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 16, 2017, 08:53:27 AM
MrsDan,

He is a keeper!  What a beautiful display of love, commitment and caring.  JUST WOW!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 18, 2017, 08:31:25 AM
Oh my!  NG and I had a big talk.  We had the long conversation a month ago today, using the 36 questions to fall in love.  Well, He is ready. He said he will give me to about Next Feb. to decide, but I need to let him know if I want to "play him or trade him."  I have had the same thought process.  Do you see me as long term, not just good on paper, a lifetime?  Or if not, let me go.  Life is too short for me to be in limbo.  This week is one year we connected on line!  I am so excited, scared, thrilled, in love.  So, the next step?  I take my mother to his town next week for the evaluation for her care level needs at a senior living community.  Probably she will need the dementia unit, honestly.  Talking to dear son about moving, but he wants to finish MS in this hometown.  I am honest with him that I think that would be great, but if grandmother needs to move, it would make sense for us to go sooner, than me travel all the time.  Budding relationships, I tell ya!

I am smiling, though.   :-*
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 18, 2017, 05:27:52 PM
Good for you, tybec! So glad it's coming together with your family (son, mom) and NG.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 18, 2017, 05:33:52 PM
Since it just passed ...

How was Valentine's Day (for those who celebrate)?

I think I mentioned I gave NG a Valentine's Day card; if I did, feel free to skip this part lol. I gave it to him on my birthday (2/12) since it fell during the week and with his schedule I knew he wouldn't be coming round. He seemed a bit worried that he hadn't given me a card or anything and I told him it was just a card, no worries :) When Tuesday rolled around, he sent me a text to say Happy Valentine's Day, apologized that he couldn't come round due to needing to be on the road early in the morning, and asked if we could get together this weekend. I think I smiled for the next three days ... it was the first time not being married (in which it seems there's more obligation when such dates come for both people to say or do something) that I got a greeting for the day. The first husband didn't do such things and LH was always good about it when we got married, but while dating, this is new to me :) I'm off to cook dinner for us now and hope he can still come as the weather has been a bit strange here these last couple days ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on February 19, 2017, 09:40:49 AM
Hope you were able to enjoy that dinner and some time together with your guy arneal!

Valentine's Day went real well for us. NG has been doing a lot better the past couple weeks, though I'm still understandably very cautious still.

He got me pink roses and wrote me a really sweet note that included a cute country song with a box for check "yes" or "no". I've never gotten cute notes like that from anyone. Valentine's isn't something he gets into, so I appreciated his effort even more. I just gave him a cute card and some chocolates. I tend to go overboard on gifts so was proud of myself for just sticking to that this time.

He offered to take me out, but I wanted to stay home for the kids and avoid the crowds. So he grilled steaks and we had a nice dinner and time together after the kids went to bed. Probably the best Valentine's I've had in maybe forever.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 19, 2017, 01:02:26 PM
That sounds fabulous, daysofelijah! Yes, we had a good evening. It's funny -- I don't think of myself as particularly schedule-driven, except when traveling or planning meals :) If I say the meal will be ready by a certain time, I expect us to be at the table at that time. NG, not so much. I'm slowly coming to terms with that. Like last night I had planned dinner for 6pm; I can't remember what time he texted me but he wrote that he was finishing a bit of laundry and he would be here after. He didn't get here until about 7:30 and joked about the food being cold (like he was testing to see if I was angry) -- I was like, that's what microwaves are for :) It was okay because it gave me time to take a nap as well! But the thing was, I noticed he'd gotten a fresh haircut and all this sort of thing, like he was trying to look nice for me. In the end, it was a nice night of conversation, food, and a movie.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Captains wife on February 19, 2017, 04:03:42 PM
Mine was great too - the first time I really celebrated this holiday in 5-6 years. NG had lots of stuff planned. First he orchestrated a little plan with  my son such that my 5yr old gave me an orchid, teddy bear and a card. (It was so cute - my son came running into the room with each item seperately then also gave me a card he sighed himself). Then I was upstairs working out while NG was working from my house- and he called out that he had unf made a mess in my kitchen. So I came downstairs and my kitchen table had been cleared and there was an enormous bouquet of flowers in a vase in the middle of it, a helium heart balloon floating above it, cards with cute sayings scattered all over the table, a box of chocolates and 2 plates of scrumptious chocolate covered strawberries at either end as well as a very sweet card in the middle of it. It was gorgeous - and I felt so spoiled ! Then he made me one of my fav dinner from scratch (pasta bolognese) - stayed over. And we went for brunch the next day (took 1/2 day off work). Swoon...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 19, 2017, 06:41:57 PM
Yup, first Valentine's Day in 5 yrs. to have a lover's card  :-*  He couldn't come see me Tues., but did our Wed. night  and my DS was on a school trip.  Nice evening together.  Then we went to Bon Jovi Sat. night. Had plans since Oct.  Ate out and stayed in the city.  Fun!  Feel like a teenager! 

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 19, 2017, 06:44:32 PM
Sounds fabulous, tybec!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on February 20, 2017, 07:50:48 AM
Our Valentine's day was really nice too. We went out on Sunday and I brought his gift (a pair of cute socks and some chocolates and cookies). He asked why, and I said since I wouldn't see him on the actual day, since he usually works pretty late on Tuesdays. He said that he rearranged his schedule so that he could see me that day. He came over Tuesday night with the aforementioned gift, a rose, and a little something for DD as well.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 24, 2017, 11:30:53 AM
I saw a post over on one of the other socializing boards about changing social media relationship status. What do you all think about that? I go through my spells where I would love to do it, then I'm like, 'That's silly', then I imagine what it would be like to have that conversation just like the person who posted, then I imagine NG asking me about it ... sigh -- neurotic much? LOL. We sort of talk around the relationship conversation but real life speaks volumes to me. Whenever we go out, he holds my hand the whole time; I've never been with anyone who does that. LH was affectionate, but not like this. Neither of us have a big circle of local friends; I have a few people that I go to lunch with every now and again, but it's not like there's a bunch of family around for us to go to dinner with and announce 'Here's my bf' or 'Hey, meet my gf'. NG has shared that he and his ex dated for quite some time before making the big plunge and that turned out not so good so it doesn't surprise me that no labels have been placed. After all, we haven't even been together for a year yet. However, we're sneaking up on it (the end of May). How about you all?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on February 24, 2017, 01:16:56 PM
Yes, I wonder about this, too, Arneal.  My NG posted Happy Valentine's Day to me Feb. 14, and then asked if it was okay later.  He is not into all that, but would allow the public FB if I want it.  It feels so teenager like, but part of me wants it and then my other part says it doesn't matter to anyone but us, so forget it. We haven't posted a pic and it is a year next week.  I hate pics of me and am getting used to a few selfies here and there.  I just know MY FRIENDS will blow it up.  And not sure the motivation as to why. A dear friend/widow lost her DH one month before me, car accident, too, in the state I live.  CRAZY.  Anyhoo, she has dated her guy 3 years and just posted relationship status in Jan. It was funny as they take pics all the time, vacation together, are seen together everywhere in my hometown.  She just said it was time.

My thing we have joked about is what to call each other.  I hate GF and BF.  We are in our 40s, have children.  Sounds juvenile to me.  He jokes to call me his "ole lady", and I am older than him.  I don't like it, though.  For others, fine, but not me.  I like beau, but his ex started calling their oldest son Bo when she moved him out of state.  So for him, it has a bad connotation.  He told me I could introduce him as my  "Lover" but that is tongue in cheek.  So, still no consensus. He calls me "Love." 

Here is a fun link I found and shared with him:  http://www.swimmingly.com/relationships/relationships-2/47-better-ways-to-refer-to-your-significant-other-than-boyfriend-or-girlfriend/

So, how do you introduce your new person?

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on February 24, 2017, 01:45:04 PM
The first time N referred to him as my boyfriend, he sheepishly asked later that evening if it was okay. It's funny, because we had both told each other that we weren't seeing anyone else. I find the word silly at our age too but those are the only words in  common use so that's what we are. We were quiet on FB for a long time for reasons having nothing to do with widowhood. Now we don't need to be guarded so we're public and yeah people definitely reacted.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 24, 2017, 01:47:40 PM
Thanks for that, tybec :)
I sometimes say 'the person I am seeing' (ew) or 'boyfriend' (ew -- I am 48 and he is 52) when talking about NG. When I am writing generally, I use the term 'signif' (really hip, right? LOL). The one time we had a conversation was when one of his FB friends wanted to friend me. I asked him if it was okay for me to accept; after all, people can be so nosy. A specific: a few days after NG and I friended each other on social media, my aunt (who is my mother's brother's second wife ...) sent NG a friend request. It was his birthday weekend and we had stopped for a snack after a movie; he asked me if I knew who this person was and I replied that she was my aunt. I told him she was nosy and he could ignore the invite if he chose. We laughed and moved on. So, in like respect, I asked him about this person from his friend list who wanted to friend me. She is a friend of his dad's and he went on to say that she was probably friending me because she figured I was 'my girlfriend or who I am seeing or whatever' ... I had another one of his friends send me a request and I accepted without saying anything.

It's so junior high for sure!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 24, 2017, 01:50:36 PM
Yes, MrsDan -- I think we both think about the social media blowup should we go there. However, we'll need to get to a point of what we call each other first ... but stranger things have happened! Only time will tell.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on February 24, 2017, 02:20:26 PM
I changed mine to "in a relationship" this summer and posted a pic of NG and me for my profile. I had a couple of unwanted advances from some guys I was "FB friends" with so that helped take care of that. Plus everyone was all over the moon happy for me. NG doesn't have a FB account anymore, so I'm glad of that. I have a love/hate with FB and all I usually use it for now is my genealogy and translation groups.

Only lately have I gotten more comfortable saying BF, and he will call me his GF more often. It still sounds a little weird.

And for nicknames he mostly calls me my name or babes, I didn't care for babes at first but its grown on me. I usually call him his name or love or sweetie.

DH and I always called each other honey and seldom by our names, so I've tried to stay away from that one.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 24, 2017, 04:30:55 PM
That is something you've made me consider as well, daysofelijah -- LH and I had nicknames that sort of just happened; I am good at creating spur of the moment names and so was he. NG uses darling when he's being dramatic about something (like if we are pretending to be ritzy folks, throwing up our pinkies while we eat ribs or something ha!) or babe occasionally. I might slip in a 'hun' every now and again but tend to just start talking or call him by his name. When we text, we usually use each others name or just start with 'hey!'
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on February 24, 2017, 07:06:43 PM
While dating I never changed my FB status.  The first picture we posted of the 2 of us was very talked about and planned after all of the important people in my life knew I was in a serious relationship.  I'm not one to put many (or barely any) pictures of myself on FB so there haven't been many of us as a couple.  I did an announcement post when we got engaged and then finally changed my status.

The whole BF/GF title thing in our 40s was very weird to me but I'm comfortable with fiancé.  He would laugh at me whenever I introduced him before because I would stammer and then just use his name or not even introduce him because I'm socially awkward to begin with. 

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Abitlost on February 25, 2017, 12:19:13 PM
To the original post, about the pinnacles and pitfalls…

I am so blissfully happy with my NG, we’ve thus far encountered no pitfalls  :) We communicate well and often, support each other, cherish each other, anticipate each other’s needs, and have deep respect for one another, not to mention exceptional romance and chemistry. The pace of the relationship has been mutually set, we have integrated our lives in a comfortable and natural way, and above all have full trust in each other.

The only thing we have ever disagreed on is the sleeping room temperature: I like it cold and he likes it warm. Our disagreement comes in that I want to warm up the room so that he is comfortable whereas he wants to cool the room so I am comfortable. We both want it the other person’s way - lol!

I could not be happier!!!!!!!!!!!!

abl
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 25, 2017, 05:12:22 PM
Trying -- I totally relate to the socially awkward thing. After LH died, I decided it was time for me to make some health changes for myself; having been a caregiver for a while, I realized I had not been taking care of myself. I signed up for a challenge at a gym where my friend was a manager and made the initial goal. What was really the challenge was that we had to post on FB while we were in the challenge. I have never been a selfie person so that was horrifying for me! Plus, I hate photos of myself. Well, I have continued to go to the gym and have made some great acquaintances there. I haven't actually been this size since junior high, so that is quite an accomplishment for me. I have worked hard at the social awkward bit and am coming along. I practice conversations whilst home alone :) I also practice the sorts of things I plan to say to NG as well so I am ready for all sorts of discussions (we spend a lot of time talking). I appreciate your comment about not changing social media status ... that makes sense.

That is fabulous, Abitlost -- so glad to hear about your situation. I look forward to sharing something similar one day. I do my best just to keep cool and take it one day at a time :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Abitlost on February 25, 2017, 06:54:50 PM
Thank you, arneal. I spent a long time in the wrong relationship thinking nothing could be as good as it was with DH, so therefore a good-enough relationship was what I would have to settle for. I'm happy to report that was flawed thinking. Finally I'm with someone who deserves me as much as I him. My relationship with NG is of course different than my relationship with DH, but it is just as rewarding. It feels amazing :)

And there is nothing wrong with your keeping cool and taking it one day at a time approach!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 25, 2017, 07:19:35 PM
Agreed, Abitlost! We all deserve to love and be loved well. For some, this is something they've had before and it is difficult to move forward with someone new. For others, it's a completely new experience. No matter what, it will be different and there's nothing wrong with that. I am happy for you and hope you'll continue to share news of how it's going!

Yes, I think things are going well with NG; it's been just about nine months since we started seeing each other :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on February 27, 2017, 11:18:46 AM
Ha! How timely in light of our recent conversation -- just saw a post from a friend on Facebook: 'The sign of a healthy relationship is no sign of it on Facebook'  ;D
Confession: almost lost my cool today. NG had been traveling for work so we didn't get together for our usual Saturday; he came yesterday instead and left from my house to go to work. Sigh. Showered here, did a bit of work on his computer before leaving, coffee together, hugs and kisses goodbye with wishes for a good day and safe driving ... again, sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 02, 2017, 08:55:45 AM
One yr. this SATURDAY!  Going to a dance!  Wow!  How did we get  here?  Time marches on.


And we are talking about moving in together. My mother was assessed at the Personal Care/Memory Care last week and my brothers are on board to move her as there is a room and there are no guarantees for this a month or later.  So, NG is asking when I and son are moving and all.  There is so much to think about and I AM TERRIFIED but also HOPEFUL. We may have a LONG engagement due to his divorce sitaution and me just keeping my son's and mine nest egg safe from any possible legal ramifications from his ex.  IDK.  I never would have thought to be here, yet here I am..... But it is crazy wonderful!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on March 02, 2017, 11:23:17 AM
Back with an update  ::)  I've yet to have the hard conversation with my guy, have enjoyed a few more weeks of dating without any physical stuff, other than a peck on the cheek.  It seemed that we were happily spending time together, dutching everything, companionship without the complication.  Huh.  Last night he told me he wants to move it to the next level, whatever that is. 

It's not fair to him, I realize.  I've loved the past few weeks, with him - gahh - why can't I do this?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 02, 2017, 02:28:55 PM
tybec -- good for you! Yeah, the before-divorce thing. Totally get that. LH was separated when we met as was NG. LH and I lived together for some time prior to the divorce and we kept from co-mingling finances for just that reason. I think also he had an inkling that it would be easier to do so moving forward should I find myself alone. Like I have. Beyond my house, I have nothing of worth financially. LH was a musician with health issues. NG was upfront when we met that he was separated and working on a divorce; it was finalized in September. On the finance thing: I've been having car nightmares. Both my vehicles are not running but sitting in my driveway. I explained to NG why I can't just get rid of them (poor decisions, title loan taken on one to fund the family trip to my graduation when I finished my doctoral degree ages ago; and with a drop in my credit rating after my last F/T work contract ended in 2013, no one will give me a new car loan to ditch the other one I am paying on) and he said if he could, he'd buy me a car. How sweet!

trying2breathe -- if I might suggest, if you can avoid the 'It is not you, it is me' conversation? Maybe just coming out and telling him how you feel, that you are enjoying how things are, that you aren't closed completely to the idea of moving forward at some point (or are you?). Don't beat yourself up about not forging ahead. We all have to take our own pace with this thing. Personally, I was ready for a physical relationship after being with LH for eight years without sex (prostate cancer and surgery). I am grateful to LH for helping me find out more about my own desires and needs as the first husband certainly didn't give a hoot about it. It took a few months dating NG for me to figure out how much I wanted to be with him. Sigh. The story continues!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 05, 2017, 01:23:48 PM
Hi all and happy Sunday!

Was filling out an online survey (it was about an extended warranty purchase experience and for a $250 Visa card -- can't hurt!) and got to the demographics question, which brought me back to the discussion here about changing social media status. Do you all tick the 'widowed' box when you fill things out? Have any of you switched to 'single'? If so, why and after how long? If not, why not?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on March 05, 2017, 06:01:59 PM
I always check widowed. To my thinking- single means you've never been married. If you've been married, then you're either widowed or divorced- until you get married again.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 06, 2017, 09:49:07 AM
On FB, I am hidden as far as my status.  Only I can see it.  Have decent security settings.  I did tell NG yesterday after going to church with him that I need to let people know I am a widow, my thing, my issue.    I told him, it is different than being a single mom never married or divorced.  I am not being negative about those statuses, but I am different. I told him I don't want folks to think my son had a dead beat dad or no dad.  My DH had NO DAD ever, and he dealt with that until we had our son.  It messed with him for years. 

I am Mrs. DH until I remarry.  Maybe old school.  But I am not in the category of never married or divorced. 

At the funeral, people brought lots of cards, of course, and one was labeled to Mrs. DH.  My MIL picked it up.  Now she never married, and she is MS.  Well, I am lucky she gave it to me.  It was an incredible letter a soldier brought to me, telling me she and her husband stopped at the accident site and administered CPR until the ambulance got there. Also, they were medics.  She wrote she prayed for my husband to let him know he was not alone and he was loved and God was with them all.  The letter was for me, Mrs.   We widows are different, not better, just different.

NG is divorced, but his wife abandoned him.  He has that to contend with, but not the same. He says he understands.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on March 06, 2017, 10:55:08 AM
Widowed. I'll always be widowed. I imagine if I ever remarry, I'll check both. 90% of the time it makes no difference at all and has nothing to do with whatever form you're filling out.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 06, 2017, 01:30:24 PM
I like her blog.  Most is pretty relatable to me.  One answer to the widow status.

http://www.onefitwidow.com/dear-widow-police-i-wont-revoke-my-card/
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 06, 2017, 02:01:18 PM
Yes, tybec -- that is a great site. I had not read this post before but yeah, quite appropriate.

I think I wish there was some sort of in-between term. If not on a professional letter, I'll use no salutation or I'll use 'Ms.' as I've never felt much like a 'Mrs.' (that's my mom LOL), even when LH was alive. Otherwise, I avoid the whole thing and use 'Dr.' :)

It boils down to always being part of the club (boy, too much in the club after being widowed twice ... sigh) but wanting to get away from the sympathetic, pitying looks from people when they ask me if I'm married ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 06, 2017, 07:16:55 PM
Arneal, Had to laugh.  I never have been called Mrs. Dh.  But I relished the card with that on it, and now do.  I was trained we all are MS so as to not denote status.  I am in the south, so I am Miss to everyone no matter.  If you are DR., go with that.  I notice here, my female colleagues are often call Miss when they are Dr. and the males are called Dr., and sometimes are just Mr.  So, go with that the DR!  You earned it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 06, 2017, 07:24:27 PM
tybec -- I used to say that I'd only make people I didn't like have to call me Dr.; the rest could use it if they liked :) I answer the phone with it when there's a telemarketer on the line! Ha!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on March 06, 2017, 08:00:44 PM
I choose Ms....and widow  on any forms.
i teach and students always call me Miss.....hey at least it makes me feel young.

I like that blog post way better then the one that referred to a "former widow " that was just weird.

Tybec that was nice to receive the card.....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: calimom on March 06, 2017, 11:58:57 PM
My husband is dead, so I'm considered a widow to the IRS, my bank, my kids' schools etc. I do have a long time gentleman friend, which is of  mild interest only to my friends and family, not so much to the IRS, my bank, my kids' schools, etc. If we were to marry, which we're not interested in doing, then I would be married, and considered by anyone interested that I was someone who was once widowed. My belief is that your marital status is what you currently are, not what you once were - although it's part of the narrative, no doubt.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: momtokam on March 07, 2017, 12:18:12 AM
Ms here too. Mrs doesn't seem right anymore, especially if I am trying to date. To me Mrs says still married and I'm not. I teach also and I go by Ms. I feel it's more ambiguous  and no one needs to know what my martial status is.
I also mark widowed if the option exists. It's what I am.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on March 07, 2017, 06:49:26 AM
I check widowed because that is what I am, and I don't like when it's not an option.  I still go by Mrs. because my last name is DH's lastname.  Very early on my mom (who is also a widow) sent me a card addressed to Ms. This led to a big discussion between us.  She prefers Ms. and for me it feels like a punch in the stomach. 

In September I will become "married" again and  "Mrs." will be easy but the last name will be more difficult.  I'm having trouble thinking about giving up my children's last name even though I will proudly take on finance's last name.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: TooSoon on March 07, 2017, 07:22:48 AM
tybec -- I used to say that I'd only make people I didn't like have to call me Dr.; the rest could use it if they liked :) I answer the phone with it when there's a telemarketer on the line! Ha!

I used to be embarrassed when people referred to me as Dr.  Not anymore!  The only time I never use it is in making airline reservations - because I am emphatically NOT that kind of Dr.  I agree - you earned it! 

And my daughter and I are keeping our name (I got remarried the week before last).  It's both personal and professional.  That I even took my husband's name was a surprise to many people but it did move me from the very the bottom to the very top of the alphabet which has its perks after 35 years with a Z last name! 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 07, 2017, 11:56:41 AM
Thanks all! The name thing is very interesting as well. I gave up my maiden and as time went on, I wished I hadn't. I took my first husband's name, which is my son's last name. When I got remarried, I hyphenated. If God would have it that I marry again, I have imagined that I would abbreviate the two hyphenated names in place of a middle name or initial.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 09, 2017, 11:56:00 PM
NG and I passed a year last weekend.  Been talking long term since Dec.  NG told me Sunday he would marry me, but not legally.  His ex is likely narcissistic.  He is a retired 20 yr. vet.  My LH was a vet.  I have veterans' benefits I will lose if I remarry.  He states he does not want to comingle our finances with a legal marriage /contract as he is concerned about this and his divorce situation.  I want to protect my son's benefits.  I told him to talk to his pastor and he did Monday and the pastor said no he could not.  My friend, a pastor's wife, said her husband would not either, but she wasn't sure of the details as to why.  He is a senior community pastor and is asked by widowed elderly folks who do not want or cannot lose their late spouse's pensions, etc. if they marry again. So, long engagement, 11 yrs. 2 months to when his youngest turns 18?  This makes me sad.  My LH did not plan or be a vet to stop me from moving forward if he died.  Yet here I am.  Read a blog of a police officer's widow.  Same boat.  Can't remarry or lose her husband's death benefits she received after his demise on the job.  Who knew?  I want to share what I have, but the benefits tied is a lot to risk losing or to give up.  :-[
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 10, 2017, 12:14:18 AM
Oh tybec. So sorry. Maybe a Unitarian pastor? You could look online in your area as well. I think there is another ordination that is real but nondenominational that a number of folks have gotten in order to preside over gay marriages. Just a thought.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on March 10, 2017, 07:39:47 AM
I can see why a pastor would not be able to do a "non-legal" marriage. They might see it as trying to cheat the system, or double dip or something? Idk, that's my thought. Still not sure on the marrying thing either. It sucks to have to think about losing dh's survivor's benefits, the insurance benefits, etc. I get if NG and I do marry.

I would love to just live together for a couple, few years, if he gives me a ring first, lol. But my parents would probably die of a heart attack or disown me if I went that way. They're pretty traditional, religious types. I guess it would be their loss though if they chose to be so selfish as to do that.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 10, 2017, 10:23:52 AM
The benefit of marrying someone with nothing ... my LH had been retired because of health for quite a few years prior to dying. We'd had to stop paying life insurance for him a while ago, but when he ended up in hospital in 2015, I got a policy again. It was enough to cremate him. The property, cars, and all that have always been in just my name. I am trying to rebuild my finances and get on a more solid footing so I am a better catch LOL.

I lived with both my husbands before marriage. The first time, my mom, who is quite traditional, nearly had a cow. She wasn't thrilled the second time around either, but has stopped trying to convince me to live life the way she thinks I should after realizing that I haven't done so bad in the big picture.

I'd like to marry again if that's in the cards. I enjoy sharing my life with someone and think I am a good partner.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: calimom on March 10, 2017, 11:47:13 PM
NG and I passed a year last weekend.  Been talking long term since Dec.  NG told me Sunday he would marry me, but not legally.  His ex is likely narcissistic.  He is a retired 20 yr. vet.  My LH was a vet.  I have veterans' benefits I will lose if I remarry.  He states he does not want to comingle our finances with a legal marriage /contract as he is concerned about this and his divorce situation.  I want to protect my son's benefits.  I told him to talk to his pastor and he did Monday and the pastor said no he could not.  My friend, a pastor's wife, said her husband would not either, but she wasn't sure of the details as to why.  He is a senior community pastor and is asked by widowed elderly folks who do not want or cannot lose their late spouse's pensions, etc. if they marry again. So, long engagement, 11 yrs. 2 months to when his youngest turns 18?  This makes me sad.  My LH did not plan or be a vet to stop me from moving forward if he died.  Yet here I am.  Read a blog of a police officer's widow.  Same boat.  Can't remarry or lose her husband's death benefits she received after his demise on the job.  Who knew?  I want to share what I have, but the benefits tied is a lot to risk losing or to give up.  :-[

Getting married, but not legally, sounds mildly insane.

Marriage laws vary state by state, but it seems like any even borderline ethical clergy person would likely not "marry" a couple and not file the certificate. Please understand that your child's benefits from your late husband would remain intact, but most institutions (Social Security, VA, pensions) would eliminate the spousal portion.

Your options would be:

1) Live together in delicious, delicious sin. Who cares who society and your church think? You could still get the Gubmint Cheese.

2) Marry legally. This might require scaling back and downsizing and getting a job on your part. Not easy if you're a spouse who's never worked or hasn't been employed for a long time. But there would likely be economies by joining households. Maybe  NG could step up to the plate a bit.

As they say, you can have anything, but you just can't have everything. Pick what works best.

3) Keep the status quo. What's wrong with that?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 11, 2017, 03:31:48 PM
calimom -- it depends on the denomination and purpose of the ceremony. For some, the financial aspects are not the issue, it's the commitment. In some religions, there are cultural ceremonies and the legal (with a certificate, by a priest, pastor, rabbi, imam, or municipal officiant) is separate. LH and I used to worship at a church that had many members who were born in various West African nations; they nearly always had two ceremonies -- the cultural one and then one at the court house. Some didn't do the one with the license.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on March 11, 2017, 06:34:03 PM
tybec   Sorry to hear this- sigh.   Sadly I know several in the same predicament, choosing to live together with plans of a possible marriage sometime in the future. 

Although I'm grateful to have continuing medical insurance thru DH's old company, it would lapse if I ever marry again.  It just doesn't seem right.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 11, 2017, 07:03:05 PM
From my NG:  It will all work out. 

We will marry but the when is not scheduled.  I want a Christian marriage, and I didn't think much about a legal contract which is what the government has you do. Ask a divorced person what happens when they divorce and the courts are involved.  There is nothing loving about all that, just business.  I was only 21 for my  first marriage, with nothing but hope and dreams.  21 years of marriage later, and all washed out in the end.  Never thought about the legal versus religious aspect being separate. Too young to understand.  But I do now.  Isn't that how it is supposed to be?  Separation of church and state? 

It will all work out, even if I am mildly insane   ;)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 11, 2017, 07:30:55 PM
Another junior high moment today. A neighbor-friend asked me if I would mind feeding her dogs for a few days at the end of the month while her family go on a short vacation; my cars are broken down and she has been more than caring to me (carrying me to the market, refusing to take any gas money), so of course I said yes. Also, her one dog is the brother to my boy pup and I am determined to make friends with him since he is my doggie nephew lol. We were supposed to meet up this morning so I could feed them while she is home. NG was over last night and we were outside, enjoying the weather after coffee this morning when my neighbor drove by. She stopped and said I could come down when she got back from taking her daughter to choir practice; some time ago, another neighbor came walking by with her dog. I stepped out to say hi (more to pet the dog) and as I did, that neighbor looked me up and down and said loudly, 'Boy, you are looking sexy today!' I was totally mortified as NG was in earshot and as such, I didn't introduce them. Fast forward to today and I made a quick intro (since my friend was in her car at the curb) and then explained who she was to NG when she pulled off. I immediately thought of the first neighbor and it was all I could do to not giggle.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 12, 2017, 12:05:25 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBm4sRXz5Fo
 ;)

Not sure if this will come up, but Arneal, I couldn't get this song out of my head after reading your post!  My 13 yr. old son is mortified I played it.  But thanks for lightening up the thread!  Get your sexy back!   ::)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 12, 2017, 01:40:52 PM
Thanks tybec! That was great -- made me laugh out loud. Here's another one to bring smiles:
https://youtu.be/sG5VMlGF4Vg (https://youtu.be/sG5VMlGF4Vg)

Itchy palms and sweaty feet! Ha!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Forgottenwife on March 12, 2017, 03:29:02 PM
NG and I passed a year last weekend.  Been talking long term since Dec.  NG told me Sunday he would marry me, but not legally.  His ex is likely narcissistic.  He is a retired 20 yr. vet.  My LH was a vet.  I have veterans' benefits I will lose if I remarry.  He states he does not want to comingle our finances with a legal marriage /contract as he is concerned about this and his divorce situation.  I want to protect my son's benefits.  I told him to talk to his pastor and he did Monday and the pastor said no he could not.  My friend, a pastor's wife, said her husband would not either, but she wasn't sure of the details as to why.  He is a senior community pastor and is asked by widowed elderly folks who do not want or cannot lose their late spouse's pensions, etc. if they marry again. So, long engagement, 11 yrs. 2 months to when his youngest turns 18?  This makes me sad.  My LH did not plan or be a vet to stop me from moving forward if he died.  Yet here I am.  Read a blog of a police officer's widow.  Same boat.  Can't remarry or lose her husband's death benefits she received after his demise on the job.  Who knew?  I want to share what I have, but the benefits tied is a lot to risk losing or to give up.  :-[

This is a tricky situation. Although our hearts may want a legal marriage, it may be in your best interests not to marry legally. I consulted a lawyer who laid out all the options regarding pensions and benefits if I re-married or did not, it was money well spent. If you do marry, and your new husband returns to court for any reason with his ex, your income will be included as total household income. This includes any ss benefit for your son. I don't necessarily think this is fair, just telling you what I was advised and unfortunately witnessed in a friends divorce.

I'm cohabitating with someone that isn't interested in legal marriage too - as hard as that is to hear, it turns out to be in my best interests legally in some ways. I know there are people that are saying we are cheating the government or whatever, I completely disagree. There isn't any reason we shouldn't look our for the best interests of our child and ourselves.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: serpico on March 12, 2017, 05:37:48 PM
Who cares who society and your church think?

I can think of plenty of people who care what their church thinks. It's certainly a fair consideration.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 12, 2017, 08:44:40 PM
Forgotten - it all comes down to location as well. My son's ss was not considered when LHs ex went through all her changes. But you make a great point. Serpico - I had church folks clicking their tongues at me when I was living with each husband before marriage. It was quite satisfying, truth be told, to see their faces after we had gotten married :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: calimom on March 13, 2017, 12:03:04 AM
Who cares who society and your church think?

I can think of plenty of people who care what their church thinks. It's certainly a fair consideration.

Point taken, and certainly some families and churches are less than flexible when hearing the news that two adults are living together. Still, a straightforward announcement of such seems like a better path than going  through with a church wedding which then goes unrecorded.

The US seems pretty strict about legal weddings. Other cultures, as Arneal noted, have different traditions. Italy, also, has a civil and religious weddings, where (I think) couples can do one or the other, or both.

There can be some absolute economic benefits to being married. My mother was widowed at a relatively young age, and married a widower after 14 years. My mom had it together financially but post marriage was in a far better medical plan, and would receive her second husbands pension if he predeceases her. So there's that, plus taxes and insurance that can favor the married.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: oneoftwo on March 13, 2017, 10:30:02 AM
FYI- Some jurisdictions recognize 'de facto' or 'common law' marriages as legal unions.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: wecouldbeheros on March 13, 2017, 10:49:05 AM

I can think of plenty of people who care what their church thinks. It's certainly a fair consideration.
[/quote]

Never did care what others ever thought, they wanted me to change my religion, although my Daughter did it, not for me.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 13, 2017, 09:36:35 PM
A bit of levity:

I've shared that my son (who will be 22 this month) lives in a semi-independent home since he is on the autism spectrum. I told him I was dating toward the end of last year; he doesn't keep in touch much but since it's his birthday month he wanted to troll for gifts lol. Anyway, he asked me how NG was doing. I said he was good. Son says, 'Tell him I am praying for him'. All I could do was laugh when I hung up the phone!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on March 14, 2017, 11:04:48 AM

Getting married, but not legally, sounds mildly insane.

Marriage laws vary state by state, but it seems like any even borderline ethical clergy person would likely not "marry" a couple and not file the certificate. [/quote]

I don't see how this is unethical at all. If they consider marriage a spiritual pact, a sacrament, then what does that have to do with the government?


1) Live together in delicious, delicious sin. Who cares who society and your church think? You could still get the Gubmint Cheese.

2) Marry legally. This might require scaling back and downsizing and getting a job on your part. Not easy if you're a spouse who's never worked or hasn't been employed for a long time. But there would likely be economies by joining households. Maybe  NG could step up to the plate a bit.

[/quote]
These comments imply that there is laziness involved. I don't think it's a matter of either her or new guy stepping up to the plate. Tybec's husband made a sacrifice in serving - he gave his time and efforts at personal risk. As his wife, she paid into that account too. Her posts regularly state how important her spirituality is to her. Her husband earned that money; it was his, and now it's hers. I don't see why she should have to sacrifice what is rightfully hers to practice her faith. There is no reason to believe that NG is not able or willing to contribute fairly to their combined household. It's an unfair accusation, and what's more it has no bearing on whether she is entitled to money her husband earned.

My husband did not have a pension that was structured this way; I received a payout of his retirement. My boyfriend and I have not discussed marriage too much, but you can bet if it made more financial sense to stay unmarried legally that is what we would do. I work full time so I don't collect Dan's SS. It just wouldn't be enough, and I need to keep my career momentum going; I wouldn't just be able to jump back in when DD turns 16. But if I did, I would absolutely stay unmarried to keep it. That is his money. He earned it. However there may come a time when we decide to make a more emotional, or spiritual if you will, commitment. I don't see an issue with keeping that outside of the government's purview. That's not cheating the system in my opinion. It's our business. If people can have open marriages and still be entitled to spousal rights, surviving spouses should keep theirs regardless of their spiritual decisions. And frankly, considering how the government spends it's (our) money, they can afford to pay the widow of a man who served his country what he earned regardless of her spiritual decisions.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MR on March 14, 2017, 11:27:58 AM
Hi Tybec,
Sorry to hear about the situation. Is it possible for you to marry in another state or country or islands. This might help in getting legally married and also keeping your benefits. Just my 2 cents.

Thanks
Manoj
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on March 20, 2017, 12:53:17 PM
Quiet here - hope that everybody's budding relationships are going well and may be beginning to blossom.   ;)


When I started getting serious about dating - intentionally giving effort in finding somebody - I began to experience some pretty significant grief episodes.  Not like the early dark days, but a general feeling of being really down, having crying spells, and being super sensitive about things that normally don't bother me. 


Has anybody else dealt with this?  There's not yet anybody that I'm seeing seriously, but NG that I see on occasion is getting the brunt of some of my funky moods and I feel badly about it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 20, 2017, 03:56:54 PM
Hi, trying -- so sorry about your down times. I have been in a strange place off and on with what I guess is grief. LH has been gone more than a year now; so hard to believe it! I got a telephone call about a week and a half ago from one of his more distant friends who didn't know. It was weird. I just took down the Jewish condolence prayer from a dear friend of mine and the Doggie 10 Commandments that I'd had on the fridge (I got the condolence prayer right after LH died and the 10 Commandments were from when our first dog had to be put down a few years ago). I was tired of seeing sad things around me. I had an anxiety moment the last time I spoke to my stepdaughter because she is still talking about coming out here; she wants some copies of photos and things -- I didn't say on the telephone, but they are all packed up in a cabinet in the garage with all her stuff and she can have them, no need to make copies. I have my own way of remembering. There is a memorial space in my house that has LHs photo, along with my dad and other older relatives who are gone now.

I am looking ahead to what I hope to do to commemorate the year that I've known NG, which will be Memorial Day weekend. I saw a dating thing the other day where the 'guru' talked about not planning for this coming weekend's date but for that date a few months from now. He wasn't trying to say we shouldn't plan for the upcoming, but to basically stay on our toes :) I like that idea ... looking forward, planning for a new future, while the scars continue to heal. They sometimes get raw, but healing they are ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 20, 2017, 06:35:15 PM
trying2breathe,

I understand what you are stating.  I just went through the 5 yr. sadiversary, and it is sad.  And now it is not that I yearn for DH.  I have accepted I can't have him.  But it is still the loss of the life I had with him, all the collateral. 

And I moved my mother to a memory care/personal care home last week.  Last week was awful preparing, as it reminded me of my father's move due to early onset Alzheimer's.  Now, my mother is 88, vascular issues, heart and diabetes, so different reasons for dementia, but still.  And all weekend and today was spent closing down her condo, like taking care of DH's things.  She isn't dead, but it feels similar, erasing her life, just throwing and giving away her things she accumulated all those years.  So, I have been sad, told NG this.  I know he is patient and thank him for that, as my life is so full of sadness so much.  He has his divorce drama, but it is different.  So, yes, more grief stuff.

On a more positive note, DH met another brother, so that is two out of three.  Moving forward with him.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 20, 2017, 06:44:28 PM
Great point, tybec -- if we can have those difficult conversations with the new people in our lives, especially if they have not been through anything like this, hopefully helps.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on March 21, 2017, 05:10:50 PM
I appreciate the responses.  Dealing with deep grief issues now feels strange.  At 3-1/2 years out I've accepted that DH is gone but I've been dealing with some pretty sad days lately.   I'm also dealing with aging parents and the issues surrounding it, and this too brings me down. 


arneal  I imagine that it is weird to explain a year+ out to a friend that your DH has died. 
"stay on our toes I like that idea ... looking forward, planning for a new future, while the scars continue to heal. They sometimes get raw, but healing they are ..."         ^^^ love this! 



tybec The loss of the life I once had with him is what I miss most.  It seems I miss this more than I miss DH now. 


I may talk about grief with the guy that I'm seeing as there are times when I feel that an explanation for why I act the way I do is warranted. He may run, but oh well  :o  such is the dating life of a wid I guess!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on March 25, 2017, 09:42:12 AM
Well this took some pressure off:

I have been really worried I would accidentally call my boyfriend Dan. I've done it when talking about him, but so far never addressed him as Dan. Last night we were on the phone and he called me by his ex's name​. The two them have a daughter and there are some legal things going on between them over that. He explained that he was looking at some paperwork with her name on it. So I confessed my fear of calling him Dan. He said he was embarrassed and mortified. Interestingly, he thought calling me by her name was worse than me calling him Dan's. He said it was better to be called by the name of someone who was thought very highly of. Anyway, I teased him a bit about it and that was it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on March 25, 2017, 10:19:35 AM
Good share, MrsDan.  Yup, 28 yrs of saying DH's name, and I worried.  That hasn't happened, but since I work with kids, I say "buddy" and "sweetie" to the littles.  Buddy to my son, too.  I slipped and said that to NG, and he told me quickly he was not my son.  I slipped and said "babe" to my son, and he quickly said he is not my "babe.".  Never had this quandary before.  Budding relationships indeed.... ???
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on March 25, 2017, 12:42:45 PM
Thanks, MrsDan and tybec! I rarely use LH's name in any context. I will do so when I talk to some people -- I have a cousin who has been widowed three times, so she gets it; I say it to my mom sometimes; and to one of my closest friends who was also widowed -- but I don't think I've ever even mentioned his name around NG. I have two photos up (one of just him near photos of my dad, grandmother, and other deceased relatives and one with him, me, and my son at a friend's wedding) but we've never talked about them. I used to have a lot more but it never fazed NG when he was here. I took them down because I was ready. As far as referring to NG, I use his first name when I text or sometimes when we are on the phone as he does for me. We also use 'hey' a lot :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on March 27, 2017, 08:15:16 PM
I talk about my LH  and use his name when ever the conversation goes to the past . And when NG and I are trying to discover each other , it does often. I talk about LH to friends when ever I'm telling stories...I don't think I dwell but it just comes up.

 I can imagine I might do a  name mix up.....as I have only had a  relationship with two people and they were both named Mike....NG is not Mike!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on April 01, 2017, 01:38:56 PM
NG brought me roses last night, just because. It is nice to feel so loved, something I never really had with DH.

My life is taking a big change in the next couple months. I had moved out to the country to be near my parents to help with the kids after DH died 4 years ago. I have found I despise living in the country. So I took the initiative to change the situation. I feel bad to move the kids yet again, but I think this will be good for them. Better school district, more opportunities for jobs, etc as they get into the teen years.

The town I'm moving to is also where NG lives so instead of being 17 miles apart we will only be about 1 mile. It will make things so much easier and I will feel less guilty when I go out and leave the kids home. It probably looks to some like I'm purposely moving to be closer to NG, but that isn't my MO at all. It's just another benefit. Right now I am about 40 minutes away from any shopping, activities, etc, the move will bring me about 15 minutes away. So much easier.

Hoping it all works out, I'm selling a house that's new with no "projects", for a house that is older and will need some fixing up. I can handle it though. I need projects and things to look forward to doing to keep me busy. I get depressed sitting here in small town USA.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 01, 2017, 02:43:56 PM
Good for you, daysofelijiah!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 02, 2017, 05:37:35 PM
Got my mother moved to her personal care/memory care home 2 weeks ago.  Now, started looking at houses in the same town, talked to realtor, and will start working on my house to sell.  DS is coming to terms with moving, making plans to see friends over holidays, asking questions about a new church, school, etc. 

I am looking for home for NG, me and DS, his kids on the scheduled times.  I asked him if I was to look for one for me and my son or our families. This is where we are.  Although his pastor won't marry us, a conversation with my brother, Phd Marriage and Family Therapist, college prof., Masters in Divinity, and my admired elder in his marriage and rearing of his kids, has me not feeling so crazy.  He said he has talked with his wife of 40 yrs about the benefits and negatives of being married and his retirement.  They will not divorce to change their situation, but even he said I have to consider my assets for my son and me and not allow them to be somehow legally be involved in NG'S crazy ex's hands in anyway.  I couldn't believe he said that, but he has looked at many angles, counseled many couples, etc.  So, he has lots of wisdom I haven't obtained. Anyway.   

Moving forward.   :D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 02, 2017, 07:09:35 PM
tybec -- ah, the 'fun' of crazy ex'es ... My LH and I lived together for a few years while he got his divorce finalized. When we moved in together, he was renting a house for his father and his daughter (who lived with the ex). I then bought a house, which was in just my name (we weren't married, after all). Even after we got married, we didn't intermingle stuff like that. I bought the house I am in now -- just me. I think he suspected that a day might come when I would be on my own and by not having us on the paperwork together, nothing had to be done ... Sigh. The things we need to consider.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 13, 2017, 08:35:41 PM
Hey there, fellow 'budders' (as I live in California, that could have multiple meanings!  ;D):
Popping in to see how everyone is doing. Funny how the longer we are connected to someone, the more interesting things we learn. I had one of those clingy moments last year when NG sort of dropped from the radar for about a week; it was if I remember around this time of year and I went into a panic. I really liked him and was praying he hadn't ghosted. He came back to his usual self and said he'd just needed some time to shut down (a bit of depression it seemed). Fast forward to now: he had a small injury last week and sort of vanished again. We communicated last weekend when I offered to pop over there (he usually comes to my house, but the last time he didn't feel well he said he'd wished I could come over there but I wasn't able to). He wasn't up to it and suggested we try for the next day -- I left it at 'if you feel up to it, let me know'. Didn't hear anything from him so on went my week. It's been silence all this week but I haven't reached out like I did last year. I am trying to live out the advice I've read about keeping on with my daily ordinary stuff. But it's hard, I tell ya as I want to see him. Sigh. Here's hoping we meet up this weekend ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on April 14, 2017, 08:38:23 AM
oh Arneal , that sounds difficult......you are a more patient person then I.
I'm having to adjust my communication expectations with my new guy.....he's not much of a texter.

 The way I like to date seems to be to see my guy once during the week and the a couple of times during the weekend. For me at the moment , that is enough face to face time. With work and tracking/dealing with my sons( they are older and don't really need taken care off but they're also not truly independant) and taking care of my house, that amount of time is just about perfect. 

The thing is I want to stay connected on days when I don't see him......just a how's your day?...etc.  I would like to do this by text. Alas he doesn't pay attention to his phone or doesn't realize when I say goodmorning, that I'd like to hear back from him.  I know it's a little thing  but it's hard to adjust, in my last relationship I was getting that constant connection sometimes only a goodmorning and goodnight but usually some other little communication.

I liked that ....I'm trying to adjust my expectation from new guy....but I'll admit I'm trying to change him into a texter too :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 14, 2017, 10:27:32 AM
Uggh, Arneal.  That is SO hard.  Not wanting to be clingy or needy but also wanting some kind of connection.  Not sure the best path for you and him.  You are getting to know him.  A year dating in May, right? 

I noticed with my NG pretty soon that when he had his children for extended times, like spring break and his mother came in from TX to watch them each break as he works, he wouldn't connect with me.  After talking to me nightly for almost 2 months, I was put out as his pattern changed.  Also,  with DH dying in a car accident, no contact triggers things for me, too.

So, told him pretty earlier on (3 months)  I needed some form of contact and with texting, a few seconds isn't too much to ask.  He agreed.

Then it happened a couple other times.  In just Jan., I sent him an email stating that if he loved me as he said he did, I didn't understand how he could go a day or more with no contact.  And if he could, then maybe he needed to evaluate his feelings for me, as in my experience with loving someone {and loss}, you don't want to go that long with no contact. He is a vet, so I said, you aren't deployed, you aren't without ability to contact me, like no signal.  He quickly apologized and noted I was right.  I don't know if being single for 4 years or being military for years made it "easier" to just not communicate, but there are no  reasons now. Even military can skype.  Only training in the field and true mission work keeps you from a connection now.  So he is better.  He may not say much, a quick text, but something.  I knew putting it to the wall in Jan. could lead to a change in the relationship but I knew what I needed and expected, which was not much, truly.

Oh, he did note that he always contacted me.  This was true.  I felt he needed to do so, maybe old school.  So, I now will reach out to him, and he appreciates that.  And it isn't about being needy, but both of us reaching out to each other. 

Navigating the waters!  OY! 

I hope you and NG work out a system that is workable for you both.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on April 14, 2017, 11:41:20 AM
Communication is hard. I almost always let NG initiate, even two years into it. The vast majority of our communication is by text, but we see each other in person 5-6 days of the week now too. Things have stepped up in that area to the point where I'm a little glad to get a day off to myself 1-2 times a week.

I'm lucky that he hasn't gone a day since day 1 without at least a good morning & sweet dreams text. I tried to take a couple days off one weekend last summer when we were having some issues but we couldn't even make it a day.

Us having dealt with the loss of our spouses it's understandable that a day w/o contact can be worrisome, even panic causing. It's a hard line between needing contact and being smothering. Making your feeling clear to your NG's and why you feel that way sounds like the best way to go about it.

I am typically the "needy" one in the relationship, but NG is just as needy as me as far as communication, so we smother each other, and like it for the most part, lol.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 14, 2017, 12:38:03 PM
Thanks, tybec and daysofelijah. I just couldn't stand it and ended up posting a message to him on social media  :P I had posted a couple weeks ago asking for ideas for Easter dinner; he replied first with a crazy response, to which I had replied that I would be welcome to try it if he cooked. Last night, I basically made a joke about what was cooking. He replied almost right away that he was thinking of a meal that he had promised to cook for me. I replied to say I had no problem inviting myself and bringing a side or dessert and he asked for brownies. We'll see as now I'll leave it go and wait for the real invite. I am on my way to the store to get groceries anyway and plan to cook for myself. I have a standing invite with friends as well. My mom was asking what I was going to do and I told her part of the story; she asked if I was cooking and when I said yes, she was like, yeah -- that's how we always do, go out but cook at home as well  ;D

NG and I typically connect every couple days on social media and privately at the end of the week as he works a lot. I'm not particularly needy and as such am not sure how to navigate the whole situation. He is a slow mover in general from what I understand of his past relationships, which is okay. We both like our own spaces. I am not adverse to sharing if the opportunity arose.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on April 17, 2017, 08:30:27 PM
arneal   Hope that things get resolved with your NG.   Hugs ~
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 17, 2017, 09:04:14 PM
Hi, trying2breathe: thanks for checking in. Hoping you and everyone here had a good weekend. A tradition in my mom's family is to be sure you've cooked at your own house each holiday, even if you've been invited to someone else's. That way, when you come home, you have something to snack on :) I cooked on Saturday and NG came over then he cooked on Sunday. His daughter and her boyfriend were there as well, even though we didn't eat all together. Corny jr. high moment -- I tried not to giggle when she remembered my name :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 18, 2017, 12:39:44 AM
Very nice, Arneal.  Good Easter weekend.

Me and NG did not communicate well, and he had off Good Friday.  He may have told me but I doubt it as I would have planned things differently as my DS was in his town for a band competition that Thurs.  I could have arranged to go and gotten DS and stayed the night, visited him and then my mother, too.  Anyway, saw him Sat. as I saw my mother for Easter early.  He then decided to come and spend Easter afternoon with me and DS in my town, so it worked out.  Still working on communication.  Life time!

The drive is already getting tiresome.  House on the market by May.  Wow!  This is huge for me!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Sugarbell on April 18, 2017, 06:11:58 AM
Selling house typec is huge...but it was very liberating when we sold.

NG spent Easter afternoon/evening with my family. My parents really like him...-and they haven't liked anyone since DH died over 9 years ago. He had dinner with us, my brother even likes him.

I am supposed to meet his huge (and according to him) dysfunctional family in a few weeks. I can tell he's nervous that Iit might scare me off...Four siblings each with a ton of kids...they all live way outta town in the country. I'm into him...his family culture won't steer me away.

He comes over a few times a week when he doesn't have his daughter. On weekends when he has his daughter she's with us.

His ex is still nuts. She pulled too many stunts this weekend to mention-but she was furious that I helped her daughter pick out her Easter dress (daughter was in a sunrise Easter service and spoke at regular service)

I wish she would just go away. She telling anyone and everyone how hard it is on her kids adjusting to the fact that her Dad dumped her for another woman. Which he laughs at how delusional she is. I'm so done with crazy people...and he is so normal, stable and good hearted (not to mention HOT)

We are vacationing together at a lake house in June with all the kids.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on April 18, 2017, 06:57:34 AM
Thanks everyone for sharing about your Easter's! Mine was good, NG worked Saturday, but he stayed over Friday and Saturday nights. He helped me stuff Easter eggs for my kids on Saturday night and it just made me so happy, I've been doing it by myself for a few years now, it was nice to have him there.

Sunday we had dinner at my parents. It went just fine. I'm moving to NG's town in 6 weeks so I have been bringing loads of boxes over to his house to make less to move on moving day since I have to do it all in one day because of how the loans are working out. He is being very helpful, has two all the moving trailers and help to move all worked out for me.

We had a little argument last night about some little things. I still have a hard time with some stuff from earlier in our relationship and my insecurity causes me to bring it up sometimes, when I know I need to just let it go. That's hard. But he is patient and wants to make things right. I have to try harder to not dwell on my insecurities though.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on April 18, 2017, 07:44:03 AM
With widowhood that is that extra layer of blending that happens, there is his family, my family and late husband's family.  We had Easter at our house with all 5 of our combined kids, my mom, and late husband's whole family.  Fiancé was so great with all of it.  He helped with prep, making drinks and being host and clean up.  He may have had a little too much to drink to make the weirdness easier but I often have too much to drink when dealing with some of LH's family!  I am so grateful that he is accepting of this extra layer of blending because I can see where it could be difficult and we had some rough times early on with some family members accepting me dating.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 18, 2017, 03:29:37 PM
Thank you for that point, Trying -- the extra layer of LHs family is something I am still sort of dancing around. I sometimes mention my stepdaughter and I talk often about a cousin ... I haven't mentioned that she is actually LHs cousin because we are close. I also talk a bit about another cousin who lives in Texas but I think I said he was LHs cousin. LH had a very large family but they don't live out here so that isn't an issue. However, I think about if we get to a point of traveling back east together. He has a sister in Philly and all my relatives are in Jersey as are most of LHs. I know the first cousin I mentioned and probably my stepdaughter as well as a few others would want to see us. Only the cousin knows of NG with any detail. My mom knows of course. I don't know and honestly don't give it too much thought as we've only gone away together once and then only for an overnight within driving distance.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on April 18, 2017, 03:47:43 PM
Boyfriend and I had dinner with his brother, dad, and stepmom Saturday night and then with his brother, mom, stepdad, and my daughter on Sunday. DD and I did Easter morning by ourselves. I invited BF, but he is very busy right now. On the whole it was okay. But I know BF was missing his daughter, and holidays are always difficult on some level for me.

Dan's family has been very welcoming of my boyfriend. He and my BIL are very friendly, my BF came to my SIL's baby shower, he's invited to BIL's Coast Guard retirement this summer. And his family is great; they are very good to me and my daughter.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 20, 2017, 04:58:13 PM
Okay, I am embarrassed to post, but it is something I have never experienced. Feeling very high schoolish.  My NG had a GF in the state he resided about 6 months or so after his ex left him.  She and he were both rejected by their spouses, so a common sharing of loss.  They dated 18 months, were serious, spent lots of time together, family interactions.  There are FB pics.

She and he continued to talk often and maybe see each other when he moved several hours away.  She wouldn't move with him as her family and children's father were there, and he moved to be where his sons were taken by their mother. Jurisdiction changed to the new state as he waited too long to contest her moving them, and so he had to move, per the judge, if he wanted regular contact as the children started school. Their relationship did not end because their loved ended, it was the circumstances of it all.   

I married HS sweetheart.  No exs in my history.  NG's ex is FB friend. She posts to him, liking his pictures, commenting on any family event as she knew all them.  It has been 3 years now.  I know he is with me.  He has chosen me. I am his present and future. BUT it bothers me that she posts, making it known she is in his life and knows his family.  She is involved with a new guy, too.  So I guess the friendship is difficult for me to understand.

He told me on our 8th date he had called her and told her he was no longer going to talk to her as his emotional support as he had a new GF for that.  He never had to tell me that.  I never knew he was talking to her so much. 

I HATE that it bothers me.  But it does....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on April 20, 2017, 06:56:43 PM
tybec- it's terrible being jealous, isn't it? I hate it when I've let those feelings get the best of me. But I imagine since I've had a lot more experience dating than you have, these are fairly unknown feelings you are having to contend with, yes? I will try to be helpful by sharing a few things.

1) in my life, I have been friends with several exes. There was never any slip-ups afterwards or boundary-crossing. I think of all of them in purely platonic terms. Actually, one of my oldest, dearest, closest friends is an old hook-up.

2) One of my favorite people in my bf's group of friends is an ex-girlfriend of his. They dated in college and then again years later. We socialize at her house quite a bit and it's never been awkward because she is such a warm and loving person. Since my bf has never been married, and had a very active love life, I've actually socialized with a handful of his ex lovers.

3) I have felt some pretty intense jealousy towards the girlfriend he had right before me, for a number of reasons, that have all faded with time. We've been together almost 3 years.

The only way I'd be worried or apprehensive about it was if she wanted to maintain a friendship with him but have nothing whatsoever to do with you. In all my friendships with men, I have always tried my best to be friendly and as non-threatening as possible to their significant others.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 20, 2017, 11:45:41 PM
Thanks, Bunny.  That was very helpful.  I knew to take the high road, and the irrational jealous feelings are not the high road. I knew others had worked through this, and I sure don't want to be insecure with NG about her.  I mean, the woman wouldn't move, and he was moving to his sons, and it is just the way it was/is.  I do wish she would FB his mother as she tends to send messages through him to her.  I think when I move to his city, and we blend our families, she will lessen her comments, too.  I won't be socializing with her as she lives about 5 hours away.  He has let her go, and I know that.

Budding relationships.... all new stuff for wids!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: TooSoon on April 21, 2017, 07:10:19 AM
Tybec,  I had a weird relationship with my (married) best friend from high school while my husband was dying and immediately after.  It was mostly texting and it was mostly grounded in a lifelong friendship between two people in miserable circumstances who both just needed someone to lean on, though it wasn't exactly platonic.  It ended poorly but we remained friends.  He and his family have long since moved away - far away - but we have remained friends somehow.  He's like a brother to me.  I care deeply about him and his happiness and I know he has never stopped caring for M and me and he will always be invested in our well-being. 

I've been really open with Andy about all of this from the beginning.  It is just a fact - it happened, but even though whatever "that thing" was between us is long since over, we still care about each other.  We were thick as thieves in HS and have been friends since we were 14 years old.  It is truly a non-factor in my relationship now.  He checks in with me every couple of months or texts me when there's something in the news or some album or book comes out that he knows I would like (and vice versa) but that's about it now.

But I think your feelings are entirely normal.  I guess my point is this:  we're not 20 or 25.  We've all had "other lives" that have to be absorbed into our present realities.  If you both continue to be open about it, I agree with Bunny that it will probably fade over time.   
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 21, 2017, 08:34:32 AM
Happy Friday everyone!

Glad we have this space to 'talk out' the madness of new situations :)

One thing I have read pretty consistently is that for all this to work we need to have other things, like hobbies, to focus on. The idea is that if we don't have our own stuff to keep entertained with we can become needy or just boring.

Like TooSoon said so well, we aren't new to the world. What sorts of things, besides work, school, or being crazed about your new relationship (lol) are you doing?

I have become a kitchen maniac. I have tried more new recipes in the last year than I have in my whole life. My latest was grissini (Italian breadsticks) last night. I also called some friends who run a food bank and homeless ministry. LH and I used to volunteer there and I went back after he dies. Then they had to move and I had car issues but I have wanted to get back to it. I plan to be there tomorrow morning! I also go to the gym and have some friends there who are connected to me on social media too. NG watches the exchanges between me and my gym sisters and I also post about my local wildlife.

What sorts of hobbies have you either taken up or gotten back to since the death of your spouse or since finding a possible new partner?

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: TooSoon on April 21, 2017, 08:44:32 AM
Hey arneal, I like your recent post.  Do you want to start a separate thread along those lines and let this one remain about new relationships?  I have some thoughts but also kind of want this thread to remain intact since it has been a popular one.  What do you think?  Maybe in beyond active grieving?  Just a thought.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 21, 2017, 10:49:08 AM
Interesting idea! If you would like to start it please do, or I can do it later -- am about to go walking with the group in a few :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on April 22, 2017, 10:00:32 AM
I'm having flip flop problems...and no I'm not talking about sandles.

Sometimes I'm having a great time with my guy .....and sometimes his quirks bother me.......and since it's a new (4 month) relationship, I'm trying to decide whether I ride it out longer and see if the flipping and flopping subside ...or if I'm still flipping this far in...then it's not to be....

What to do ...what to do...

One thing that makes this more difficult for me, is he has been "all in" right from the beginning.....I've been honest the whole time telling him I'm not sure....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 22, 2017, 02:24:41 PM
Hi Klim and thanks for sharing. I guess it comes down to what you are willing to fall on a sword (for love) for. I mean, we should never settle but none of us is perfect. I think about if I get to a point of sharing space with my NG on a regular basis. I wonder about changes in routine to accommodate another human in the same space and all that. There are things I like to eat that he doesn't and vice versa. These are of course very mundane examples, but I am sure you can see where I am going. Couples have uncoupled over less :) I tend to be someone who adapts easily and I don't have many sword-worthy issues. I would say that it all boils down to communication. If he's really all-in, maybe he will be willing to fall on your sword more readily ;)
Hugs!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 22, 2017, 02:35:17 PM
Hey TooSoon: I started a new thread over on the Beyond Active Grieving board. It's called 'Creating a New Now' and I quoted what I posted above about hobbies and such. Hope you'll pop over and help get the conversation rolling with your ideas!!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on April 23, 2017, 07:22:17 PM
klim  I can relate, as I'm almost 3 months into a relationship where he says he's all in and I'm still not sure.  There are times when I feel that he's the best guy in the world, and other times when it feels off.  After a 20 year marriage, I realize that this is the way that it works with most if not all relationships, and it's been difficult to decipher what I'm willing to deal with or whether it's time to move on.   We all have quirks - for me it's trying to figure out what I'm willing to put up with.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 24, 2017, 02:36:03 PM
Happy Monday everyone!
Just posted over on that other thread about things we do to stay occupied and got sidetracked by something that seemed more appropriate here.

So in my readings about dating and identifying 'where you are' in the relationship, some of the so-called experts talk about the fact that love is often shown rather than said. The one in particular offered signs that a person is into you. The one thing that stuck out was when he or she leaves things at your house or apartment: it could be clothing, knicknacks, a toothbrush, or something. NG had brought a set of DVDs at one point -- they are sitting on top of my player in the living room (we never did finish watching them and when I asked if he wanted to take them back or if he wanted me to bring them, he said no and that we'd finish watching them one day ...). But the thing that I mentioned on the other thread that reminded me of this was the fact that he left a guitar here :) Talk about 'leaving a mark'! I can't miss it and when I dust, I have to dust the case, too because it's been here for such a time now LOL. Again, dating is so junior high.

Hope you all had a great weekend and will have a wonderful week!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 24, 2017, 02:52:55 PM
Interesting, Arneal.  I do my best to leave nothing.  He tried to give me his garage door opener fob, and I just wasn't ready for it.  He has my key codes for that and the alarm, and he comes on over, but it is very planned due to distance. 

He didn't want anything left at his house for a long time due to his young children, but it has been a year, so he is getting more lax.  Makes sense!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on April 24, 2017, 04:36:44 PM
BF gave me a key last summer, but that was mainly because I had to let his dog out one day, lol. He just recently started staying on the weekends, so leaves some clothes and a toothbrush here now.

I have about 30 boxes of stuff stored at his house currently, but that's just to help make moving day easier since I have to move everything in one day in a few weeks. Otherwise I don't leave much there, I've only spent the night there twice and that was last summer. I never get a kid free night with 4 kids.

This weekend was fantastic. Got a motorcycle ride in, he came to a family picnic with me and met some more of my extended family, and we had plenty of snuggle time.

There was one weird moment on Saturday night. His son (the one I made the other post about) got into a fight with his mom and her live in BF. So NG's ex kept calling to talk about everything with him (or more talk at him, while he just lets her rail on), she called 4 times in less than an hour. He has a hard time staying neutral on things between them (X and son), but he is doing better. I've never had to deal with the X before, so it was a little window into what a nut she is!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 25, 2017, 01:09:40 PM
daysofelijah -- NG just moved last weekend; I've only been to his place three times so I have nothing there. We spend time at my house as I live alone -- his youngest daughter lives with him and she doesn't clean up much, which drives him bananas :) It was funny the first time I went there: he said he has a house rule of no overnights because he doesn't want to encourage her boyfriend. However, he followed that with something like, 'I am sure the second I am away, he is here all night' and we laughed. Yet, the second time I visited, which was New Year's Eve, he encouraged me to stay. Go figure.
But I digress ... in the article I read (which I should try to find and post here for feedback), when one person or the other leaves things at the other's place, it is a way of planting some roots (for lack of a better way of putting it) which I found interesting, particularly in the context of how people show that they care.
I'll see if I can find that article!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 25, 2017, 11:11:00 PM
Had no luck finding that article. If I come across it, hopefully I will remember to post it  ;D

So here's another weird jr. high thing: for those of you early on, how often if ever do you ask the new person in your life for assistance? At some level, it's nice to be needed, right? But who wants to be with someone helpless, right? So last year, NG asked if I would drive him to the airport; he had gotten a new job (rabbit trail: in my education work, I have to edit PDF documents and such and I also like to work on computers so I keep lots of software applications. He asked me to help him fill out the docs and had no qualms about sending me his personal info to do so. When it came down to including references, he put me first, above his relatives and the friend who recommended him for the job -- giggle) and had to fly to the main office to pick up a work truck and drive it home. He stayed at my house for a couple days and I took him to the airport. I had to travel to a speaking engagement a couple months ago; I took a van service to and from the airport, which is what I typically do. However, I got hit with that lonely bug when I came home because 1) it was my first time traveling by air since LH died, 2) when I saw the familiar landmarks but was noticing them alone I felt it, and 3) walking out of the airport with no one to welcome me home was a very real moment. I wrote something about it on my social media and NG replied that he would have picked me up but I hadn't said anything. I replied that it was something I needed to go through (catharsis of a sort).

Fast forward to my telling him I have to travel; he said he would take me. I was going to just leave it go and not say anything since it's been about three weeks since we talked about it and since then we've had Easter and he and his daughter moved. I didn't want to be a pest, you know? However, I also didn't want to just leave and act like he hadn't made the offer. So I sent a text to ask if he'd be available to take me.  I honestly feel weird asking since I am used to doing these sorts of things for myself -- either driving myself or ordering the car or van service. Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on April 26, 2017, 07:55:46 AM
arneal, I have trouble asking anyone for help and in the early months (year?) of my post widow relationship it was very difficult for me to ask him for help.  It bothered him that I didn't ask since I easily offered help to him.  I realized it made him feel good to help me and slowly started asking and accepting his offers.  Now we are engaged and living together and are much more of a partnership but it was definitely a process for me to get to this point.

My advice would be to just ask, if he is unavailable you know you are capable of taking care of yourself.  Everyone likes to be needed!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 26, 2017, 12:19:42 PM
Thanks, trying -- he works in the technical field and I am a home-grown techie so he laughs regularly at my fixes around the house, like with my surround sound and a really tacky security camera I put up in my garage. I typically don't ask for help. So I did send the text, asking if he'd take me. He replied last night after I'd gone to bed to ask about my departure time. I sent it this morning; although he's still moving, he said he would and to call to remind him that morning.

Here's where my own angst kicks in: these days they tell you to get to the airport super-early to get through security; while I don't check bags and all that, I still do my best to get there early. It usually takes about 40 minutes to get from his place to mine and then another 20-ish minutes to the airport on a good day. If my flight leaves, say, at 12:30, I'd be at the airport and through security by 11 to 11:30. In my estimate, he'd need to leave his old place at 9:30 at the outside. From what I understand, the new place is a bit farther away, so there you go. He asked me to call him at 10. You know my reply was something like, I will probably call a pinch earlier since security and all  :P

I felt weird asking but am glad I did.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on April 26, 2017, 05:51:40 PM
I am very bad at asking for help.......and very bad at receiving offered help...

The"I can look after myself" attitude is very strong in me.

I'm also very bad at being a recipient of perks....
NG is doing well financially ...not extra extra loaded but feeling  very comfortable.
He has taken me out for some very expensive dinners and my birthday  present was way more costly then I would have expected as we had only been going out a couple of months.
The thing is  I like it  on some level  bit it also bothers me, as if he's trying to buy my love. Then I think it's just how he thinks...he's kinda a "go big or go home" type of guy in all things he does.

He has a couple of nice new cars and I drive an 11 yr old minivan. He keeps telling me I can borrow his nice car any time......I always say no.... It's part of my,I can look after myself, attitude.

Maybe it's time I tried letting that guard down a bit......
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 26, 2017, 10:33:26 PM
I hear you, klim! In the stuff I read about dating, that's a real thing. Men like being needed. They don't want a gold digger obviously but someone who is appreciative. When NG was on his way to Texas after taking his present job last fall, he said he would be driving back through Tucson. We'd been on a silly kick about who was ahead on points and prizes and I think I was in the lead after helping with his resume and so on for the job. He asked me what sort of prize I wanted and I commented that I had gotten a lovely piece of Hopi jewelry the last time I was in Tucson. When he got back and the very next time he came to my house, he was barely in the door before he whipped out this necklace box. I opened it and it was an Indigenous necklace and earrings. He said he got it in New Mexico and it was Zuni, not Hopi. However, I didn't argue :) It is lovely and I get lots of compliments on it. Indigenous jewelry is not cheap. And Christmas was similar.

For me, it was a matter of not having similar means. I know we aren't in a competition but still. We have always been good about splitting spending, like the one overnight we took together, I got the room and he paid for parking and dinner, which was more expensive than the room with all the food and drinks we had lol (we were at the beach). I cook quite a bit but he drives to my house. When we go out, he'll buy dinner and I'll pay for a movie. But on those times when I can do it all, I try to :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: maddalena on April 27, 2017, 10:16:52 AM
For me, it was lower your expectations.
My new guy is absolutely wonderful in many ways. But in SOME ways, he cannot even begin to compete. So I judge.
If I had married new guy in 1978 instead of DDH, I would probably not even notice these things.
It's never ever like the first time. Oh well, except when you are first in love and blind. that still worked for me.

You have to find a man who is understanding, because DDH is ALWAYS in the house. and NG will always know that.
so if he can't talk about it, if he can't understand why you are crying,  look for someone else.

I consider myself very very fortunate to wake up every morning with this man.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Sugarbell on April 27, 2017, 10:58:24 AM
I believe timing is everything too.

9.5 years widowed...over 5 years clean and sober....I am healed, whole, independent, capable.

Actually have something to offer...I was with past relationship over 2 years (and it wasn't bad-he was a good guy with good qualities but I knew he wasn't the one so I kept the wall a little up).

This is different. We connect, flow...it's easy. We get each other. He grounds me...he says I am his "peace".

It's early..we've met each other's families. He's done family dinner with my folks twice..gone to several of my sons baseball games. I don't ask for him for help...he just does it. It's weird it's so comfortable. Maybe because we both grew up here. It hasn't been this "easy" since I started dating DHs in my early 20s.

He's a country boy...he runs a 100 acre farm and works a full time job. This will be a Loooong time dating (because we both know we can't live together...he lives 25 miles outta town..I live one minute from the schools and it's easy with my kids stuff being close. But I'm not worried about all that stuff yet...I'm just really enjoying everything about him.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on April 27, 2017, 01:57:58 PM
Quote
For me, it was lower your expectations.
My new guy is absolutely wonderful in many ways. But in SOME ways, he cannot even begin to compete. So I judge.
If I had married new guy in 1978 instead of DDH, I would probably not even notice these things.
It's never ever like the first time. Oh well, except when you are first in love and blind. that still worked for me.

You have to find a man who is understanding, because DDH is ALWAYS in the house. and NG will always know that.
so if he can't talk about it, if he can't understand why you are crying,  look for someone else.

Oh, boy, this hit me.  I love NG.  He loves me.  He loves me, because so much of me is DH.  I can relate to him on so many levels because of DH.  I don't want to compare.  NG has to know he can't measure up to DH on lots of things.  I try to just concentrate that I am not who I was and NG is a new love, new life, and it is no comparison, therefore.

I do have some things come up.  NG had many gfs.  I don't want to even know.  I had DH since HS.  He says things to me like we would have had the most beautiful kids.  It is strange because I don't want to go there.  I had my child with DH, and would't want it any other way.  He tells me things like I am the best kisser he has ever had, and other things.  I don't know if men just say those things, or he really means it, but I can't say that to him.  I think it is apples to oranges in a comparison, so I don't.  I don't think about DH like I used to.  I am letting him go.  Anyway, random thoughts on budding relationships....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on April 27, 2017, 02:19:51 PM
I think because my first marriage was so traumatic, including the first husband's death, I learned not to compare. Second LH is like that sage voice in my head. I smile at times when I think of how he would think of my life without him. He told me that he did not want me to be alone for the rest of my life and used to fuss when I kept to myself too much; he'd tell me to be more open. I think of the person I am today, how I call the folks in the neighborhood stores my friends and talk to them, how they recognize me and treat me well, and of course how I go to the gym and especially how I've opened up to NG and know he'd be thrilled. I can see him smiling ... smirking actually, and imagine that he'd say something like, 'I told you so -- see how nice it is to be open with people?'  ::)

Second LH and NG are music folks; LH played professionally while NG does it for fun even though his dad was a professional musician. That's about the only thing they have in common. It's almost a 'be careful what you ask for' because while LH was all about being in the same space, NG is perfectly content to do his thing and not feel some type of way about who is doing what when we aren't together. He is very focused on his work and life, which is great -- after being with an abusive person the first time and being a caregiver the second, I am happy about that. When we are together, he is super attentive, even if he doesn't always remember small stuff like movies we've watched before lol. He does remember important things though, which is great. However, I can't be satisfied it seems since I like the freedom but wouldn't mind a bit more contact. I am resonating with what you said, Sugarbell, about getting to a place of personal wholeness. That is so important to me and the rest as they say, will follow. Or it won't. I can't worry about it and as such do more caring for myself, working, and doing my volunteer work again. It's all new and weird but good :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on May 01, 2017, 08:59:37 AM
Okay, may sound very juvenile here, but a quandary for me nevertheless.  I am not a materialistic person.  I married young, and had one checking account the entire marriage. We had nothing but hope, a college education which meant something 27 years ago, and each other. We lived comfortably, not extravagantly.

Move forward to NG.  He married at 30, and she was a professional, too.  Military, living in Europe.  They were DINKS, traveled everywhere.  Speak a couple languages each, etc.  She left after two kids and back in the states, took 75% of the assets, and NG is stretched.  I am okay financially due to DH planning well.  Not rich, but have some flexibility others don't have. 

NG shares more with me about his marriage.  He bought her jewelry galore, special pieces from their travels, the Mercedes they brought back to the states, trips, cruises, all kinds of things.  We go dutch often or trade off.  He has two kids to take care of.  I have my son.

But here is the rub.  I didn't date him for money or stuff.  Not me, but I do feel like he doesn't seem to show me some courtesy he did his wife.  Not his wife, I know.  But I don't see him doing that for me.  I don't want stuff, but I want to be "worthy" of his attention.    However, he has seemed to flip completely to the other side.  Like he wanted to prove himself to her by buying things, and such.  But now he is the opposite.  Not sure what I am saying here.  He married her 4 months of knowing her and states he didn't wait long enough to KNOW her.  We are already past a year.  I am evaluating my "love language" and seeing if that is the problem.  What I need, what he used to do for his ex and how to communicate what will meet my love language.  It is not gifts for me, but something more than what he is giving.  I guess the effort is the concern.  IDK Rambling.  Insecurities of dating..........
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 01, 2017, 10:10:32 AM
Thanks for sharing, tybec. Finances are a real thing and no, I don't think you're being juvenile at all. In the readings I've done, the one thing that has stood out is the notion that men tend to be a bit more concrete thinking than women. For a simple example, if you send a text but don't ask a question, you might not get a response because you've offered a statement that he might not read as needing an answer. Not to speak for your NG but maybe he doesn't spend like that now because 1) he looks back and sees the spending on the ex as something done in wasteful youth, 2) you don't come across as wanting any of that, 3) you don't seem to need him to spend as validation of how he feels about you. None of which are bad things.

Your comment about love language is perfect I think! How do you drop hints about maybe wanting a little pampering? It's not easy, especially if you aren't used to asking or talking about wanting things. I think I shared this story but it might be worth repeating here. Last year, NG and I got on a slightly competitive kick. It was silly things, like we awarded each other random 'points' for things. He posted something on social media about 'points for whoever knows XYZ'. I jumped on with a reply and he said I got it, to which I replied that I was drafting my list of desired prizes. That started it. By the time he was ready to travel for his job, I felt I had racked up quite a few points; when he said he had to drive through Tucson, I said he could feel free to bring me some Hopi jewelry :) I showed him the Hopi necklace I got a few years back when I was there. He did go through Tucson but bought a Zuni necklace and matching earrings in New Mexico. I didn't think he'd really bring anything but he did :)

Neither of us has a lot. His ex screwed him on their taxes and he's paying that back. The job has sometime lower hours. I am rebuilding my whole life after being widowed from a marriage to a retired musician who left here with no assets. Heck, I get excited when NG pays for dinner lol!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on May 01, 2017, 12:53:45 PM
Thanks for the info. & support, Arneal.  That is so thoughtful he got you the necklace and earrings!  Sweet.

Yup, just paying for dinner is a great gift.  A bottle of wine even if we are just at his place watching a movie.  He walks with me anytime I ask, after dinner.  That is great!  I almost wish I didn't know about his gifts for his ex.  But sharing is learning.

I want the Emergency Contact. I want the person who will meet me at the doctor's office if I need support.  I want a warmed up soup if I feel sick.  I want to go watch and listen to live music somewhere, often free at a park.  I want someone who will offer to do a honey do that I can't manage myself, which seems to be getting more and more.  :(

I want a bouquet of flowers from the grocery store for 10 bucks for no reason at all.  I don't want all the expensive things, as I know they don't comfort you in the long run.  I want time as I know it is not guaranteed.  I guess it is all about more communication, time to build the relationship.  And maybe I won't ask so many questions!   :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 01, 2017, 05:04:07 PM

I want the Emergency Contact. I want the person who will meet me at the doctor's office if I need support.  I want a warmed up soup if I feel sick.  I want to go watch and listen to live music somewhere, often free at a park.  I want someone who will offer to do a honey do that I can't manage myself, which seems to be getting more and more.  :(

I want a bouquet of flowers from the grocery store for 10 bucks for no reason at all.  I don't want all the expensive things, as I know they don't comfort you in the long run.  I want time as I know it is not guaranteed.  I guess it is all about more communication, time to build the relationship.  And maybe I won't ask so many questions!   :o

Yup, all of this. ^^^ Hit the nail on the head, tybec. 


Can you share this with him? 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on May 01, 2017, 05:23:15 PM
Divorce sure seems to leave people in the financial pit. That's where my NG is too. He also spent a lot of money, or maybe more turned a blind eye to her spending in order to keep the peace. We had a serious conversation yesterday about getting married and my concerns about his financial debt. I came right out and said what happens if you die in 10 years and I get left with all your debt? That question kind of took him aback, but that is my reality. I can't just blindly run into a life with him without plans to protect my financial future for me and for my kids.

I can see feeling a little bit of "resentment?" (maybe not the exact right word) for the way your NG used to buy stuff for his x, but maybe he wasn't even doing it to show he loved her, he was maybe just doing it to keep the peace and not out of love. That's how I look at NG's past.

It took NG forever to buy me flowers, over a year for sure, and I even got to the point where I asked for them and he balked at it saying he'd do it when he felt ready, not when he "had" to. I think he got "bullied" or guilted into buying stuff for the x, and didn't want that to be the case with us. Now he does it more often, but he is broke and I know he can't afford a lot. He tries hard in other ways though, fixes stuff for me at my house, loans me stuff from his work all the time (tables for garage sale, free rug doctor for the weekend, etc.). He has my move all set up with moving trailers and friends of his to help with the furniture, and is all excited planning projects to fix my new house up with me. It's learning his love language like you said. He helps, gives his time and uses the resources he has, and meets my needs that way.

I like to buy him stuff, his favorite mints or candy bars, pick him up a pair of jeans or a loaf of bread that he needs. He was uncomfortable with that at first, didn't like me buying him stuff. But he's learning that I like to do that for him, to show him I love him. It's working, but I had to re-evaluate what love means to me, he doesn't/can't show me love by buying me stuff.

Sorry I'm rambling, lol.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 01, 2017, 11:37:33 PM
daysofelijah -- you hit it with the divorce thing. I think people get tainted. It's not just divorce -- I was certainly tainted by my first marriage because of abuse. LH was tainted because of the financial thing and the way his ex treated him after they separated and divorced. NG is tainted because of feeling swindled by his ex, emotionally and financially. I was over there on Saturday and he mentioned that he got his stuff back from her; she was holding his personal items (I mean things as 'petty' as pillows and blankets ...) and finally gave them back. He had forgotten about all the stuff. His daughter got the items from her and told him that even at that moment, the ex was trying to get the daughter to side with her against her dad -- mind you, this woman is not his kid's mom! How do people even do that?!

Anyway, I don't push but hint from time to time. I make sure if we are going out that I have $$ and can offer to pick up the tab or just come outright and suggest that we do something and pay for it. At this age, I figure we need to split costs as neither of us has a real discretionary cash laying about. So far it's been good and when neither of us has it go out, one or the other of us has something to thaw and cook lol!

Like you, tybec, I'd like to have that feeling of support in more emotional yet tangible ways. I think often about emergency contact ... I don't have one. But the most personal 'favor' I've asked has been to drive me to the airport :) Let's see how things go when we've passed the one year mark at the end of May  ;D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Captains wife on May 02, 2017, 06:58:34 AM
Agreed divorce leaves men/people is a bad place all around. I feel bad when I see men financially destroyed by their marriage - personally, I've always stood on my own two feet financially. It's very important to me. Daysofelijah- my late husband had a lot of debt when we married and that concerned me. But I didn't take on any of his debt when he passsed away as I kept our finances seperate including filing seperate taxes. Agreed - that support and affection can be shown in many other ways besides lavish/gifts and dinners. Honestly it's the thoughtful gestures that really matter. I am not big on splitting bills but I do pick up the dinner or outing tab on many occasions - feel it is the right thing to do as partners. I'm also mindful of how expensive divorce is!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 06, 2017, 04:27:57 PM
Captainswife -- you bring up a great point about splitting bills. NG and I have never done that. It's been he pays or I pay and we try to be balanced about it. We've been honest -- neither of us has been ashamed to say we don't have any $$. In those cases, we'll sit at his place or mine and watch movies and cook. It's real life, as it should be.

The first husband tainted me from intermingling funds and my second husband had the whole ex and child support thing when we got together. Even after that was resolved, he was fine with me putting the big items like the house and vehicles exclusively in my name. It certainly made things simple when he died because he basically had no assets to divide or squabble over. As a musician and with retired with health problems, there wasn't going to be much anyway. Only a few years did we file taxes together, which was actually for my benefit :) I appreciate him and the things he taught me in our 16 years together more than I could ever say.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 06, 2017, 04:38:19 PM
Quick update :)

So I shared the quandary about asking NG to pick me up at the airport. It went well. He drove me there last Sunday and picked me up yesterday. This sort of piggy-backs on the $$ discussion; he shared that he to his surprise his check got garnished (short version: he knew the ex had done some shady stuff on his taxes and got a lawyer. He paid the lawyer and was under the impression that with the lawyer's assistance he would make payment arrangements so his check wouldn't get garnished. Something went awry and he's mad as a hornet -- gave a lot to the lawyer for what, so while he's working that out, he's short on cash) but asked if I wanted to stop and eat on the way from the airport. It was rush hour so getting off the road for a bit was a good idea. We stopped for burgers -- he paid. It was Cinqo de Mayo, so tequila was in order. He bought some. I offered to do dinner and a movie tonight if the contract payment I was expecting was in my waiting mail, which it was, so we'll do that tonight.

Long story short: I am glad I asked him to pick me up as it was nice to have somebody there. I appreciate that he would spend what he had, even with the difficulty.

How's everyone else doing out there in junior high land?  ;D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on May 06, 2017, 05:31:06 PM
Getting real!  Put house on the market this week!  Telling people we are moving.  DS is emotional, up and down about moving.  Honestly, I am, too.  My home of 22 yrs, house of almost 17.  I am going to truly end my world of DH and me.  No one will know him where I am moving.  33 yrs. as  US.  So strange. 

AND, a friend of mine, a former youth pastor that worked with my DH is an ordained Southern Baptist minister.  I knew he was Baptist.  Well, he is no longer in a role of a minister, as no church would allow him due to his views with women and gays.  I attended his surprise 50th last year, and it was at his sister's home with her wife.  So, I just thought he would be open to marrying without the legal requirements.  AND HE IS!  I called him this week.  He loved my husband, and loves God, and struggled with so many things over the past few years since he left ministry.  But he heard my story, knows me and is willing.  How about that!  So, time will tell on this.

First, sell house, move and adapt to new town, figure out my new career choices, and then pursue us further.  A year sooner than we talked, so no hurry.  Just get there and play it out.  WOW!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 07, 2017, 11:48:57 AM
tybec -- your post just brought tears to me. I am over the moon happy for you. If I could have given your post 100 hearts I would have.

I was just on a post from a newbie here. She was asking about when is too soon to date. And then I come here and read your post. I just said goodbye to NG about 20 minutes ago as he left my house. The world is so different for all of us, isn't it? Moment by moment, the changes add up and we move forward down the path of time. I pray for joy, love, and happiness for us all ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 07, 2017, 01:05:28 PM
Happy for you, tybec!  Here's to getting real  :D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 07, 2017, 02:26:28 PM
Hey guys and dolls -- advice needed!

So NG shared a story from his past in a moment of complete openness and vulnerability this morning. Something had happened that sparked the memory and I believe he needed validation. I replied in a way at the time that I felt was compassionate and empathetic, but am feeling now that I need to follow up at some point. If not today, maybe later in the week. I want to show support, to let him know that this is a safe space and that I hold what he says with respect and in confidence.

My question then is this: would saying something (even without mentioning the story) seem appropriate? I'm thinking a short text just to show I genuinely care about his overall well-being? I welcome your thoughts here.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on May 08, 2017, 06:15:27 AM
How about a simple text saying something like "trust and openness are such an important part of any relationship, I'm so glad I have found that with you".
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 08, 2017, 09:10:54 AM
I like that, Trying. He seems to get sensitive about things of the heart being made verbal :) I think I can sneak it in somewhere along the way this week.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 08, 2017, 10:41:25 AM
I like Trying's text - seems completely appropriate to mention him being open and vulnerable with you.  And it may keep the door open for him to continue in this way .....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 08, 2017, 11:14:30 AM
Would appreciate some thoughts on this - I'm having a dilemma with my "NG", he's not aware yet that I have a problem with this.

Back story - been seeing him for a little over 3 months, we see each other 3-4 times a week.   I'm dating others and he knows this, he wants an exclusive relationship and I've let him know I can't commit to that right now but he's willing to wait.   I have a great time with him, we have much in common and never have a lack of anything to say.  I've been on the fence on whether or not to just date him, wanting to get to know him more.

What happened yesterday might be a deal breaker.   We attended a music festival, lots of people, chaotic scene standing shoulder to shoulder trying to enjoy different bands.  I was fine, didn't feel uncomfortable being there, but he apparently didn't feel the same and got mean. To the point of yelling at others and almost getting into several fistfights.  I felt so out of place, was embarrassed by his behavior and apologetic to those around us.

I'm not sure if we can work through this, or if this is something that I should even bring up with him.  If this is his character, it isn't something that I think could be easily changed.  Should I mention to him that I was uncomfortable with his aggressive behavior?  I'm so turned off by his behavior that I'm not sure if I want to have a conversation with him about it.  If I break things off with him he will want to know why.
 
Any thoughts?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 08, 2017, 11:38:26 AM
trying2breathe -- having had an abusive situation with the first marriage, my radar went up first on your post. But taking a step back, I would be inclined to have a conversation if you've never seen this behavior in any other public situation. Some people do not do well in crowds; does he seem uncomfortable, like in the mall or a crowded restaurant or bar? Or do you and he mostly spend time alone so you wouldn't see how he is with others? Might he have been having a bad day?

Nonetheless, if he is looking to be exclusive, I would not let him off the hook by not talking about it, even if you aren't interested fully in being exclusive with him. One of the things the dating advice shares is that when we are trying to build relationship, not calling foul on crappy behavior gets us less respect from the one who's acting up. If you aren't sure about his behavior, go to a restaurant and make that your time together; don't go back home with him or have him back to your place. Talk over dinner. Bring it up as casual -- "Hey, I wanted to ask you about something I noticed. It seemed that something was going on when we were at the concert the other night." See what he says. If he seems oblivious: "Frankly, you were nasty -- yelling at the people around us. I didn't get it. The place was crowded and we were all crammed in there. I couldn't figure out why you were so mad. I haven't seen that side of you and honestly didn't like it much because [say why it made you uncomfortable]." And leave it there. Make sure you have $ to pay for your meal and transportation home and if you don't like the answer, roll on out.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: nonesuch on May 08, 2017, 06:20:11 PM
When I married LH, I was under the impression that my income absolutely could not be used as a basis for his child support, but YMMV.

When I was widowed, I stayed 'married' on Facebook for months.  Then for some months I had no status listed at all. 

I did occasionally post about good/bad/silly dates.  I finally tightened up my privacy settings as I was getting weird come-ons from allegedly new widowers.  I posted "In a relationship" after New Beau and I had been together five or six months, I think.

I stayed single until the age of 60, which will allow me to claim LH's social security if I choose.  I was casting about the internet the other day, and found out that my state is one that will require a spouse to make good on medical bills not covered my insurance.  This can be true, I guess, even if you don't live in a community property state.  On the other hand, your unmarried partner will pay taxes on anything he/she inherits from you. 

I can certainly understand a man or woman of the cloth refusing to perform a wedding ceremony when no wedding is taking place.  My goofy thought is to hire a discreet local actor, pay him/her for his time to perform a ceremony, and be done with it.  Almost anyone get ordained online, so if this person isn't your pastor/priestess/whatever, [shrug] "our friend who just got ordained" would be a satisfactory explanation.  Obviously, it's not as meaningful as your own pastor.

Odd and true story:  a friend of mine got married a couple years ago.  She'd been married before, and just wanted a low key something with a notary.  Her fiance to be said, no, let's make it a big deal.  She approached her own minister. He had real problems with her fiance's religious doctrine.  Wouldn't perform the ceremony.  They approach his priest.  Happy to do it, her deceased husband wasn't a bar to marriage, but the second marriage ended in divorce, so she'd need to get that one annulled. They had a nice wedding, performed by a notary.

Trying2breathe, I'd be seeing red flags waving when someone gets into fights at a fun event.

http://time.com/money/3492304/social-security-older-marriage-hurt-benefits/
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 10, 2017, 11:39:20 PM
Hi all: found this interesting article. Thoughts?
http://thoughtcatalog.com/brianna-wiest/2016/10/12-reasons-why-old-souls-have-such-a-hard-time-finding-love/
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 11, 2017, 07:58:45 AM

arneal   This article resonates, many of the points given apply to me.  I believe that widowhood thrusts us into old soul territory.  Before widowhood, my life was lighter, opportunities seemed limitless and there was a lot less baggage.   As a widow, I well understand the fragility of life, the importance of finding the right connection and not wasting time.   I know myself better than ever and if given the chance to have a Chapter 2, intend to do it right.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 11, 2017, 08:05:22 AM
Update on NG - at dinner last night, had a difficult conversation discussing his aggressive behavior at the concert.  He was concerned, listened and asked questions, and was apologetic.  He told me that he was protective, something that I understand as it was a chaotic scene at the concert.  He said that it won't happen again, I believe him.  I'm cautiously optimistic ...... sigh
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 11, 2017, 10:40:24 AM
trying2 -- so glad you had the conversation and love that you are cautiously optimistic!

Personality is a weird thing. I shared last year sometime that I don't believe in astrology but from a psychological perspective (my masters is in counseling education) I am fascinated by personality traits and how they sometimes align with the star chart :) NG is a Cancer and I can totally see many of those traits, even though he has said he thinks it's simple to see whatever traits you want when reading such. There are things that he might say or do that make me take a deep breath; for example, the charts say that when a Cancer is hurt, he or she will dwell and stew on it and can be vindictive. I can see that. However, the chart also says they do it because under that hard shell (Cancer the crab) they are very tender-hearted. I see that too. What I've noticed over the last few months is that he will ask questions about the things that pain him more than he did when we first met. I think he takes all advice and chews on it, rather than responding to each piece with agreement or disagreement. It's interesting to watch. The biggest issue for him is when he feels disrespected, which in my readings about dating and how to build relationships is sometimes a huge issue.

You mention that your NG said he is protective -- that's a big deal as well from what I read. Some men are that way and how they express it might come across as 'caveman-ish' but they don't mean harm to you or yours. Hopefully that's all it is and you all can move forward because he will be mindful of how he expresses that side of himself!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on May 11, 2017, 09:50:47 PM
 Arneal , somebody that thinks through things before responding sounds like a person that can be very reasonable...always a good sign in a partner...rash decisions can lead to trouble sometimes.

So I wanted to share a development from this past week.....I accepted some help  :)

I have a  second car that I only drive in the summer. I got it going about 2 weeks ago....but I was finding it slipping alot on rainy days. I took a quick look at the tires to see if I needed new ones and thought they looked Ok.....but was slipping so much that I asked NG to take a look. He said I should switch them.

 The next time he came to pick me up he asked me if I'd got them done and when I said no he said he was going to it right then and there before we went out. ........and I accepted.

So I have my new set of tires on and thank goodness I do because the old ones were like slicks on the inner edge!.....I hate car maintenance...one of the practical things I miss about DH.



Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 11, 2017, 10:24:41 PM
Fabulous, klim! It does feel weird to ask for help sometimes but I think it's good when we do -- in your case, definitely! I had to laugh about asking NG to take me to the airport last week. He was in the midst of his move and all so I felt bad about it; I told him I would text him around 9am to confirm ... I puttered around and when I got out of the shower at 9:15 he had already texted me to say he was leaving his house in like 10 minutes. On the return, I knew it would be rush hour, so I felt bad again about asking him to come get me after a long day's work. I texted on Thursday to confirm he was still good to pick me up and he came back right away to say yes. I had settled in to get some work done on Friday before my return flight and he texted me to ask what time I was due in and what airline; I told him and said I'd text when we were on the ground. He was there and waiting for me when the plane landed. I felt pretty okay about asking, even though I had backup arrangements if needed so I wouldn't sound desperate (including driving myself and using a Groupon for parking, asking one of the folks in the area that drives for Lyft, and my neighbor friend who said she would take me and/or pick me up) lol.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 12, 2017, 09:18:25 AM
klim  Yay on new tires and that NG helped you with this!  Now that he's offered, maybe asking for help will be a bit less awkward next time?   I rarely ask for anything, go overboard in helping others but hesitate in asking for help for myself.  Friends have mentioned that I have much credit but rarely make a withdrawal.  To me it feels better to not feel indebted to others, not sure why this is.


arneal  Funny that you mention astrology.  I tend to not be a believer in astrology, nor is NG altho we talked about how we're both Scorpios and how this might affect the relationship.  Had to laugh too about some men being "caveman-ish", we've had a conversation on his protective nature and caveman-like tendencies.  And I'm huge on airport runs, glad it's working out for you!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 12, 2017, 11:39:34 AM
It's funny, trying2; I had no qualms about running him to the airport last year. What made me laugh about it was that he stayed with me like two days before he had to leave ... showered here, used my towel and hairbrush like it was nothing. Cracked me up how comfy he got. I go to his place on New Year's and worry about using his towel to dry my hands. Again, so junior high :)

Oh! And to all who care for children or have them, happy Mother's Day weekend!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: jgib on May 12, 2017, 12:56:38 PM
I think red flags are red flags.  I think people can modify and cover things about themselves when in new relationships.  How many times have you heard "they just changed"?  In most cases they didn't, it was just the red flags were ignored as one off.
Sounds a bit negative I suppose, but if something comes up you just have to decide if you can live with it because I think it will come up again.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 12, 2017, 02:00:16 PM
jgib -- I agree, which is why I also thought the 'cautiously optimistic' stance was a good one :) The first husband was abusive and I saw the signs within the first few times I went out with him. However, I was young, stupid, and idealistic. I became hyper-aware and paid close attention when I met my second husband. If he got angry or upset, there was an obvious reason. It was out of character and never directed at me. When we talked about it the first time I saw him a bit upset (because he was always a very even tempered man), he talked about having had issues with anger in the past. He never talked things out then, just reacted instead. Over the 16 years we were together, we never argued or had any sort of fight. That is the sort of relationship I came to value and believe in so I do watch NGs reactions quite closely out of caution for my own well-being.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 12, 2017, 03:21:37 PM
Completely agree that in a new relationship, you can modify and create yourself to be something that you might not otherwise be.  If NG was resistant to our conversation about my concerns, I would have cut it off then.  But he wasn't resistant, wanted to know more, asked questions and expressed concern about my feelings. 


Interestingly, in the past few days he's started to justify his actions, calling himself assertive and not in his opinion aggressive - "a guy thing".  I let him know that whatever it's called, I wasn't comfortable with it.  My radar is up, he's not free and clear, I'm still cautiously optimistic.  Although a bit more cautious, now that he's backpedaling a bit.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 14, 2017, 06:41:43 PM
Howdy all! Hoping your weekend is going well. I'm here to deliver the junior high moments for today :)

I love finding things to do on the cheap so Groupon and LivingSocial are two of my favorite sites. I tried to set up something for this weekend but it didn't happen as it was one of those excursions you have to make a reservation for ahead of time and with it being Mother's Day weekend, they were probably full. So before not being able to go, I had asked NG if he wanted to go with. He asked what it was all about, etc. etc. He then says he was planning to come my way early on Saturday if I didn't have plans. I volunteer in the morning so he said he was thinking early afternoon (usually we get together for an evening movie or dinner -- I tend to work in the early part of the day and he does stuff he can't do during the week because of work). First junior high moment -- I was thrilled at spending pretty much the whole day together :)

Despite not getting to use the Groupon, we had a good day. At one point we were talking about his bike and he mentioned that he might take a ride up north (where he's from) on Memorial weekend. Mind you, Memorial Monday marks a year that we've been seeing each other. We just kept talking while my brain was going a mile a minute. I was back and forth with myself, trying to decide if I should say something, if I should let it pass without mention, or what. He comes from a family that didn't make over him much ... would do big parties for his brothers at birthdays but ignore his, stuff like that. So as they say, I bit the bullet. This morning while we were just chilling before getting some coffee, I said, 'Hey! It's May!' He answered with something like, 'Yep, it's actually been for about 14 days now.' I came back with, 'But it's May, which means it's about a year since we first went out -- how time flies, huh?' He was like, 'Is that right?' and we went on with other conversations.

I feel like I'm off the hook by having a casual conversation about it because at the end of last month, I was trying to figure out how to plan something to commemorate it. I am so not a mushy person when it comes to stuff like that -- I'm not good at it, coming from a family that wasn't really into big displays too (since my dad's been gone, my mom has gotten more into celebrating everything with flair though, so maybe she's rubbing off on me lol). I put it out there and so there it is. If he goes up north that weekend, I will see if I can hang out with some friends somewhere. Since I didn't say specifically what day, chances of us actually doing something to mark the year is slim.

And I am actually good with that. Growth can be strange :)

Happy Mother's Day, ladies -- as our assistant pastor said in service today, even if you have not given birth to any babies yourself, you have influenced others and for that have been in a mother's shoes as well!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 15, 2017, 08:27:54 AM
arneal   I'm not one that pays a lot of attention to romantic milestone dates, so I get more of what your NG is doing.  My NG reminds me every once in awhile that we're now starting "month x" of dating, or that we've done this or that x number of times.  When he says these things, I usually look at him with a blank stare and say "really"?  For awhile he was taking notes, which I find pretty incredible, and that's how he was keeping track.   I consider myself to be expressive, romantic and attentive to details, but dates have never been my thing.  If your NG is planning a bike trip without understanding what this date means to you, it may be that he didn't realize that Memorial Day weekend marks a year together with you.


As marking this date is important to you, can you be straightforward in mentioning this to him?  Maybe something like "On Memorial Day, we will have been together for a year, this is special to me and I would like to celebrate this with you.  What do you think?".   Maybe it won't be anything planned for Memorial Monday, but it would be a celebration nonetheless.  If celebrating specifically on Memorial Day is important to you, maybe mention that too?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 15, 2017, 07:18:07 PM
Thanks, trying2. I came up with an alternate plan, which has an A and B option (lol -- that's what happens when you do research for a living ...). I was asking my brother (not blood, but close enough to be) about the whole thing. He is an introvert, as am I, and as NG is. Like I said to bro -- put two introverts together and what happens? Nobody does anything for fear of getting it wrong or saying the wrong thing and messing everything up.  ;D
So here is the plan and my thoughts behind it all:

Plan A: I have a Groupon to go to the wolf preserve this coming Saturday. I tried to get in this weekend but with it being Mother's Day, they didn't call me back because they were probably packed out. I called and left them a message again today to try and get a reservation, so we'll see. I had mentioned it and he was game and when I said I was trying this weekend, he offered to take his bike up. So I think that's a go.

Plan B: if I don't get the call back for this coming weekend, I grabbed a Groupon for what looks like a nice steakhouse place. Don't know if there is anything interesting going on anywhere but a good meal, a glass of wine, and good conversation is usually not a bad thing.

I figure whatever I do I can call it a celebration for the first year. I doubt he remembers the exact date so it can be like a casual toast or something. I also figure that way we can recognize it, he can take his time away (which I think he needs ... the job has been stressful, he and his daughter just moved, and there are a few other things), and life goes on.

I tend not to be particularly mushy about these sorts of things but dating (and dating him) is such a new experience for me. I am trying to create a new life, one that will make me happy and bring happiness to those around me. It's more important that it gets recognized in some way, but I can't say exactly why. I never marked time like that with LH. Interesting you mention your NG taking notes; I have a keepsake book, sort of like a diary. I have movie ticket stubs in it and all sorts of things to mark different dates we've gone on. Don't know that I'd ever show it to him though!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 16, 2017, 07:32:01 AM
Both plans sound like good ones  :D , either sound like a really nice celebration.  A year together is a big milestone, keep us posted on what you decide!  About being an introvert, I'm usually one to cut to the chase, and this doesn't always work out well! 


Interesting about the keepsake book, after NG told me about his notes I started to wonder whether I should start something like that too. It's likely that I won't, though - I still journal in a grief book which has ended up being notes to my LH, usually about the kids' milestones and celebrations.   What I do write about NG are what I call burn letters - every once in awhile when I'm feeling particularly emotional I will write a letter to NG and put it all out there.  When finished I'll keep it for a day or two to read over again, and then take it out back to the firepit and burn it.  It's my intention to never have anybody read these letters, more of a therapeutic way of getting my thoughts out there. I would certainly never share my burn letters with him! :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 16, 2017, 10:38:35 AM
Thanks trying2; I was just reading a post over on the online dating thread about oversharing. I think LH and I overshared the whole time we were together  ;D I think of him, I see his photo (a small one near a small one of my dad who is also deceased), and every now and again I imagine what he would say about a certain thing but I don't feel the urge to share with him anymore ... my stepdaughter had a keepsake urn necklace/pin made for me after LH died. It's in my drawer. I've worn it maybe twice. Stepdaughter will sometimes talk about her dad during the brief conversations we have these days but I try to steer the conversation in other directions. I don't want to diminish her feelings but don't want to give the impression that I'm in the same place as she is with missing him and so on. Of course I do, but it's changed. I think it changed when he got so sick. Plus I have moved forward and don't feel like I need to discuss that with her. But I digress. Instead of writing to NG, I have conversations in my head, imagining what I would say and how. Practicing before the opportunity arises to actually have the conversation  :o Will keep you all updated as things press on!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 18, 2017, 07:24:26 AM
As I read through almost four years of my grief journal, it's evolved into mostly updates to him on our kids.  I guess this is a good thing, there's no longer the questions and anguish about his death.  When he was alive, there was definitely some oversharing going on, and he wasn't always comfortable with it.  I realize that I miss mostly being a couple with him.  Now that I'm dating, the desire to be a couple is now being met.  I now share most of my thoughts with NG, and it feels right.


Conversations with his family makes me realize that their grief is lessened, but I believe is essentially the same emotion.  My grief has evolved, I think dating has evolved it even more.    Conversations with my brother-in-law in the early days were comforting, but now they're just weird.  Now that I'm dating I feel that the couple relationship is now being satisfied by NG.   My brother-in-law will never replace his brother.   I've not shared with his family that I'm dating, fearing hurt feelings and added grief.  I fear that one day soon I'll be caught with NG  :-[   That will be a junior high moment!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 18, 2017, 08:32:48 AM
trying2 -- I hear you about who to tell about dating. For me, I told just a few people when I decided I was ready to try dating/online dating. I was ready pretty quick (LH died 2 February, I started checking online sites a few months later; met NG online it was either Friday or Saturday of Memorial Day weekend and met face to face on Memorial Day). I told two local friends I trusted before the face to face as a safety thing. I also told two women who are like sisters to me; the one I've known since third grade and we know more about each other than probably anyone else and the other is a close second. Once we'd met I told my mother and eventually told one of my uncles. And of course my son knows.

As far as LH's family: one of his cousins (female) is like a sister to me and we talk just about every day. She has been married three times and all three husbands are deceased, so she gets it. I am grateful for her and she is happy for me. I mentioned something maybe in the early fall to my stepdaughter about having a friend who could fix something in the house but not wanting to impose; her response was to have him do it and just tell him to bring a change of clothes because I have the two bathrooms and he could shower ... she was adamant however that if I did it, I needed to not let him shower in my bedroom :o Needless to say, I don't talk to her about my personal life; she is 30 and I know her mom gushes about her love life (or lack thereof) so it's partly that and I have the feeling that she thinks I am sitting around, pining over her dad like she is. We are connected on social media so I see her profile, which has been a photo of her and her dad when she was about four or five years old. She made it that within days of his death and has kept it that way. NG and I are connected on social media as well but it's a public space so there's only been maybe two posts in all this time that were more on the personal side; even those were not red flag - they are dating - type posts. Fortunately, the friends who know we are dating are not saying.

Bottom line for me is, for all family, is that until something is publicly official, I am not saying anything. I mean, NG has a sister back east, my mom and just about all the rest of my family are as well, and I've thought about making a suggestion that we take a trip back there together. However, I want to wait until we are a good bit past that one year mark :-X If that conversation ever happens, I'll probably ask, 'So, how are we calling ourselves?'  :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on May 18, 2017, 01:23:12 PM
Hey all.  Been a strange 2 weeks.  My elderly mother I just moved 2 months ago to a personal care home ended up in the hospital with pneumonia.  She hasn't been admitted to a hospital in 7 yrs.  The illness messed up her electrolytes which lead to heart issues.  I have been back and forth for the time, as she is in the town my NG lives.

NG, of course, has let me stay with him.  I have had to make arrangements for my teen son.  School is out this week.  NG met my eldest brother, then, Mother's day weekend, as I guilted two brothers to come see her and I was exhausted.  Well, things worsened Tues.  She went into VTach several times over several hours.  DNR, and I am her health surrogate, and I was alone.  Doctor said to call in all family members who want to see her.  One brother got back quickly, and NG let him and me stay at his place.  He has gotten me dinner each night.  He has offered to stay at the hospital with me.  He took a new job a month ago, so I told him he needed to stay on the new job.  I am not his wife, ya know.  So, he is stepping up.  He is quite supportive.  He is seeing me in a new state of despair and sadness and so far so good. 

Working out the arrangements for my mother.  Like hospice.  She is stable but likely bed ridden the rest of her days due to the damage to the heart.  This is the 2nd go around for me as my father died of Alzheimer related illness after 5 yrs. skilled care.  NG really hasn't dealt with this, just his grandfather a few years ago.  His issues are with ex, custody, etc.  Different experiences.  So, see how we maneuver.   
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on May 18, 2017, 01:45:50 PM
On a positive note, I do keep track of dates and events.  My LH had cancer when he was 34 and was cured.  So, we celebrated because we learned early life is short.  LH even put reminders on his calendar for things like our first date (1983!!!), the day he proposed, etc.

SO, NG is experiencing some of this.  We met face to face 3/5/2016.  He told me he loved me 4/30/2016.  I keep dates in my head.  I don't make a huge deal, but maybe a cheers or reminder to him.  Quality time is one of my love languages, so noting our time together is part of that for me.  I'll see how he adapts to that ;-) 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 18, 2017, 05:33:39 PM
tybec -- I am so sorry to hear of the latest stressors in your life and lift you and your mom and family to the Light. Glad to hear that NG is there for you all. That is fabulous!

So I got to chat with my (not-blood-related) little brother yesterday :) One thing that he said about this whole event tracking thing was that for some men, they do it in their head and while they act casual about it, they are very much conscious of those special dates even while not mentioning them. I think that is true of NG; when I think about his approach to Christmas for example, he didn't say much of anything but put a lot of thought into the gifts (and there were a few) that he gave me. He tends to be more low-key on lots of things but seems to enjoy them :)

Count-down to the wolf preserve this Saturday; I texted him about it and the time but have yet to get a real response. I was telling my friend when we were walking the other day that I since I didn't ask him any questions in my text that I will probably hear from him early Saturday. However, I am a stickler for time frames and will text him in the evening on Friday so he'll know my expectations on when we need to leave :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on May 18, 2017, 05:39:45 PM
I pay very little attention to dates...I know I started dating early in January...that's all I know.....actually that's not true , it was a wednesday. :o

I've had three relationships in my life, LH, 1st NG and now 2nd NG. Each have had a different background, Polish, German and now Dutch......so I have gained a smattering of each language.

I took an inventory of the dutch words I can remember so far...I'm always asking how to say things .....


So far I know the words for "drink", "teacher" ,"kiss" and "wild"


I'm not sure about what it says about this relationship but so far it's been fun.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 18, 2017, 05:52:55 PM
Love it, klim!

You bring up another interesting thing about the differences in our encounters. I went for my annual checkup today and one of the questions on the pre-visit form asked how many pregnancies, how many children, and how many miscarriages I'd had. It then asked how many sexual partners I've had in the past 12 months and how many in my life (it offered a blank to fill in for each). Neither of these points came up in the conversation with the doctor but they made me think that they hadn't come up in the course of my building relationship with NG either ... not that it matters because neither of us are children and I suppose we assume that we came into this with more than the recent past  :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 20, 2017, 03:02:39 PM
tybec   Sorry to hear about your mom, and hope that you have some peaceful moments in the days & weeks ahead.  Good to know that NG is stepping up to help you out, a great thing that he is there for you at this time.


I too keep dates in my head, have never kept a "dating" journal although have to admit the idea of it is intriguing.  Knowing that NG writes things down makes me feel a bit skittish, he has an uncanny ability to remember things that I tell him, and I suspect that he goes back and checks his notes.


I've not seen my NG much this week, it's been a busy and emotional week with visiting family and DD's HS graduation.  I met him for dinner on Monday evening which happened to be the date of what would have been my 24th wedding anniversary.  As I was feeling a bit melancholy, I mentioned the anniversary to him and he immediately said "Oh no!" and then changed the subject.  It's a big disappointment that he didn't acknowledge what I'm going through.   I pretty much backed away from him this week, haven't texted or been in touch much with him.  I realize that my expectations are pretty high to ask somebody to take on the emotional rollercoaster of a widow.  But for him to completely gloss over my sadness, what a disappointment.  Supposed to meet him tomorrow for a movie date, we'll see.   Meh ~
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 21, 2017, 06:16:04 PM
So sorry trying2; I think part of it (not making excuses but thinking through my typing fingers here) that it might be difficult for NG to offer a what is a reasonable response. If he doesn't get how you feel about it ... you're dating, which could be viewed as 'She has moved on in total', acknowledging that you felt some kind of way about what would have been your wedding anniversary might be tough to speak to. Maybe changing the subject was his way of attempting to move you to a happier state of mind? (I am being hopeful over here) {{{hugs}}}
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 21, 2017, 06:24:25 PM
Howdy all:

An update -- so I shared that I had a coupon to go to the wolf preserve. I'd told NG and he seemed interested. This week was a bit tough so when I texted to tell him I'd confirmed for Saturday, I didn't get a response. I went on with my full week but then when the weekend arrived (mind you, we'd been messaging about other stuff) and I didn't get a confirmation, I sent a text to tell him to say I was sorry I couldn't change his mind about coming and that I was taking off, would pick up the BBQ I had planned to investigate (again a coupon so I knew there would be plenty) and that I'd be around if he wanted to meet up. I proceeded to drive the 1+ hours to the place.

Let me say it was cathartic; I hadn't been to that area before. Ever. The last time I'd driven in that direction, I'd had my LH and my son in my home. I have to go to Arizona in a few months and had been planning to drive myself and felt this trip was a precursor. It was glorious! I got there and had a fantastic time with the wolves. I posted oodles of photos. As I was leaving I told the proprietor that I planned to come back and she said, 'Well, maybe your friend will come with next time' and we smiled.

We met up later and he called me the wolf lady and we laughed about it; he'd seen all my fantastic photos. He sort of looked sheepishly and said, 'You have a hard time getting me to go places' (he was referring to the preserve as well as an outing that didn't happen back around Christmas). I made a face and said, 'Well I plan to go back, so next time!' and kept on with the rest of the evening.

Bottom line, I absolutely adore him and understand that stuff happens. But I will go off and have a wonderful time, meeting people, and doing things regardless. I say to him: Catch up if you can :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 22, 2017, 06:56:11 AM

Start of a new week, both my kids are home for the summer.  Several milestone dates have come and gone, I'm ready for the start of summer.  :D

arneal   The wolf preserve sounds fantastic, so glad that you went anyway despite NG not being with you.  How great to have this experience!  Love your attitude.  I bet that he won't want to miss out on the next adventure!
What you say about NG makes sense.  It's surprising to me that he doesn't want to acknowledge and give some kind of support during these occasional tough days.  I'm usually a positive and happy person, he's only seen this side of me.  I'll have a conversation with him this week, we'll see how it goes.  Thank you for your input.



Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on May 22, 2017, 08:56:01 AM
Ok, so I still consider very much budding.  ;)  I am past the euphoria stage.  I learned in a class with the five love languages about the first part of the relationship is pure euphoria and can last up to 18 months!  You love everything about them, the annoyances are cute, the jokes are funny, etc.  And you can't live without them, pining, and it hurts to be apart.  And then it slowly changes, and the things that were the cutest are now driving you crazy. And most marriages end around 3 years, not 7 anymore.  So, the 18 months makes sense!  Many are married or living together by this time, and then realize, OH MY!  This is not really what I thought. So make or break time . Love 'em or leave 'em time. 

I believe I am here. I love NG.  But we are showing our true selves.  And the annoying stuff is there, both sides.  My point, I guess, is I didn't know all this stuff when married at 21.  And I stuck it out, and through without overthinking all this. SO different being older, wisdom, experience, and add great loss to it.  This is not for the faint of heart.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 22, 2017, 11:12:37 AM
Thank you for sharing that, tybec. I agree with you. I was certainly idyllic (read: young, naive, and very stupid) at 21. If I hadn't been, life would look very different today and maybe I wouldn't be a woman with two widow experiences under her belt ... The 18 months thing is interesting to me as next week marks the 12 month point for NG and I. I lived with both my husbands before we got married; went in with wide open eyes the second time. LH and I spent lots of time together at his house so I knew pretty much all of his quirks before moving in there. Because I spent so much time there, I think he knew mine as well. NG spends time here more than I do at his house, more I think because he wants to set the example to his daughter that he doesn't want her boyfriend spending the night :) There has been no discussion of something as huge as mutual living arrangements, so I'm not even thinking that far ahead. I look forward to the day that 'I love you' gets said out loud by either/both of us. One step at a time :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: RobFTC on May 27, 2017, 06:41:37 PM
Hi folks,

I've been holding out on you some  :)  I've been seeing someone since October, taking it deliberately slowly and letting things develop.  We've been exclusive for awhile, and have been Facebook-official (lol!) for a couple of months.  She's sharp and capable, has a good life on her own, treats people well, we talk very well together, and the hugs and kisses are awesome.  We haven't tended to get together more than once a week, and so we haven't had the bandwidth to talk about some things.

My birthday is coming up, and I knew I wanted to have a party at my place to let more people meet her, and had mentioned that a couple of weeks ago.  We haven't really talked about it since, so I wasn't sure what she was thinking.  I am used to orchestrating my own birthday stuff after all these years - Lord knows my girls won't do anything for me that way!  Work has kept me from really finalizing the party, so I finally got the event invite sent out last night.  I sent her a heads-up before I started on that, and I probably caught her off-guard.  She wanted to get in and help, though, so she's getting a cake and plates and cups and such.  And this weekend, she's taking us to mini-golf and cooking dinner for us tomorrow, which is pretty nice.

We got together for breakfast this morning, and I focused for a minute on how comfortable and good I felt in her presence.  I haven't known if this is built to last, but I guess I know now that I'd like it to be :-)

Take care,
Rob T
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 27, 2017, 06:57:24 PM
Cheering for you, Rob! Hope you'll keep us updated.

This is the one-year-since-first-date weekend. Since it seems NG isn't one to do anything to mark the moment, I've been spending today working in my family room (the surround sound was non-op since LH died). My wonderful neighbor came down and moved the 9,000lb TV that was in here and I was able to clean. After my volunteer time this morning I picked up a new TV and stand. I spent most of the day getting it all put together and running. It is fabulous! Even if I don't see him this weekend, I and the dogs will be watching this 50" screen, theatre-style. But of course I am hoping to see NG as it is the weekend and this is when we usually meet up. Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 27, 2017, 07:14:33 PM
I'm cheering too, Rob - how great that you've found somebody special!  Your post brings a big smile.


arneal   It's a special weekend, even if your NG doesn't recognize it.  Happy One Year to you and your NG!   Hope that you're able to have a celebratory dinner/toast/event to mark the occasion.  I was always one to insist on celebrating an occasion on THE day, regardless of circumstances.  My LH didn't care one way or the other when something was celebrated, oftentimes it was planned for a time that was convenient.   It took some adjusting on my part, and I eventually came to terms with being more lenient with when occasions were celebrated.  One year is probably important to your NG, just on different terms.   :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 27, 2017, 07:25:04 PM
Thanks, trying!

I was at the optometrist yesterday so I didn't do much work. I am catching up a smidge right now and then I will have that toast and some dinner, even if all by my lonesome :) The pups are so happy to have me back in the family room.

I am just recalling that the first time NG came to my house, we sat back here. I like this room and even though the sound didn't work well, I brought him back here anyway. As the year has gone on, he's liked my techie side and is quite interested when I change things around. This will be a surprise, whenever he sees it. I think you are right about it being important to him as well; I think he's one of those guys who doesn't want to come across as too mushy about such things. I am attempting to be more attentive to these milestones as I have never been so previously and I think he's worth it :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: calimom on May 27, 2017, 10:45:14 PM
Your news made me smile, Rob! It's nice to read. Happy birthday and it's ok not to over share every detail of your life :) Sometimes just the headlines are enough.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 30, 2017, 01:14:12 PM
Happy belated Memorial Day all. Popped in to leave a quick update. I spent the weekend in my renewed family room and had a great time. I saw that NG had spent part of the weekend with some friends, playing guitar. Yesterday morning I got a text from him, saying he'd been a tad hung over from their shenanigans and wasn't in any shape to ride out, but that I could come over there if I wanted. I was in the midst of a few things but would pop over in the afternoon. We went to the store when I got there; he bought a bunch of bbq items and cooked for me, his daughter, and her boyfriend. We spent the rest of the evening talking and watching some tv; at one point he had to call his coworker about some paperwork and the schedule for this week. They talked and finally he told the guy that he had to go because 'his lady' was there. I was looking the other way so he couldn't see me grinning. So junior high.

I ended up not saying anything about it actually being the anniversary of our first date. I made mention of his birthday coming in June and he sort of rolled his eyes with a little smile on his face and said something about people not being excited about their birthdays past the age of 12. I told him I plan to be excited about birthdays, even when I am 130 years old. We had a good laugh about it. It just reinforced what I had been thinking, that he doesn't celebrate much. However, I plan to take him to dinner or something around that time and already have an idea for a gift :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on May 31, 2017, 09:18:35 AM
arneal  Sounds like a relaxing way to spend Memorial Day.  So you're his lady!   ;D  I'd be grinning too!  He does seem like one that is low-key about celebrations, not necessarily a bad thing. I'm not one to acknowledge some of the  milestone dates, so I get it.


Update on NG.  We've had some good conversations on his backing off from my widow stuff and he said that he was giving me space because he thought that's what I wanted.  What I hear from him is that he's concerned and cares, and wants to do what's good for me.  So we continue on.  He is very different in personality, profession and energy than LH was.  I continue to be surprised at the connection with him.  So ..... feeling somewhat queasy, last night I did a background check on him.  My heart was pounding and I was sweating thinking of what I might find.  The results came out clean - no surprises thank goodness.  I now feel foolish that I did this, but it eases my mind to know that he's not misrepresenting himself.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 31, 2017, 02:37:59 PM
Trying -- yes to the queasy! After my early yucky online dating experience, I became very cautious. I checked out NG before we met and there were no flags. It's sad that we have to go through such lengths to ensure we won't get tricked, hurt, or worse :(
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on May 31, 2017, 04:53:35 PM
I'm still having trouble accepting help...

NG wants to help me, make my life easier, make life less stressful......this sounds wonderful doesn't it!?.........Then why am I having difficulty with it?

I work full time, my 19 yr old son lives with me and deals with anxiety and depression , and so I deal with him. I have a 1950's bungalow (lotsa maintenance) with a huge lot( lotsa yard work) and two cars that are over 10 years old (more maintenance).............ever since my husband passed away I have very much been the take charge , don't pity me, I got this type of person.  I have taken pride in my ability to "handle things"

NG wants to help :for example as I wrote in an earlier post he changed over my winter tires when I made mention I was going to need to do that.  And the other day I mentioned that the maple trees were dropping all the keys on my deck, he arrived early for our date night and took the blower and tidied it up. I should be grateful but I was thinking "you don't have to do that I'm not incapable...."

 The latest thing is my one car had the  check engine light on and I had made an appointment to take it in to the local mechanic just up the street.  I mentioned that I hated going to the mechanic because I always feel like they see sucker written on my forehead when I head in and say" it's not working I don't know what's wrong". As soon as I said that he was making arrangements to trade cars with me , take my car back to his place and then arrange for his mechanic to look at it. So here I am driving a brand new expensive e car and he has my old one which is malfunctioning and could strand him.....and he's got the head ache of taking it in.


I like this being looked after but it also makes me feel vulnerable....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on May 31, 2017, 05:08:50 PM
klim -- thanks for sharing. In my continuing struggle to ask for help, I have gotten to a place where I do what I need to do and then talk about it afterward or if I would like an opinion about what to do and NG goes forth and does it, I grit my teeth and accept. I figure a day may come when he gets tired of me being cranky about his help and stops asking or doing, which may lead to him being offended deep down. I read somewhere that in many situations, men are helpers by nature. When the woman rejects that, the man is hurt because that's one way he shows he cares, even if he's not one to say I love you. Just a thought :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on May 31, 2017, 07:09:10 PM
Klim I was exactly like you for so long, asking and accepting help was so difficult!  I think I had to convince myself that I could handle everything because I was so overwhelmed when DH died with everything that fell on my shoulders. Happily now that we are engaged and living together it is much easier because we function as a team so it's more about dividing up responsibilities.  Of course there have been some bumps in the road with figuring out our roles and integrating our ways but looking back I wonder why I was so stubborn for so long.  I also agree with Arneal that "doing" and "fixing" is a way many men show they care, refusing their help is like saying no to flowers or a gift.

Opening yourself up to this will make you feel vulnerable but if he's a good guy it may be worth it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 01, 2017, 01:55:04 PM
klim   I'm also one to not readily accept help, and am pretty adamant that I can manage almost anything on my own.  I'm beginning to realize that my reluctance in accepting help from NG, is that I'm not sure what I want our relationship to be.  I think that there's an intimacy in accepting help and sharing responsibilities, which may lead further to a deeper relationship.  There is a part to my grill that is broken, NG has repeatedly offered to fix it and I've so far refused.  Seems ridiculous, but should he repair my grill I feel like I will then have him over more and cook more often for him!  :o   Something that I just don't feel ready for yet.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 01, 2017, 03:33:32 PM
That's fair, trying2. It is true that being vulnerable does tend to lead to greater intimacy and if you aren't sure what you want your relationship to look like.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on June 01, 2017, 04:38:40 PM
I agree , I think that's why I also have been resistant....just it ups the interdependance one more level.....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 02, 2017, 06:16:26 PM
I had a post here about my NG flaking on responding to my text. Of course after I post it, he responds. Yep, junior high ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on June 05, 2017, 08:35:48 AM
My update:
After a week of fretting about another holiday weekend not together, I got passed the insecurities.  I hate that.  We were in different directions and different timing, and it didn't work to be together.  He is in the summer schedule and has his children a week at a time, Friday to Friday. I had family celebrations for a niece graduating, and we were headed different directions, states even.  I hate that it bothers me so much.

But, I am house shopping and put an offer in yesterday in his town, so we will see if we are going to up the relationship ladder.  I did look for a house to accommodate his kids (part time) and my son.  I just couldn't see buying house that would not and a year from now changing.  So, a new ride on the budding relationship. ;-)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 05, 2017, 09:40:17 AM
Thank you so much for sharing, tybec! Your post touched my heart as this has been a roller coaster weekend for me. I apologize in advance for this long post ...

Firstly, my son is in hospital with pneumonia. He's been there since Tuesday, had to be moved to ICU and intubated on Thursday because his lungs are so full. He's doing okay in the big scheme of things but since he doesn't live near me, I have to drive in quite a bit of traffic to get there. Emotional roller coaster, right?

Anyway, NG came over on Saturday evening for dinner. I reached out to invite, he said yes. I was pleased because he was very much on time (he has occasional habits of being late). We had a nice dinner and a good evening. We went outside and were looking at the stars; we both have a like for all things science fiction so that sparked more good conversation. He told me about an app that I could put on my phone for knowing what constellations and planets are in the sky at any given time, which was great. As he searched for it on his phone, a bunch of apps opened at once, including POF.

Now at that point I had two very visceral reactions. The first was a gut reaction of hurt. My mind started down that road of 'Is he still looking?' The second was more logical: we all come from different places when it comes to how we go about life. Having been hurt in relationship, my way of coping is to retreat, to stay to myself, to mope and cry until I feel better. For others, and I get that he is like this, his way of coping is to be prepared to seek comfort outside himself. He isn't the type of guy looking for instant gratification but is about making friends first. If things go sour, he's gonna look for a new situation. He's a slow mover and takes his time building intimate relationships. And I can't fault any of that. I didn't overtly react to seeing the app and the evening went on. In the morning, we talked over coffee like usual. However, he took a moment for a VERY intimate conversation. He has had some depression and physical issues going on and wanted to talk about how it was affecting me. He shared personal thoughts on the matter and said what he was going to do about both (counseling as a possibility for the depression and a doctor for the physical issues because they both affect our intimacy). He shared some history about what he knows is part of the psychological aspect to his present difficulties, which was also tough to hear from the standpoint of my first thoughts at seeing that app pop up on his phone because part of the conversation dealt with past break-ups, which of course made me start thinking the worst. But then he talked about how we could come together in a better way, what he would do and what I could do too. We talked about his birthday and places we (to use his words) needed to check out one day. He left like usual to start his week. Before I went to church and drove out to see my son, I sent him a text to say that I know it isn't easy to open one's heart and I have appreciated his trust over the last year (see how I slipped that in there? LOL). When I posted my social media update about my son (most of my friends and family don't live near me so it's the easiest way to give information), he was one of the first to react to it.

So in the big picture, everything is as it was. But I've been an emotional wreck! I haven't cried this much in a long time. I feel so sensitive about everything; my neighbor-friend and I usually walk on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays, but she didn't message me this morning and I cried over that. Sheesh! The message at service yesterday was about wanting more -- more of God, more out of life. Yeah, I was all over that topic!

This week, my goal is to get myself together, to focus on work and some things I'm doing around the house. I made a post on social media this morning about needing to have moments like this to be renewed, reborn. I am putting myself on a social media time out. These feelings right here are why I was so scared to date in the first place ... 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 05, 2017, 01:08:42 PM
arneal  First of all, so very sorry to hear of your son's illness and hospitalization.  Sounds like he's in good hands and I hope well on the way to a full recovery.  Prayers and big big hugs to you.  About your NG - maybe POF app is still on his phone as he's not yet deleted it?  It's reassuring that he's open with you to discussing personal issues and trying to work through them.


Emotional week here too - although there's not been much going on there's been plenty of tears here too.  Maybe a perfect mis-alignment of the stars or something ..... ?  :P
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 05, 2017, 01:24:45 PM
trying2 -- thank you. My son is strong, never sick. I made him smile when I said to him that since he never gets sick, I guess he decided to do it in epic fashion. Sigh!

On NG, yes, I suspect it's something he didn't take off his phone. It's just that initial horror because I am such a tech nerd too -- anything I don't use on my computers or phone has to go to save space. Guess that's the 'anal' part of me LOL. To my own health, the last time I went to the doctor, he told me that I'm in pre-menopause; in addition to all the weird body aches, emotions are a bit out of whack as well it seems. It will be well but I need to breathe. I am not used to wanting anyone around like this and it's tough to balance my usual carefree way of being with a strong desire to have him in my life.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 05, 2017, 04:16:12 PM

Continued healing for your son - sending prayers and big hugs your way.

I'm one to not clear my phone until necessary, and unused apps are usually pointed out to me by my kids.  Willing to bet that he's completely forgotten that POF is there.  :)


I get it on wanting your NG to be around and the emotions that come about because of this.   I'm feeling the same about my NG, although our relationship is not yet really established.  Emotions are running high, it's a wonky situation for sure.  I tend to be carefree, there's been nothing carefree for me about dating post-widowhood!  I need to breathe too, feels like sometimes there's not much else to do -
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 05, 2017, 04:26:55 PM
Thanks so much, trying2. As NG has his own 'demons' to fight at this time, I think it's good to just be chill about the whole thing. I have other good things to focus on. For example, I have a new gym membership pending (and they have a swimming pool ... oh how I miss being in the water!) and I am due to be interviewed at the local university tomorrow for an anthropological exhibit focused on diversity in the city. I have a writer friend in Holland and we both have new sarees; I promised I'd send along a photo of me in mine, which I am wearing to the interview. I will break my social media silence to post the photo. Oh, and I broke it today to post a link to my pastor's sermon from yesterday  :)

I so appreciate this community. It is a great reminder that I'm not alone in these crazy feelings!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 06, 2017, 10:45:15 AM
Lots of interesting things happening for you, arneal.  So good to concentrate on these, have a healthy attitude about it all and let things happen as they may.   :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 07, 2017, 12:56:26 PM
Yesterday was my stepdaughter's 31st birthday, but the thing that occupied my mind more than anything else was how tired I was of being labeled a widow ... I talked to her a few days prior and invariably the conversation turned to something about her dad. I wanted to say that while I remember what she was talking about, I don't think about those times much. I wanted to tell her that I've removed a lot of him from this house, that his presence is more of a comfortable memory than the primary spotlight of my life. I wanted to tell her that I have considered turning my second bedroom into the dog's room so if she comes out here, she'll have to stay in a hotel. I wanted to tell her that the tears I shed from time to time are not for her dad anymore but are because I have growing pains as I reclaim a life of not being a caregiver, which was a life she didn't really know about since he never told her how sick he'd been.

I was tired of seeing 'widowed from [LH]' on my social media profile. I was tired of ticking the 'widow' box on forms. I held off as long as I could but before I went to bed last night I went in and removed my relationship status all together. It was strange because once I did it, the connection to LH was gone on there. It was an existential sort of moment. After all, he's not here, he can't interact. I didn't delete his profile. I still am the one in charge of it and can make changes to it. I am ready to not be the spouse of someone who isn't here anymore and I just want to be me again. I had to fill out something about a week or so ago and it only gave the options of 'married' or 'single' ... not even a 'prefer not to answer', so I ticked the 'single' box. I suspect that's what started it. I will always be a woman who has been widowed twice, but not today. Going forward until and unless the Path of life makes a way for me to be joined to another again more deeply, I will just be me.

And that's my Wednesday so far :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: hachi on June 07, 2017, 01:32:07 PM
... tired I was of being labeled a widow ... I will always be a woman who has been widowed twice, but not today. Going forward until and unless the Path of life makes a way for me to be joined to another again more deeply, I will just be me.

I find it easier to refer to myself as "having been widowed" as an event. I never refer to myself as a widow. As life changing as that event was, and can still be at 5 years, it is not the sum of who I am anymore and I never liked the label from day one. I struggled with the facebook status and just removed it altogether, very early on.

All in all, armeal, just being you is good thing. From my perspective, anyway. You've got this.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 07, 2017, 01:47:17 PM
Thanks, hachi -- was recently diagnosed as going into menopause, so here's to the emotional roller coaster of that  ::)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on June 08, 2017, 07:34:34 AM
Arneal,

Interesting thoughts you shared.  I am comfortable with the term widow as it is distinct to me from being single, never married or single, divorced.  Just a different story.  But not all who I am, either.

 I have hidden my status on FB always, never being widowed.  I was never linked to LH on FB.  I have looked at memorializing his FB account. I recently put on there for me to be his legacy and downloaded his FB page for all his information.

Since dating NG, and I am moving to his city, soon, I realize I want to be his GF, not LH's widow.  I have to leave this town as that is who I am here (small town).  It will be hard to change my identity, but also freeing.  I, too, feel I am no longer married.  A marriage is a moving, living relationship, and it is now gone.  So, having some thoughts about this, too.

Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 08, 2017, 10:18:38 AM
Yes, tybec, it is a change of label for sure. My problem is how others see me more than how I see myself. The expectation that I will always be LHs wife. It feels weird to talk to them about the fact that I've moved forward with my life because they haven't ... Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 08, 2017, 12:10:36 PM
I too don't like the distinction of widowhood, have never liked the word widow and try to avoid the subject of it all whenever possible.  Talking about my status with somebody new brings on the inevitable head tilt and accompanying sorrys, and at this point the last thing that I need is anybody's pity.  There's been no change in my Facebook status because it wasn't there in the first place.


I feel a sense of freedom by slowly purging the last of LH's stuff out of my closet.  This to me represents a shift on how I think of our relationship, no longer needing those last physical reminders of him.   I will love LH forever, however am tired of those that bring up emotions that I no longer feel.  BIL still believes that LH holds the primary spotlight in my life, and I don't have the heart to tell him that this is no longer the case.


Here's to just being you, arneal  :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 08, 2017, 12:18:47 PM
Thank you, trying2 -- I love how you said that. I have two photos of LH; one with my dad's photo (he died 22 years ago) and one with LH, my son, and me. I have one photo of my stepdaughter (still trying to come up with a reasonable way to describe her ... LH's daughter sounds a bit too cold still) when she was a baby. Other than that, there is more artwork rather than 'people pictures' anymore. A friend of ours once did a bust of LH's head. We put it in the living room when she sent it to us. I kept it there for a bit after he died but then I had to pack it up, along with the rest of the photos, and put it in a cabinet in my garage. I figure if stepdaughter wants it, she can have it. I suppose if she ever gets herself together to visit we'll have that conversation. In the meantime, I have the feeling a day is coming when I get rid of the furniture in my son's old room, paint it, and make it the dog room like I'm thinking ... which may come sooner rather than later :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 10, 2017, 11:13:46 AM
IL's have been purging their stuff and giving some of it to me. I've been complacent about taking what they give me, smile and nod, say thank you.  Latest acquisition - several oil paintings of DH as a tot, painted by his grandmother.  Grandma was a dear but she was no artist.   :o   I may be going to hell for posting this, but what in the world am I supposed to do with these?

Modified to add - funny that I've posted this in the Budding Relationships forum.  I've found that since dating NG, I'm  ready to move forward, purge and feeling ready to start again.  Feeling less and less married these days, a good thing. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on June 10, 2017, 12:54:10 PM
Tryingtobreathe,

Thanks so much for your post.  I am in the same boat.  Live with MIL a mile away.  She gave me a box of pictures, unlabeled!  I went through them, gave back who I was clueless about.  She went back and  marked them and gave them back.  UGHGHH!  What to do?

NG and I looked at a house and I offered, and it is mine as long as everything goes.  WE are moving forward.  My house, as his ex is not having access to it or my assets.  Anyhoo...  NG asked that my pics of DH and his Marine Corp stuff not be displayed in the new house with both of us.  Hmmmm....  My son is still here.  Still his dad. I think my son will have what he wants to display in his room.  He has the flag and pictures already displayed.  I guess I thought we could incorporate some family pics.  He is divorced, so no desire for pics of him and his ex.  I have two pics up in the living room with DH.  A family pic, the last with my father before he died.  One couple pic. I understand putting that one away.  This is so complicated.
So, just store them all away? 

I have decided to take what MIL gives and then dispose of it as I see fit versus telling her no.  Less hurtful, I believe.  DS has no need for all the old stuff.  He isn't connected to that side of the family much.  He and his dad were only children.  The IL side didn't reach out to me afterwards, so I have no real connection.  So it goes.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 10, 2017, 03:58:33 PM
Purging is cathartic. I have two broken vehicles in my driveway; I used my working vehicle to push the car into the garage yesterday and overnight decided I needed to shift some things around to have more room in there. I went through my lateral file and found some photos of the first husband and I. I found cards his family had sent us; they referred to me by a shortened version of my middle name, which I hated. They did it because he said so. I found wedding photos of us. I trashed them all. I moved things around and gave things away. I need for this house to be as mine as possible. I suspect my son's old room will be next. LH's daughter is the only one who's ever slept in there besides my son and I am not opening the possibilities for her to stay here. Things are as they are with NG and I just want to be the best catch I can  ;)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 11, 2017, 10:55:56 AM
tybec   How funny that the pictures were returned to you with labels!  ;D  I seem to be the dumping ground for my IL's purge - whatever DH stored in their basement for many years, is being given to me.  This has included childhood sports equipment, trophies, photographs, school awards, etc.  It's all too much.  I'm slowly purging this stuff too, I'm incredulous that they think I want any of it.  Definitely less hurtful to take it and dispose of it later.   I can understand your NG's request to not have LH's pics displayed, but harsh to not allow anything at all.


arneal  Yes, purging is so cathartic.  I'm sorting and giving away the last of DH's clothing that's in my closet, I want this house to be only mine.  Organizing my surroundings is giving me a different mindset - more clarity and purpose I believe.  Baby steps .....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 11, 2017, 03:09:29 PM
Agreed, trying2; I cleaned my garage last year/early this year. Or so I thought  ;D The clothing was one thing I did almost right away. I gave all of it to the local homeless community. I kept a few items but then put them in a pile of things for his daughter; she had asked me about some of his clothes. If she doesn't make her way out here, I guess I would ask her friend who lives out here to take it and hold it for her or it all will be given away at some point should I get to a point of leaving this house. As it is now, it's all in a cabinet in the garage, out of my sight.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on June 12, 2017, 09:44:59 AM
Unrelated to relationships but i am a museum curator and history museums are america's dumping ground for people's stuff. People think they're doing something charitable, but what they don't realize is we have very limited resources to deal with this stuff and we can only collect what is within our collecting scope. It has to have research and exhibition value. And quite frankly, I have a great deal of training and experience in order to make that determination that the average person does not have. Yet people try to tell me, you need to preserve this, this is really important. Nine times out of ten, the answer is no, it really isn't. We don't collect memorabilia, we collect artifacts. HUGE difference. And just because something is old does not me it's historically significant, or in scope.

Sorry for the rant. Honestly Tybec, I think it's a little unreasonable of your NG to want you to purge your home of those things while your son is there. It's your son's home too. I've been thinking of moving say, the giant engagement picture of Dan and I to K's room. But there will always be pictures there.

My BF's daughter lives in another state. She is here every other weekend. Yesterday we were talking about how we don't want her to think her times here are visits. We want her to think of it as her MI home and her IL home. If BF ever moves in, that means his daughter should have things that make it feel like home to her. That may include having pictures of her mom, and let me tell you, I loathe that woman. But i wouldn't feel comfortable with her feeling like she has to confine those images to her room.

I feel more comfortable adding pictures than taking others away. So i have pictures of my boyfriend and  i along side pictures of Dan and I. But there will always be images of Dan in my home. Even when K moves out. He is part of me. I need BF to understand it, and I think he does.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 12, 2017, 10:46:33 AM
Artifacts, not memorabilia -- great distinction, MrsDan, that goes beyond the museum, doesn't it? I consider the two photos I have of LH as artifacts. I consider the artwork that he did and I still have displayed around the house as artifacts. I only need a few as representations -- not everything.

LH and I never took lots of photos together. It's only been within the last few months that I've gotten over not taking photos of myself. I only have one with NG from when we went to an escape room experience last fall. Funny -- we went to a movie yesterday and there was a photo booth outside. When we were going into the theatre I said we should get in the photo booth and make faces. When we came out of the movie there were people in it, so no photos :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on June 12, 2017, 11:53:42 AM
Tybec, I think your bf is being wholly unreasonable in his request to remove LH from your new home. Especially since you have a child. That's just plain ego talking there. Does he object to displaying memorabilia of all dead people in general or is it simply LH in particular? Would he have a problem with a picture of your late father being displayed? Why or why not?

You have a son. How do you think he is gonna feel if you ask him to hide any reminder of his dad? How is he going to feel if your bf decides to take this one step further and forbid you two to talk about your late husband altogether? You have a dead husband. Your son has a dead father. Your bf needs to grow up and realize you have a past and you're not going to act like it's some kinda shameful secret. How is this guy gonna be any kind of decent step-father some day if he has trouble acknowledging your son has a dad who he wants to be able to remember and talk about?

I'm assuming here you're not walking around acting all wistful and waxing poetic about your marriage to LH... perhaps you can try to explain it in psychological terms- the importance LH still plays in the life of your son, and in his future emotional well-being? I mean, I do get the feeling jealous, it's a natural thing. But sometimes one has to work through these feelings for the greater good-- or move on if they realize they just can't.

I am realizing how fortunate I am to have a bf who doesn't mind me displaying the wedding portrait my FIL painted. As long as I treat him as the number one man in my life, it's all good. And I don't even have any children. Hell, I still have pictures up of my dog who died 14 years ago...he was a damn good dog.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Forgottenwife on June 12, 2017, 04:13:18 PM
My BF's daughter lives in another state. She is here every other weekend. Yesterday we were talking about how we don't want her to think her times here are visits. We want her to think of it as her MI home and her IL home. If BF ever moves in, that means his daughter should have things that make it feel like home to her. That may include having pictures of her mom, and let me tell you, I loathe that woman. But i wouldn't feel comfortable with her feeling like she has to confine those images to her room.

I logged in just to say thank you MrsDan. Amazing the love you have for this kid and for her to come to her Dad's house and see pictures of her Mom is such a touching gesture. She will be lucky to have you in her life.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Metv on June 12, 2017, 06:45:40 PM
Tybec, I think your bf is being wholly unreasonable in his request to remove LH from your new home.


This exactly ^
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Sugarbell on June 12, 2017, 06:58:29 PM
I think any photos in your sons room is totally appropriate ...it's been almost 10 years and my oldest son still has a family portrait (8x10) right beside his bed on a nightstand. Him and his brother with DH and I (before sister was born)

But really...I haven't had photos of DH throughout the house in years probably 8 years. I would feel weird buying a new home with new guy-mowing forward and having pics of DH in it in common living spaces.

Kids rooms? Yes..they can have pics as long as they want..Shoot my son I think will always have that one pic. It's his memory of his Dad. But my heart (in a romantic way) is no longer attached to DH...just as the father of my kids.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Metv on June 12, 2017, 07:33:43 PM
I dun understand why it has to be a huge issue though. As long as it's not overwhelming. Maybe shows respect, ok so we move on. A photo, is harmless. Just my experience (not saying "couples" photo), that could be a bit different, admittingly.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on June 12, 2017, 09:37:10 PM
 I haven't shared space in a cohabitting way but Any pictures that were up and about before he passed away are still up and about......they are mostly some cool vacationing pics.....not engagement/wedding or portrait type things. My boys still live here it is our house and I'm not about to eradicate the picture memories.

When I was previously dating a divorced fellow I actually found it weird when he had no photos of his past life around.......i met his ex , knew his kids....IDK
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 13, 2017, 12:13:22 PM
Some folks aren't 'picture people'. NG doesn't have photos up. Didn't in the old place either. He does have a good collection on his phone and occasionally posts on social media (granddaughter, daughter, mom, dad, siblings). He has posted a couple of 'memories' on Facebook from before his divorce but hasn't done that in a while. I haven't trolled his photo album to see if he left the ex's photos in there (she's not his kids' mom -- I don't think he had any photos of her) but I have a feeling he might have gotten rid of them because it was not a pleasant parting.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on June 13, 2017, 10:08:21 PM
Thanks all for the input.  We have some communication to do.  NG has told me to keep lots of DH's things for our son.  I have a golf bag with his name, his foot locker, senior letters, stuff like that.  I thought we had cleared it up about keeping lots of things in my son's room, and NG was great with that.  I guess he may think having it up in the living room is much.  Room for discussion.  I am not angry.  More curious about this situation. 
 
Oh, and DH was a Marine, Enlisted,  and then worked for the Nightstalker's as a civilian.  NG is retired Lt. Co. Air Force.  Yeah, there is some stuff there, I don't doubt.  The different branches have their competitive natures, I guess.  No biggie for me.  I don't see DS headed to the military, actually.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 14, 2017, 11:48:35 AM
tybec -- you made me smile with your post. LH was a percussionist, I DJ'ed in college, and NG plays guitar for fun. Yeah, there's usually stuff :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 14, 2017, 12:07:16 PM
So a funny thing happened in the social media world ...

My son is doing better after his hospitalization for pneumonia; during that time I took a break from social media. I was also quite anxious about my own health, having been to my annual checkup and coming back with a diagnosis of getting old :) I have all the body aches and so on as a menopausal woman (yay  ::) ) and needed to decompress. I realized I was feeling a good bit of jealousy over folks who were sharing anniversary photos, flowers on their desk received just because from their beloveds, great happenings with their children ... and I don't like feeling that way. It's not my normal space. So, my cure was to get away from it for a while to get my head on straight. I popped in to let folks know about my son's progress and that was about it.

Once he was released from hospital, I resurfaced a bit. I went to NG's place on Sunday and we went out for dinner and a movie. I hung out for a little bit and then came on home. I posted on social media a little bit; one thing I shared (for the benefit of my friends and family back east who always freak out about how hot it gets here in the southwest) that I was getting my house AC fixed this week because by the end of the week it's due to be 100+ degrees F. NG popped on and volunteered to try and fix it for me once I got the diagnosis. We had had a deep discussion of the movie we went to see and I wrote a blog post about it; NG popped on to continue the discussion, even though I only loosely suggested I'd gone to see the movie with someone. He made a post about a health issue and I replied to it; my post included an offer to make one of his favorite dishes for Father's Day. He replied positively; it was like we were just having a conversation rather than posting all out there for the world to see.

I realize that such interactions are now the new norm of how we connect during the week. I am still not on it as much as I was before while I try to get my own headspace right. I went for a mammogram yesterday and am praying for good results; I am anxious generally since my mom had breast cancer last year (even though my doctor told me I shouldn't worry because she was 73 when it showed up which means my chances of getting it in my late 40s is slim to none) and with the menopause anxiety ... yeah, no fun. But nonetheless, the public conversations made me smile.

More junior high moments of dating  ::)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on June 14, 2017, 04:28:48 PM
Arneal perimenopause sucks. I totally get how your feeling. I started about a year and a half ago (I'm 41), I had never even heard of it before then! I have no sisters and my mom doesn't talk about that kind of stuff. So I'm learning as I go for sure. The symptoms come and go, I seem to be doing well now. But yeah the crazy emotions, irregular and very heavy cycles, and other body changes are not so fun. Getting older is no picnic, I hope your symptoms subside or at least improve! Glad to hear your son is doing better too!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 14, 2017, 05:21:01 PM
Thanks so much -- I am an only child and also had no one to tell me the wonders of this time of life  ::) I am 48 and Mom certainly never talked of such. We never even had a birds-and-bees talk. I am grateful as I could have started much earlier; I had a partial hysterectomy when I was about 41 so had they taken my ovaries too, I might have gone full on then.

Funny story: when NG was moving, I went over there to help on the last day with the cleaning. Out of the blue he asked me if I had heavy periods. I was stunned for a second but replied that I'd had the partial hysterectomy and didn't have to worry about that anymore. He explained that he had ordered an iron supplement for his daughter, knowing that the cycle depletes iron in our bodies, she didn't use it, and he didn't want it to go to waste. Ha!  :P
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 15, 2017, 03:37:11 PM
Happy Thursday all:

So on top of everything going on emotionally with this menopause business, I get a letter today after my mammogram that I had on Tuesday (yep, two days later) that they want me to go back for a re-screen because of 'an area of concern'. I am terrified. My mom had breast cancer last year but is in hear 70s, which the doctor said should not be cause for concern for me. I have a couple thoughts about the whole matter:

1) this medical facility is more thorough and want to follow up on everything. I'm a new patient and my records are on request from the previous medical facility I had when I worked full time. I had calcium deposits in the past, which is what showed up when I went for the re-scan.

2) the doctor was full of crap and there's something serious going on, which is the source of all my discomfort.

I am tired of fighting. I don't mean that like I'm giving up or anything but that I feel like I can't catch a break. Just when I feel like things are on a good flow with NG, my son is on the mend, I am staying afloat financially, there's this. From a superficial and selfish menopausal place, I am not trying to be sick because I am afraid of being a potentially weak or sick partner. I know the toll it took on me when LH was sick. I don't want to be that person for anyone.

I have to go to the ophthalmologist on Monday and am stressed about the possibility of eye issues as well. It's just a lot all at once.

Maybe I'm just thinking the worst. Regardless, it sucks.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 16, 2017, 08:47:30 AM
arneal   You are dealing with a lot - hope that the recheck turns out to be nothing, just a precautionary visit.  Yes, you are thinking the worst - keep breathing, and keep us posted.  (((Hugs)))
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 16, 2017, 09:24:38 AM
Thank you so much, trying2. I appreciate it and will keep everyone updated. Of course it's like every ache and pain in magnified and my feelings are super-sensitive.

On top of it all, when I called my mom to tell her, I got a sort of 'you will be all right and let me tell you about my day' reaction. Really?

I told NG I'd make jerk chicken for Father's Day so I made my marinade yesterday evening. My current mood has me anticipating that he'll bail. Just feeling miserable all around.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on June 16, 2017, 11:59:54 AM


On top of it all, when I called my mom to tell her, I got a sort of 'you will be all right and let me tell you about my day' reaction. Really?


I had no idea we were long lost sisters! Seriously, that type of behavior is one of the biggest reasons I do not have a relationship of any substance with my mother. Regardless of whether or not it is as serious as you fear, you're is real and that is distressing for you. I'm sending positiove thought's your way. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 16, 2017, 12:13:46 PM
arneal   Sorry that your Mom was dismissive.  I took it as her trying not to show concern, having gone through what she has trying to not show how worried she may actually be.  It does seem dismissive of your worries though, and not supportive.  It's not as if changing the subject and talking about her day will actually make you forget what's going on  :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 16, 2017, 02:33:59 PM
Thanks, MrsDan and Trying2 ... my mom's family are like that. She didn't mean any harm but they don't do well talking about serious issues. It felt quite dismissive and so I need to just step away and deal with things in my own way without expecting much from them. Fortunately I have other things to occupy my time :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 16, 2017, 03:37:54 PM
On a lighter note, sort of, it's June, which means this weekend is Father's Day and next weekend is NGs birthday. My newest neurotic concern is not going overboard on celebrating :) I love looking for unique gifts and have what I think is a nice bunch of stuff for his birthday, including some British chocolate bars (he did his DNA earlier this year and discovered he has a heavy British history). I mentioned that I was willing to cook jerk chicken for Father's Day and am wondering if he'll take me up on making it a 'family' thing with his daughter and her boyfriend. I settled my mind that if he doesn't, I will send him home with a bunch of food because I have planned to make enough for more than just the two of us.

For those of you in budding or committed situations with men who are dads, what are you doing for them this weekend?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on June 16, 2017, 03:50:28 PM
Father's day.  A bit of a landmine.  I let my son decide what to do.  His father.  We have planned special days, me and him alone all these years.

NG has two sons.  He does not have them that week, but gets them Sunday for Father's Day.  My son does not want to do anything with them, which is fine.

His birthday was Wed., NG's.  Had dinner with him and his boys, his mother and my son last night.  Gave him a gift certificate to an indoor shooting range.  WE have talked about going shooting together sometime, but he can go and release some stress on his own.  WE decided no gifts this Christmas, but to do an experience together.  We haven't planned the experience for our birthdays ( mine was in April).  He still got me flowers and took me out to eat back then.

Got him a cheesy dad t-shirt and nice card and snuck it in his truck before I left last night.  I like to do little things like that. ;) His boys will think the t-shirt is funny.  They are still little guys.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 17, 2017, 08:21:59 AM
Planning on spending Father's Day morning with NG, the New York Times and coffee sitting poolside. Hoping that the weather cooperates.   NG has two daughters and both live far, so he's pretty much on his own on Sunday.  Didn't get him any gifts, as we're still very much at the budding relationship stage.  Wish I could spend more of the day with him, but I'm hosting a BBQ for my Dad later in the afternoon.


arneal   Jerk chicken, yum!  I lived in Kingston, Jamaica for 2 years and loved the food there.  Would you consider sharing your recipe?   :D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 18, 2017, 03:31:41 PM
Hi, trying2 -- I've never been to Jamaica but would like to go one day :) I'll post the recipe below for the chicken and dirty rice. One thing I'm guilty of is messing with recipes; never just leave it as-is, so I encourage you to switch up any ingredients you want to see what happens. You'll see my notes as well.

I messaged NG early in the day yesterday and cooked in the afternoon. I took it over to his place as his daughter was taking him to breakfast today (I think that's her go-to ... I remember her taking him to breakfast last year for his birthday) and while his daughter and her boyfriend didn't sit and eat with us (primarily because NG was ready to eat as soon as I hit the door and didn't call them and two because they were off to the pool), they did have some and everyone enjoyed it. NG and I watched TV, talked, and played a game (called the Irrational Game -- it has the potential to be fun, but has some issues. Supported it on Indiegogo). It was a good day. Interestingly he had given me the option of cooking yesterday or today and shared that he has to go out of town for work on Monday, so I said I'd do it yesterday so he could get rest today. However, I didn't leave his house until about 3 am and he said he might come over to my house today. Too funny.

Anyway, on to the recipes!

Jerk Chicken based on a SimpyRecipes.com recipe :)
Ingredients:
1/2 cup white vinegar
2 Tbsp dark rum (I don't drink rum very often so I used cooking sherry this go; I've also used whiskey)
2 Scotch bonnet peppers (or habaneros), with seeds, chopped (my market seemed to have stopped selling scotch bonnets; I found out that they are sweeter and hotter than habaneros, but habaneros work very well)
1 red onion, chopped
4 green onion tops, chopped
1 Tbsp dried thyme or 2 Tbsp fresh thyme leaves, chopped
2 Tbsp olive oil
2 teaspoons salt
2 teaspoons freshly ground black pepper
4 teaspoons ground allspice
4 teaspoons ground cinnamon
4 teaspoons ground nutmeg
4 teaspoons ground ginger (I didn't have any ground ginger so I subbed 2 extra teaspoons allspice and 2 extra teaspoons nutmeg)
2 teaspoons molasses (I always use real Maple syrup)
1 (5 or 6 pound) roasting chicken, cut in half, lengthwise
1/2 cup lime juice (I've used lemon juice or squeezed real lemon)
Salt and pepper

1 Put vinegar, rum, hot peppers, onion, green onion tops, thyme, olive oil, salt, pepper, allspice, cinnamon, nutmeg, ginger, and molasses into a blender. Pulse until mostly smooth.
2 Place chicken in a large freezer bag. Pour lemon juice over the chicken and coat well. Add the jerk paste to the chicken pieces and coat well. Seal the bag . Refrigerate overnight. (I refrigerate for two days)
3 To cook the chicken, remove chicken from the marinade bag. Put the remaining marinade into a small saucepan. Bring to a boil, reduce heat and simmer for 10 minutes. Set aside to use as a basting sauce for the chicken. Make a sauce for serving by using the remaining marinade after it's cooked by adding ketchup and a bit of soy sauce; I put in enough to cool it down a little and give it a slightly different flavor.

Dirty rice (based on a picysouthernkitchen.com recipe :)
Ingredients
1 (14-ounce) can chicken broth
1 bay leaf
1 1/2 cups long-grain rice
1 tablespoon bacon grease or Vegetable oil
1/2 pound ground beef (I used ground turkey and just added a bit of extra black pepper when browning it)
1 medium onion, chopped (I used a sweet onion)
1 celery rib, chopped
1/2 green bell pepper, seeded and chopped
1/2 cup finely chopped chicken livers (I cooked off the remainder of the liver to give to my dogs because the container has much more than a half-cup :) )
2 cloves garlic, minced (since I was using a garlic press, I used three cloves)
1/2 teaspoon salt
2 teaspoons Cajun Seasoning, I like Tony Chachere's
1/4 teaspoon dried thyme
Instructions
Set aside 1/2 cup of the chicken broth and pour remaining chicken broth in a medium saucepan. Add 1 1/2 cups water and bay leaf. Bring to boil. Add rice, cover and cook 20 minutes.
Heat bacon grease in a cast iron Dutch oven (used my T-Fal Dutch oven as I only have cast iron pans). Add ground beef and crumble it with a wooden spoon.
Once the ground beef is crumbled, add onion, celery, and green pepper. Cook stirring occasionally until beef is no longer pink and vegetables are softened. Add chicken livers and garlic and continue to cook 5 minutes.
Add salt, Cajun seasoning, and thyme.
Add reserved chicken broth and scrape the bottom of the pan to release all the brown pieces. Let simmer 1 minute.
Remove bay leaf from rice and add rice to Dutch oven. Stir it into the ground beef mixture. Keep the heat on while you stir. Once it is combined well, remove from heat.

Once we sat down to eat, we used some of the sauce from the jerk chicken on the rice.

Would love to hear if anyone tries these recipes and how you enjoyed them! If you don't like spicy foods, you can probably just not use the peppers in the chicken recipe, but it won't be jerk chicken :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 19, 2017, 05:11:17 PM
arneal   Glad that Father's Day was a good day for you all.   NG and I enjoyed morning by the pool and got in some jacuzzi time.  I had to prepare for an afternoon BBQ with my Dad, so he left and I spent a few hours searching for rhubarb to make an apple & berry pie.  Discovered that rhubarb around here is almost impossible to find but was happy to finally track some down.  Thanks so much for the jerk & rice recipe, I'll definitely prepare it soon and let you know how it goes.  We love spicy around here so shouldn't be a problem using any of those ingredients.  I remember well the scotch bonnet peppers in Jamaica, they are some of the hottest around but habeneros would work well too.  Just thinking that maybe we should start a recipe/cooking topic  :D


On another note - NG are getting along really well, but still I don't want to be in a committed relationship.  I was intrigued by a free weekend on one of the on-line dating sites so messed around there and was tempted by some of the profiles.  I created a profile but didn't post a pic, but am thinking that maybe I will.  I realize it's a long shot to try and find somebody on-line, and I have the matchmaking service that I'm working with too.  Just feel like I need to check it all out before getting into a committed relationship.  Ughhh - this is difficult.  I feel like it's heartbreak waiting to happen and I feel badly about it.    NG - guess I should loosely use this term - is a great guy that I love being with. He realizes that I'm not yet ready to commit but so far he's waited.  I expected to find a fun person to hang out with but not get so deeply into emotions at this point.  He's asked me several times to be his "girlfriend" and so far I've said no.  The thought of breaking things off with him is not something that I want to consider.   This is very junior high I realize - anybody else go through something similar?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 19, 2017, 06:29:33 PM
Yes, trying2, please let me know how the recipes show up. Hey -- a recipe post might be a good one!

I definitely think I am the junior high one in this thing with NG. I would love to be in a voiced committed relationship. That said, I believe we are committed but that my view is different than his of what committed means :) He's referred to me as 'his lady' and 'the person he is seeing' in casual references but I don't know if he uses 'girlfriend' when talking to anyone. Or if I get mentioned at all. I almost wrote those three powerful little words in a text message yesterday; his daughter bailed on taking him to breakfast and he wasn't sure if she was going to take him to dinner but was really feeling down in the dumps about the situation, so much so he just wanted to stay in rather than get together. We hadn't made formal plans anyway (he had to leave today for that business trip plus it's hot as blazes to be out and about anyway) but were texting and he was apologizing for not being in the best of moods. I pulled it in and told him that there was no need to apologize, sent two kiss emojis instead, told him to drive safely, and that we would connect when he got back at the end of the week. Sucks if he's miserable since next Monday is his birthday.

So yeah, my junior high thing is a bit different :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 20, 2017, 02:25:54 PM
arneal  Sounds like it's a committed relationship and he's just not voicing it.  Maybe it's not his style.  My NG uses old term phrases like girlfriend, as he's in his mid-50's and doesn't know any different.  Last week he asked me to come over to watch Netflix and chill, and had no idea what that term today really means.  Dating is so much more complicated, many more factors involved as well as past history for both of us.  I'm not sure if he talks about me with his kids, I have no choice as mine are home with me right now.  So yeah ... we're in different situations yet somehow it seems like we're dealing with similar stuff too.  I think that I will move forward in dating others, not sure if something will work out but I'm pretty sure I would regret not at least trying.  NG may be the one for me but I'm just not sure yet.  Disappointing that his daughter bailed for Father's Day - darn kids, what are they thinking?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 20, 2017, 02:40:14 PM
Yes, trying2 ... he has a complicated relationship with his daughters; the younger one and her daughter live with him (although the granddaughter spends more time with grandmom and I've never met her or seen her at the house even and now with school out, she's there even less I gather) but he is estranged from his eldest. I texted him yesterday after he arrived at his worksite for the week to ask if he was okay. He texted back that he was, so I am guessing she did do dinner. Or he just decided it wasn't worth messing up a work week being upset about it. I was watching the show 'This is Us' last night and ended up writing a blog post about a dream that was inspired by the episode I saw. Guess my own fears came out. Feel free to read it here: http://starvingactivist.com/blog/2017/06/20/i-dont-share/ (http://starvingactivist.com/blog/2017/06/20/i-dont-share/).
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 20, 2017, 09:17:05 PM
So much for moving beyond widowhood: got a sales call and told the guy trying to get me to buy the all inclusive trip that I was in no position to travel as I was still trying to get myself together after the death of my husband.

Not a complete untruth but I felt horrid after I hung up.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 21, 2017, 08:30:08 AM
I still play the widow card on occasion, and usually don't feel badly about it.  Nobody needs to know that I'm almost four years out and for the most part over the worst logistical nightmares and darkest days.  Sometimes it feels good to just put it out there. And the widow card is especially handy for those pesky sales calls!  ;)


Your blog post is timely, arneal, as I work out the relationship with NG and try to figure out whether to move forward with him.  I feel horrible that he may think that he's second fiddle to anybody, yet my openness to dating others must leave him with exactly this.  I've been completely honest with him on the fact that "we" date others, and yet he says that only sees me and will wait.  I think there's a bigger issue - I knew from the start that he was special, have never felt so close to anybody so quickly.  And this scares the hell out of me.  Whew - posting stuff here that I've never expressed and it feels like a therapy session ....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on June 21, 2017, 08:38:30 AM
It seems like I end up saying "since my husband died" or "when my husband died" a lot. It's just a fact of my life, a major turning point so I use it as a point in time in conversations. But I worry that sometimes people think I say it looking for sympathy and attention, but I really am not. It just is what it is!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 21, 2017, 08:59:39 AM
trying2 -- this is absolutely therapy for me  :P I have one cousin who has been married three times and all three husbands have died (she was married to the first and third when they died and divorced from the second one when he died) and she's only about two or three years older than me. However, she is on a much different path and I don't talk to her about relationship stuff much. I mention NG and she is happy that I have him, so we leave it at that.

Yes, daysofelijah, it is a fact of life. However, the moment it fell out of my mouth yesterday it felt disingenuous. I am binging on the show This Is Us and in one of the episodes I watched last night, the 70+ year old widowed doctor was just over a year out from the death of his wife from cancer; he still had all her stuff around, clothes in the closet, medications in the bathroom cabinet. He talked to her at breakfast. His son was on him about moving on because he and his wife were worried. The doctor went to the cemetery and talked to his wife. He told her that he wasn't sure he could go on doing what he had been doing and wasn't sure she wanted him to. He got rid of all her stuff -- a truck came and took the wheelchair, he folded and packed her clothes, cleaned out the bathroom items. The last scene was him having dinner with a widowed woman he knew from the neighborhood who had expressed interest in him. Of course I cried. I want to just get on with it. I wish I had the ability to pack up all the stuff LH's daughter wants and send it to her instead of having it out in the garage. I want to pay off the loan I have on the SUV (that's broken and not running anymore) he always drove so I can get it out of my driveway. I know it will happen, but I feel like I'm ready for it to be done, now.

It's probably more of the menopause moments and worry about my own health and will settle once I know whether I have any issues going on with my eyes and what's up with the asymmetry they found in my mammogram ... sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on June 25, 2017, 06:48:48 AM
ok writing out my thoughts here to see if anything becomes clearer.
 I met NG in January. He loved me immediately. I on the other hand have been very cautious with my heart. I'm a thinker, not one to jump into emotions quickly. I've had moments when I definitley love him but then they sometimes fade as well , so it's not 100%.

Which brings up my first question ....at this age ( I'm in my 50's) can we fall head over heels in love or is it more a practical love?


Second point, sort of related to the first, because he is so in love he would be happy spending every free moment with me. He's a boss of a small business which basically runs itself so he has a lot of free time. I work 5 days a week and when the weekend rolls around, i was used to just puttering around , you know doing laundry, clean house , half watch a movie while I play on the computer, doing my gardening. But now I'm missing that because as soon as the weekend rolls around he has plans for us....don't get me wrong they are fun plans and it's nice but I miss my me time. I've tried to explain it, but he doesn't get it because he hates to be by himself. Even during the week when I'm working he is never just at home...he has a number of friends who he goes and hangs out with. I don't think he is capable of hanging out alone. So I don't think he gets that I almost need to do that every once in a while.

Related to this he is also horrible at saying goodnight....and it kinda leaves me with a sour taste in my mouth.  Example : last night we go out , have a great evening, ,it's 11:30( not real late but I'm ready for bed) and we arrive in my driveway and I'm totally ready to just give him a goodnight kiss , see you tomorrow type thing and he's clinging....he wants to come in....I say  for what reason, my boys( young men) are in the house watching tv etc, it's not like we can come in and have some romantic ending to the night plus I'm done for the night. He was not, he never is, there has not been one goodbye that just felt relaxed...it's always me saying OK I really have to go now....

So on one hand it does feel nice that he loves me on the other hand I have to figure out how to navigate this neediness of his.......especially since I'm a teacher and soon will have the summer off which I'm sure from his point means I will be available to hang out 100% of the time......

Any suggestions would be appreciated.....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on June 25, 2017, 09:14:31 AM
My feelings on your first question:  I am 48 and did feel head over heels in love in the early phase of my relationship with NG.  Then it evolved into a more practical, honest, real love.  For me, having a relationship at this age is different than when I was in my early 20's because we are both fully formed adults with needs and quirks and responsibilities.  We don't have the luxury of an all consuming love.  Chemistry and companionship become equally important and wanting to share a life together feels different than the neediness I felt when I was younger. 

When fiancé and I were dating he also had much more free time than I did and it did cause some conflict at times.  Now that we live together (and I'm down to only one kid with activities to go to) it's not an issue any more.  I think it's important for you to have your alone time and find a way to explain to him that this is the way you recharge and not because you don't enjoy spending a lot of time with him.  You don't want to start to feel resentful and if he loves you he should be able to respect that need.

The long goodbyes? I have no advice there, it sounds like he really hates to be alone.

I hope you are able to find a good balance so you can enjoy your summer!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 25, 2017, 09:21:47 AM
klim -- it is interesting, this 'me time' navigation and what we do with it. I went through a spell early on that I wanted to spend every possible second with NG (and still do, even though I've never told him that and try not to act like it lol). It was different because we both work so seeing each other during the week is impossible for the most part. It was the joy of being with someone healthy in my case; it seems rather harsh to see in writing but still, it is what it is ... I'd spent less time being a wife in the last half of our time together than being a caregiver and it was nice to be in relationship again. However, as time has gone on (we passed our year mark at the end of May; interestingly, I was listening to a replay of a presentation by a relationship guy who said that two people can't really know each other in just a year, which put it in perspective), I've found myself in a better place and am back to my own schedule.

That said, the way it happened was because NG went about his life. He kept his 'me time', even though it took a few months for him to get to a place of saying something to me like 'I need to take a day to myself -- the week has been brutal'. It made me focus back on all the things I love to do. Now, I go about my time and try not to be the one who texts first and so on. I love my freedom. Always have. I think the 25 years I've spent in marriage or something similar between two people has rubbed off on me, in that I also love being part of a two-some. It's a balancing act, isn't it, trying to be part of something whilst being us in total.

Might it be possible to sit him down and have a talk? Might it be possible to pull back a wee bit, not to the point of not being in touch but just to more strongly indicate that you need your own space? Maybe taking your children off to do things, just the bunch of you without NG every now and again?

Be loving and very present when you are together. Be who you need to be for yourself otherwise ...

On the long goodbye's thing ... as Trying wrote, that's a tough one. Maybe if you conquer the first point, this will correct as well.

Hope I didn't ramble too much there :) {{hugs}}
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Forgottenwife on June 25, 2017, 11:53:02 AM
Which brings up my first question ....at this age ( I'm in my 50's) can we fall head over heels in love or is it more a practical love?

Second point, sort of related to the first, because he is so in love he would be happy spending every free moment with me.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.....

Hi Klim, this sounds like my Chapter 2 relationship, although I am the one that head over heels, its been interesting! So in my opinion I have to say yes, we can fall head over heels ridiculously in love. I gotta say, my partner is not as intense as I am. Once we established a relationship, I wanted to spend a lot of time together (we didn't so much because I had teenagers at home and I parented first.) But, I want to be with this man all the time. We have been together more than 4 years now and I am crazy in love with this person, we jokingly call me a lovesick teenager.

When we were living apart and dating, I just had to deal with the fact that he was not as intense as I am, he likes some space. We moved in together at about the three year mark, but before we did, we had a meeting of the minds so to speak. Lucky for us, we can talk about anything and one of his concerns was that I like way more time together and he needs some down time. I have to be understanding of that and I make sure he has time to himself. I have to be my own person and find things to occupy my time. You know, I never took it personally, people just have different needs. I think it is more than reasonable for you to just want time to do gardening, or laundry or just veg out. Were I in your situation, I think I would just talk to your guy and tell him you need some time and space to yourself, now and always to be a happy and healthy person. That is just such a reasonable request.

Quick note, I imagine I would find a clinging goodnight behavior extremely unattractive. When something happens, with anyone, that gives me the creeps or as you said, leaves a sour taste in your mouth, I shut that down immediately. He's a grown man, I would be telling him to drop me off and say good night like an adult. I don't know, that is really uncool of him, and so not smart! You would think he would just want to say what a lovely evening he had and give you the best kiss ever, he's missing a great opportunity to leave you happy and secure. Not smart! I think I'd just have to tell him, if he can't handle it? Good luck. For me, communication is key.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on June 25, 2017, 01:31:18 PM
klim   Your relationship with NG mirrors my relationship with my NG  - and we too met and started dating in January.   I believe it's possible to fall head over heels in love in our 50's, for me there is a certain degree of practicality that needs to be met also in order to have a relationship.  I'm cautious with my emotions, my NG is carefree with his and continues to put it out there.  He wants to spend most free time together, and I'm left to play catch up on household responsibilities and feel terribly guilty about little time spent with my kids and aging parents.  This morning I backed out of spending the day with him, letting him know that I needed downtime and to have dinner with my Mom.  He understood, thankfully.


Like the others have posted, a conversation is definitely in order.  There's nothing wrong with taking time to yourself to take care of whatever you need to do.  I can imagine the frustration in trying to end an evening with him clinging, although difficult to do a stronger response to his persuasion is needed.  "I really need to get to bed - long day tomorrow" .... Repeat if necessary.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 25, 2017, 01:46:24 PM
Forgotten -- thanks for sharing. The fact that you and your NG had your discussion at the three year mark; it helps put things such as time in perspective. I remind myself in my case that although my NG and I have been connected for just around a year, we've only spent weekends together for the most part. If you count it in days, we've spent a total of maybe two months in each other's presence. Not a ton of time at all.

trying2 -- I agree with you; I never thought I'd fall head first like this at my age. Or any age as I too tend to be not particularly emotional, probably because the first marriage beat the possibility out of me ... I am still learning the art of open communication and am grateful because NG is good at it. Life is about learning and when it comes to this thing called relationships, the more we work at it, I hope the better we get :)

Have I said lately how much I appreciate each of you? Yes -- I do.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on June 25, 2017, 08:45:22 PM
I really feel for you, klim, because I am one of those people who likes LOTS of alone time. Always have, though widowhood seems to have intensified it. Solitude is what recharges me, but it seems I always end up in relationships with men who could be with me 24/7. When my bf began increasing our time together it did make me kinda anxious and I could tell he felt a bit put out by my need to be alone, but I just had to demand it anyway. Slowly I've just gotten used to him nearly always being around, but it's been an adjustment and honestly I do wish I had more space. It's been 3 years. Sometime I've just had to tell him: let me have some time to miss you.

I do feel passionate about him, about us- but it's still different from the younger me. Is it age? Widowhood? I just...I dunno...I hold a piece of me back somehow. And I am more quick to put up walls. But at the same time there are other ways that widowhood has made me a better partner. I do think we fell into 'domestic bliss' much more quickly than I have in the past, but maybe that's because I was married for 15 years? I'm better at setting boundaries-telling him what I need and what is unacceptable- so in some ways this feels like a more equal partnership than my marriage. I no longer feel the need to be married, even though I'm planning on this being my last relationship, have zero desire to look elsewhere. I'm totally content, even as I feel more capable than ever to also be okay being on my own.

As for his lingering good nights...you gotta nip that in the bud! Just tell him 'say goodnight, Gracie', give him a lovely hug and kiss, and send him on his way. Be loving, but firm! I have friends who hate the quiet- love crowds and noise and derive their energy from socializing, so I get his feelings but you can't sacrifice your mental well-being for him- he can get his fix from other sources/friends!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Metv on June 25, 2017, 09:29:17 PM
Klim although you seem new into this relationship, your (NG, hate that word), seems to want to all envelope you to being with him 24/7. I've had some experiences where 24/7 after widowing is not the best feeling for me. Yes, a good relationship is very hard to find, but it's the anticipation that makes for great times. If you're not ready for an all encompassing relationship, me, I would probably have that all weird odd talk. If he's really the one for you, he'll understand.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 26, 2017, 11:55:49 AM
Well-said, Bunny and Metv. While the dating scene and early relationship life is very junior-high, we are adults and can use our words :) It's never easy but creates a much better space.

Love that 'give me time to miss you', Bunny -- I read that on a relationship blog several months ago and it's always a great reminder!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 26, 2017, 05:47:46 PM
klim's post brings up an interesting issue about differences. The responses to her post seem to suggest that many of us have been going about this dating business in ways that might be different from how we were in our previous relationships or that we are navigating our 'new normal'. Ultimately, I would be so bold as to suggest that none of us are willing to settle this go as we continue in our new situations.

I had an interesting experience with NG (sorry, Metv ... 'new guy' feels better to my brain that identifying him by chapter since he would be my Chapter 3 I guess, since I've been widowed twice ...) this weekend. His birthday is today and I enjoy spoiling the person I'm with on their special day. Such spoiling usually begins with me asking what they'd like to do as it gets closer and involves getting little special gifts. I went to his place yesterday to take his gift and a cheesecake (which he asked for since his daughter was making dinner). He was surprised about the gift because he said it had been years since anyone had given him a gift. I had no words and it made me sad. His daughter and her boyfriend ate dinner and didn't call NG to let him know it was ready ... we had snacked before she finished but later he went out and saw that the meal was finished so then we made plates. I was sad again that she didn't have us all come to the table to eat together to celebrate her dad's birthday.

Maybe it's just me being sensitive to the differences in how families work. This whole spoiling on birthdays thing was something that I started doing during my time with LH. I wanted to create new traditions that weren't specifically based on anything I'd experienced or that he'd experienced and have carried on doing it again now that I am in a new situation. It feels all the more important because no one has done things to make NG feel special. He texted me later in the morning to thank me for making it a good day. I replied that I'd be a pretty awful signif, girlfriend, partner in crime, or whatever term he'd like to use as I wasn't all that good with knowing how the label thing works; we'll see how that goes :)

On a fun note, he broke the 'house rule' of no sleep-overs and I stayed the night again :) It's the first time in their new place and the second time ever. It was tough saying good-bye this morning but he had things to do and so did I, like get home to my dogs and my work day lol!

It's such a process of navigating all this relationship stuff. Whew!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Forgottenwife on June 26, 2017, 09:49:07 PM
Arneal, you are so right, figuring all the relationship stuff out is a process!

Sounds like you made your NG's birthday celebration pretty great, I hope that is a new experience going forward for both of you. I too enjoying making a big deal out of birthdays.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on June 27, 2017, 04:04:20 PM
Thanks Forgottenwife -- I hope so as well!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 04, 2017, 11:45:36 PM
Hope everyone is having or has had a good 4th of July weekend if in a place that celebrates it. I have had an interesting one. I was at NGs Sunday evening; I had planned if the situation to stay arose by enlisting my house sitters to let my dogs out later and on Monday morning. When I got there, he had saved me a parking space and when I drove to it, there were some people sort of in the way. I couldn't hear well but it sounded like he asked them if they would give way as his girlfriend was coming to park. Might have just been my wishful thinking though :)

We had just finished eating dinner and were watching television when I heard my mobile phone. I answered and it was the sitter, telling me that one of my dogs had taken off. She is horribly skittish and the fireworks have been going since Memorial weekend. It seems someone probably set off an M80 and she broke through my gate. I was about 40 miles away. I throw on my shoes, kiss NG, and take off for home. My friends and I drove the neighborhood until 2 am and could not find her. In the morning, I went out again and she came back, a bit worse for wear from breaking through the fence and not sleeping all night, but otherwise fine, thank God.

NG had off Monday and the 4th itself and wanted to come over as he was scheduled to work out of town for the rest of the week. I cooked and we did our own indoor BBQ last night, during which time he tells me that he doesn't have to go out of town after all, which was fine with me because when he goes, he always comes home wiped out from the drive and it limits our weekend time because I don't want to be there making him entertain me when he's tired or asking him to drive to my house after he's been on the road all week. He stayed and we hung out for most of today. I mentioned that it would be great to do a beach getaway and he agreed; we are planning it for next weekend.

Now here's the kicker: when we decide on the general location, he tells me that he has a pen pal in that area -- a woman who he had met online when he lived up north. She had asked him when he was moving down where she lived, he said he wasn't, but they remained friends. She has since married and so forth but since when he was online dating his profile said he was looking for friends or long-term relationship (just like mine), so there it is -- and that we could maybe meet her and her husband for dinner while we are there.

The suggestion actually made me smile because it said to me that he was comfortable enough to want me to meet this friend who might have at one point been more than a friend and her husband. That he wasn't worried that I'd freak out about meeting her. I've been thinking about suggesting he meet my son, which of course is different than this, but to be honest I don't have many friends here that I'd bother to introduce him to purposely. I mean, if we happened to be out somewhere and they were there, of course I'd make the intro, but to make plans? Not so much. Anyway, depending on how things go, I will give the son-NG meet up more thought.

Who would have thought I had to actually think about this stuff?  :D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on July 05, 2017, 05:14:50 PM
Oh my - so glad that your dog found her way home, what a scare!  Fourth of July and dogs just don't mix - I had the stereo up loud at my house, thank goodness neighbors on both sides were not home - and that seemed to help muffle  the noise and keep my dog somewhat calm.


If you think that your NG said "girlfriend", you may be right.   Yay on the introduction to his friends - to me it means taking it to another level, feeling comfortable in the relationship and moving it on to a couples thing.  And an introduction to your son might feel natural, after this introduction.  NG and I have been slowly meeting other friends, and it feels nice.  We've been together but solo for awhile, and it's been good to have interactions with others and discover more about each other.


Yup - stuff we have to think about!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on July 06, 2017, 06:34:16 AM
Moving forward.  Spent whole 4th weekend with NG and my son with his father and half brothers and nephews. Father is rich, paid for everything and house looks like a small resort.  But NG and he don't mesh.  NG says he is a poor father, neglected him and his sister after cheating on their mother. Many girlfriends and no money or child support.  His half brothers have everything.  Such a sad strange situation.  Had family pics done by professional.  His dad mentioned having all his grandsons there.  Nope, as NGs boys were with their mom.  Knife in the back for NG. There were more subtle comments.  They have their own flavor of crazy as does my family.  Only get together maybe once/twice a yr. and the father pays for it all, but all his choice/control.  My son got to attend his first professional baseball game and we had special box tickets to a food Buffett.  And son got to ride jet skis by himself and be on the boat that sleeps 8.  He got to shoot clay pigeons, rifles, shotguns for the first time.  He had a lot firsts so the father was generous.  Good family weekend, 3 nights, but saw the sadness for NG. 

Closing date for my new house may be the 21st.  Getting real!  My house under contract.  Inspection went well.  They want to move in before school, too, so happening. New life around the corner! 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 06, 2017, 10:41:38 AM
Glad things are going well, tybec, and hope you were able to bring some cheer to your NG despite the nonsense. Yeah, family is a trip! My NG has siblings with issues as well; his mom did a good job of separating her kids into factions it seems, based on their fathers. The brothers who are younger than NG have a different dad and it's like they could do no wrong. I think it was because of the stories he's told me over the past year about their dynamic that made me try to make his birthday a big deal because no one did that for him when he was younger. What a thing to watch your brothers get parties and no one does that for you or your sister? Just ew.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 09, 2017, 09:32:26 PM
Well, back from the weekend away. So on Friday, NG texts to say he is waiting to hear from work about mandatory overtime for Saturday. He ends up having to work that morning; when I got the message I replied that I was going anyway because I would lose money of I changed or cancelled the reservation and that I would miss him. He started apologizing and I was like, not your fault but this company that doesn't plan jobs well. He says he could come down in the company truck right after they finish. I was good with that since I did have a video meeting with students that I could not get out of. Saturday rolls in. I spent the morning on the beach, did my meeting, and was comfortably reading with my feet propped up when he got there. We went back to the beach and ended up doing dinner, just us; since he didn't know how the work thing was going to turn out he didn't call his friends, figuring it was too short notice. I agreed since I had tried to meet up on Friday night with one of my friends who lives in that town and wasn't able to. We chilled out and talked. Unfortunately the walls were thin so we were awake like every hour because there was a ehem, noisy and rabbit-like couple going at it  :-[

I was glad we had some time away, even though it was short. He has been getting up at like 3:30 to be at work by 6 because it takes almost 2 hours to get ro the job site, and even on Saturday it's probably close to an hour and a half. With all that he still drove another hour to the beach. Hoping next time will be better ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on July 10, 2017, 06:30:11 PM
Arneal,

Hard to have the schedules so tight!  At least you did have some time, but hope you can get another get a way sooner than later.

My NG is on vacation with his kids this week.  I was the last week of June with my family.  Have a nephew going to Abu Dhabi for missionary work, so big time to see him and his family as who knows when it may happen again.  Saw other nephew and family.  Been LH's  funeral since saw them, 5 yrs. plus.   Time goes fast.  They are my back-up for my son, so important to have the contact.

Did spend that time with NG with his family over the fourth, thankfully.  But it was not ideal.  My son on the couch, me on a futon and NG on an air mattress at his 24 yr old half brother's house.  Not exactly a spa setting, but still better than nothing.  ;)

Signing papers the 20th for new house.  Started packing, and it is HARD!  So many memories to go through, downsizing.  Overwhelming.  Why didn't I do more of this sooner?  Uggh.......

Lessons to learn.  Darn real life stuff interferring with the romantic stuff!  LOL!

Trying to focus on the JOY.  Looking forward, down the road instead of the rear view mirror.  The packing WILL be worth it all. It will be worth it.  It is time.   :)

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 10, 2017, 08:19:29 PM
Oh my yes, real life interfering! One funny thing that I think I may have mentioned in an earlier post ... I have the visitor's parking permit to NG's apartment complex; I mentioned I was going to give it to him and he told me to hang onto it and give it to him later that day. It's been like two weeks ... I didn't think of giving it over this weekend since we didn't ride together anywhere and when he walked me to my car when we were leaving, he didn't actually walk up to the window to look in to see it. It's like we are too busy to pay attention to details. That, or he doesn't care that I still have it, which is a good indication that he won't mind me staying at his place  ;D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: MrsDan on July 11, 2017, 11:48:19 AM
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Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 12, 2017, 11:29:12 AM
So sorry, MrsDan. Hoping you are taking care of yourself. {{{hugs}}}
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on July 18, 2017, 06:47:32 AM
ok tomorrow I'm heading out for a 3 week vacation with NG. The itinerary is exciting but my feelings are mixed.....I feel like this will be a big test of long term compatibility. As I mentioned before he has a hard time giving me space, here there will be no space.....hmmmmm.....well we'll see.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on July 18, 2017, 07:10:36 AM
3 weeks?!!  Wow, that will definitely be a true test.  I hope you have a great time!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on July 18, 2017, 09:49:58 AM
Good luck, klim!

I approached 5 weeks in Europe with my bf with the greatest of trepidation: we'd been dating less than a year, I'm someone who really needs my alone time, we were spending most our time in a country where only he spoke the language. Turns out we travel really well together, even with both of us getting sick. A few mini-squabbles, of course, but overall we were a good team. My husband was kind of a terrible traveler...it's strange to realize I've been on more vacations with bf in our 3 years together than in the 17 I was with DH.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 18, 2017, 11:03:49 AM
Oh, klim! Hoping things go fantastically well. Maybe on the way to your destination you can chat casually about the itinerary and try to include some 'you' time in there.

Bunny -- that sounds fabulous. I have done two short day trips with NG; I have to say I felt some type of way at first when he found out he had to work during this last one and we would not actually be going together, but in the end I realize it was necessary. I needed to drive there by myself. The last time I'd been on those parts of the highway had been with LH and my son -- it was a cathartic drive, cleansing in a way. I had the suite to myself Friday night, did a bit of exploring once I got there, went down to the beach (with LH and son we had never gone to the beach out there; I've been to two beaches with NG now and in all my time here with LH, we'd been to one beach two or three times ... other trips near the beach meant I often walked to the water myself to stick my feet in but we didn't actually have on suits and go out there together, know what I mean?) and walked around. I had work to do Saturday morning so had he been there, he would have had to entertain himself for a couple hours anyway. I had time to go to the beach by myself first thing, do my meeting, and get cleaned up by the time he got there. It was short, but like I posted, the fact that he would drive all that way after working such a grueling schedule meant a lot.

I hope once his work schedule settles a little we can talk about maybe taking a few days to go back east; he says he'd like to see his sister who lives in Philly and my mom lives in South Jersey still. However, I'd like him to meet my son first, who lives out here where we are ... so many thoughts ...

Anyway, onward, klim and all!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on July 18, 2017, 01:21:52 PM
3 and 5 week vacations!   I have never done that! Wow!  What a thrill!  And with NEW relationships!  That is huge! Bunny, so happy for you to have that experience.  It is like a strange dream, I bet.  Exciting!

Arneal, short trips are all I know.  I hope to something longer in the future but it just isn't realistic now.

NG came over Sat. and helped me go through tools to keep and let go.  Been setting there 5 1/2 yrs.  LH was a mechanic.  NG is not a handy man.  It was strange for him to do, but I appreciated it.  He then loaded up things and took them back on Sunday to his place and stored in his garage, saving me some money for paying the movers.

I took DS to church camp, came back through my soon to be new home and did some foot work Monday.  NG has said lots of things to me to tell me he is in this for the long haul.  He has told me He can be with me for now on out.  Talks about moving after the children are grown, travel.  He is so kind and devoted to me, when it is us.

So, sign the papers on Thurs.  I will have a new home after 17 years!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 18, 2017, 01:48:01 PM
That is beautiful, tybec -- happy for each of you!

It's funny; I have never been the expressive type when it comes to relationships; my parents were not like that and the first husband was too abusive for me to learn it. Second husband was very verbally expressive and after 16 years together I guess I got used to it. Now being with a man who doesn't express it verbally feels strange. We don't talk about what's next at all. The words 'I love you' have never come up. We don't have photos together. I occasionally try to send a flirty text but don't get a response.

Hope this isn't too TMI, but at Christmas, I think I shared this, I made him a gift of coupons -- for back massages, full body massages, and other more intimate play ... I included three blanks in there for him to decide what he wanted to cash them in for -- and every now and again he'll pull one out but it's always for the massages. I had put one in there for the fantasy of his choice and when he read it that day, he said his fantasies are pretty tame. Never gave a hint, has never mentioned using the coupon. From his stories, his ex was not very caring when it came to intimacy ... demanded 'f***king' instead of 'making love' sort of thing and he hated that, so I figured giving him space to share what he'd like would be cool. The closeness has grown over time, don't get me wrong. It took quite some time in the beginning for him to even kiss me goodnight, so I guess I shouldn't be surprised. For the most part I just let things happen as they do, no pressure. But it would be nice to get a glimpse into the future :) I think this is why the message series at church is about the harvest right now. My pastor's talk last week was about not stepping on the small sprouts of growth that, when left alone to grow and mature, turn into our harvest. We can ruin the crop if we mess with it. I need to listen to that talk again, daily perhaps :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on July 18, 2017, 02:54:16 PM
Haha I'm laughing, my guy is a farmer/business man. He quite often uses the analogy of planting the seed and watering it with regards to ideas.

With regards to love and life he is always full speed ahead......he works in greenhouses so from seeding to harvesting is 15 days....

I think that's how he views our life as well......I just have to keep reminding him I' not in the greenhouse my love grows slowly  and I'm trying to establish whether the soil is good and I can establish my self with good roots and feel secure.

see you can carry this analogy a long way.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 18, 2017, 03:40:57 PM
Ha! I am not that quick but I think I'd like a little verbal confirmation. Don't know if it's embarrassment or what. I mean, he has no problem holding hands, rubbing my back, kissing in public. He's even given me a foot massage -- used a hot cloth to wash my feet beforehand and all. I guess that's why I don't have good luck with houseplants ... I am waiting for them to say something, like the dogs or the cat :) However, I still have hope because my fish don't talk either and I've managed to keep them alive  ;D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on July 22, 2017, 12:34:20 PM
My NG flips from being very expressive to not being expressive at all.  It's as if he picks a day to get it all out and then poof! - nothing for several weeks.  I've never dated anybody like this, and am not sure what to make of it.  arneal  I'm giggling about your coupons - my NG is not one to pick up on nuances or hints, instead the direct approach works best with him.  I was away for a week with DD, upon my return NG & I made plans for dinner, etc.  :D   I let him know that I would meet him at his house with an appetite  ;)  Once I arrived, he stepped out, locked his door and sure enough we  headed for dinner.  I now know where his priorities lie!  LOL
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 22, 2017, 01:41:34 PM
trying2: that's a hoot! My NG loves his grub as well. If I want to make him smile, I bake brownies :D I feel bad though because I was cracking myself up the other night and sent a text in the third person ... something like "There's this girl who wants to go out with this guy on a Saturday night sometime soon, what do you think are her chances?" He wrote back with something like, "I really want to, I do, but I won't have any extra cash from this overtime for another week or two." He has been working like a dog because his company screwed up, getting up at 3:30 am every day. I know it, but was hoping it would make him laugh. He did mention a movie though, so I hope he saw the humor in it. Sigh. This dating thing, as my pretend little brother says, is so junior high. And it's not easy!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on July 25, 2017, 01:32:37 PM
arneal  I wouldn't feel badly about trying to connect through sense of humor, and it not quite being received in the way that you would like.  NG and I don't really match with our humor, sometimes I can be a goof ball and he's not - there are times when he doesn't know what to think.  LH was a practical joker, was always playing games and laughing, NG not so much.  It certainly isn't a deal breaker, just something for both of us to get accustomed to I guess.  Relationship with NG is so very different than what I had w/my LH, having been married for 20 years it's hard for me to come to terms with what a new relationship is supposed to be.  I feel as though I'm making it up as I go along.  :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 25, 2017, 02:52:55 PM
Ain't that the truth, trying2! Actually we both have a pretty sharp wit and 'get' each other's humor. I think he just isn't good at expressing the nuances of intimacy in this way? Not sure how to say that better.

Something funny happened this weekend though. My friend down the street is a Lularoe rep; she just made a year in business and was having a celebration. I told her that I probably wouldn't make it because NG and I were trying to get together on Saturday. She of course said, 'Bring him!' I asked her about the menu, shared it with him and got no real response. I had a new top I had bought from her and she showed me how to wear it like a halter, so I was hoping I looked as smashing as she thought I did lol. Saturday arrives and we start talking about what we're going to see at the movies and what we're going to do for food. I again mention my friend and he's not too enthused. We decide to get something at one of the places right in the same complex as the theatre (I think it was because he wanted to pay since for the last few times I've been the one paying; he can be sensitive about that sort of thing, wants it to be equitable if not more that he pays). I agree but say I need to go and let her know we aren't coming. I drive down and he waits in the car -- I am glad we didn't stay because it was I think all women except for my friend's husband (I used to hate to do that to LH, have him sitting there with no men folk to talk about while the women sit around and be women ... ugh. In this case, her husband works the Lula business with her so he probably would have been in and out of the house, working the deals). Before we had left my house, NG had stood back, looked at my top and said, 'That is nice!' He's made comments in the past about something I was wearing but that was the first time he had been so directly expressive about it. You know how some men will tell their wives, girlfriends, signif's that they are pretty or sexy? He's not that type. So I took this as very high praise!

Anyway, I go back to the car and my friend comes with me because she wants to meet NG. He rolls down the car window, she shakes his hand, and says, 'I have heard so much about you' (and I'm dying that she said it -- so junior high). He doesn't miss a beat and replies, 'And I have heard so much about your dogs' (this is the friend who has my boy dog's brother). Now I really die, right! She says that my main reason for coming down there is not to talk to the people but to the dogs and they both laugh. It was funny but I was glad to introduce him to one of my friends. The moment passed and nothing more was said about my little intro. Next I want to tackle having him meet my son. I've already worked up my conversation script so the next time we are together I am going to open up the discussion ... yikes!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on July 31, 2017, 03:17:35 PM
Happy Monday, all!

Am thinking of throwing a comment out to NG about solitary versus partner space ... or whatever I should call it.

Usually one or the other of us reaches out on the weekend to see what we might do together. I had been reaching out for the past couple weeks and after last weekend was feeling bad about it since he's keeping such a hard schedule during the week of getting up at 3:30 in the morning. I decided I wasn't going to say anything and leave it to him if he wanted to do something. I didn't hear from him on Saturday and then on Sunday he posted publicly that he had been in a bit of a depression about some things. Several of us left encouraging comments, which he acknowledged late in the day. I also sent a text later to offer more private encouragement, which he did not reply to.

So here's where I am -- and this will take many dips and turns! I am an introvert so I get the need for solitude. However, I feel like in times like this, when he's feeling distress, he cuts everyone out. Part of me says that if we are in a 'relationship', a response to a quick text or even an initial message to let me know in basic that he needs to be alone would be a good thing. Another part of me says that the cutting off of everyone is how he's always functioned and because of people in his life generally, he's not thought through why it should be different with me.

I am just wanting to make clear the roadmap of expectations here by letting him know that it would help me to know how to be supportive.

Am I being overly sensitive? Am I on the right track? Has anyone else been in similar straits?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 01, 2017, 02:52:34 PM
arneal  Although not easy I strive for open communication in a relationship, especially when things aren't going so well. For me, providing and having the support and understanding of a partner is part of the deal.  Maybe it is your NG's MO to shut down a bit when feeling low, and I get the part of needing solitary time. It should be different with you though, as you're in a relationship with him and you want more.  Once the clouds clear a bit, maybe suggest that he can talk with you about the hard times too?
Love this > "I am just wanting to make clear the roadmap of expectations here by letting him know that it would help me to know how to be supportive."
I would hope that by saying this to him it might open the door to him being more communicative with you.  I don't think that you're being too sensitive, laying out expectations in a gentle way I believe is a good thing.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 01, 2017, 03:39:58 PM
Thanks so much, trying2. I texted him some information from the essential oils video I was watching last night and said I had some of them and they might be helpful. He texted me back this morning to say he was struggling with that issue from the weekend and then some added job issues, so it sounds like he's really feeling it. He's off from work tomorrow so I might see him later today or sometime tomorrow ... am sort of nervous about exactly what I want to say but I'm working on it. Been doing things around the house so am going to practice in the shower lol!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on August 01, 2017, 05:58:54 PM
Text ignorer here...for me, it really is nothing personal. I just can't stand the expectation that I am forever at the beck and call of others- yes, even with those I love deeply- and especially when I am feeling down. When I'm out of sorts my phone exhausts me. I dunno, maybe I'm part dude?

Men do have their limits when it comes to having talks and their attention span can waver. I found it very helpful, in the first couple years of my relationship, to write letters which I would either put in the mailbox or send in an e-mail. I wrote them in order to get my feelings out properly and without any expectation that we would ever even discuss what I wrote. It was very cathartic, but I do recommend never writing and sending in haste. Hmmm...I guess I'm also a bit on the Victorian side also!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 01, 2017, 06:43:11 PM
Thanks, Bunny -- I totally get that! I keep my distance and have times where I expect to not be bothered LOL. However, in this particular case, I guess I expect (there's that horrid word ...) that if we are moving closer, I would get a pinch more consideration when he disappears. I found out along with everyone else via social media that he was having a struggle. Like trying2 said, I need to get clear on where the line is as I do not want to offend by crossing it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 03, 2017, 03:14:53 PM
Had an interesting day yesterday and the day before. Day before, NG replies to say he got my texts from Monday but was asleep and that he had Wednesday off and could come by. I said I had a light schedule so that would work; later I realized I wasn't sure if he meant he was coming Tuesday night or sometime during the day on Wednesday. I texted back and he messaged that the storms we had made it harder for him to get in from work and that he needed to go to sleep (he goes early because of his hours) but would come by on Wednesday. He drove over yesterday and we just spent time together. Talking, watching TV, I had a meeting online and he napped while I dealt with that. He held my hand while we watched TV. We ate some snacks and he had to leave because he had to get up early for work today. He said he would see me this weekend (rarely does he say specifically ahead of time).

It was a weirdly comfy afternoon. We didn't talk about anything too heavy, although I did ask him how he was feeling outside of the work stuff he'd been dealing with. He shrugged and gave a sort of noncommittal answer. I didn't press, didn't say any of the things I'd been thinking about wanting him to let me in a bit more. It just didn't feel right to do so.

During one part of our conversation about work, he made a comment about needing to save up money if he wants to start his own business. He commented that his daughter will have her degree soon and is getting the idea of being on her own (or at least building a life with her boyfriend, who she's been with for quite a while). He then said if he couldn't get out from the level of rent they are paying together, he would either never get enough put away to do his own business or he'd end up living on the street because of the expense. I said, 'Well that won't happen' and he didn't reply specifically to that but kept on with the business idea conversation.

Sigh. This is hard.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 04, 2017, 01:05:26 PM
I'd be hurt if I found out through social media that my NG was having some struggles. I don't think it's too much to talk with him about your hope for more communication.  Let him know where your line is and see if he's willing to meet it.  If not, figure out whether it's something that you can live with.   I'm dude-like also, my guy talks way more than I do about feelings and I've upped my game in talking with him, something I'm willing to do. 


Being comfy is a good place to be - it does seem that you're looking for more though.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 04, 2017, 08:13:12 PM
Thanks trying2. I wasn't hurt so much as confused a bit. I would of course like more with him and think he's a great guy. But he's got to get to a place where he is comfortable enough to share. Interestingly, he sent me a text today to tell me he has to work tomorrow and wanted to know if I wanted to get together for dinner. I was in meetings and didn't get back right away so he texted me again. I had to laugh. I am so not a good signal reader.

I talked to my son and plan to talk about them meeting. If we do get together tomorrow, I think I will bring it up ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 06, 2017, 08:48:20 PM
Hope it goes well for you, arneal.  How was the dinner together?  Easy does it, sounds like low pressure is the way to go with your guy.
I'm struggling lately, I'm in a relationship with a compassionate caring man and I'm resisting commitment.  I've begun to meet some of his family and he's met only my son, by accident. My daughter leaves for school in 2 weeks and I'm thinking that they should meet before she leaves, if only to have a face with a name.  After she leaves I'm by myself, well - other than the dog.  ::) It will be a new lifestyle and I'm hoping that things change for us for the better.   NG is low key and easy going, never a struggle about anything and he doesn't really have a problem about much of anything.  Everything is fine, at least so far.  It almost makes me want to stir things up to see if he has any emotions at all.

I struggle also with the time spent with him and keeping up with home and family responsibilities.  I'm grappling with kids at home, household duties and aging parents.  He has none of that, lives simply and is free to come and go as he pleases.  Sigh ..... it's been a hard weekend.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Portside on August 06, 2017, 10:04:43 PM
  Everything is fine, at least so far.  It almost makes me want to stir things up to see if he has any emotions at all.

T2B - I can't tell if that is being said with a wink or not but if not - please don't do that. Many guys would put that in the 'plays games' file and nothing good can come from that. Or it can be seen as some sort of 'test' and boy do many of us hate that. It's seen as "You know, I try to be a good, nice guy and then this."

To me this just has the feel of maybe a good thing or two could come from stirring the pot but there is a bigger chance it blows up. Free advice and probably worth what you paid. ;)

Good luck - Mike
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 07, 2017, 08:25:43 AM
"T2B - I can't tell if that is being said with a wink or not but if not - please don't do that. Many guys would put that in the 'plays games' file and nothing good can come from that. Or it can be seen as some sort of 'test' and boy do many of us hate that. It's seen as "You know, I try to be a good, nice guy and then this." "

(wish I knew how to use the quote function)

Portside - thanks for this.  I said it semi-seriously, not likely to stir things up needlessly as I'm not a game player.  More likely to take time off from this relationship to figure things out.  It's not feeling right, no need to mess around with him because of how I'm feeling about it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 07, 2017, 02:36:14 PM
Thanks for that, Mike. I think sometimes we want to stir the pot, not in a malicious or harmful way, but because we all still have a bit of neanderthal in us in a way ... when we don't know how to react in a situation, nothing beats the old grunt and growl method  ;D

Seriously though, trying2, it sounds like your guy is just in a relatively good place in life. I try to make that a goal as well, to not have much stress if possible. Is there a reason why you haven't introduced him to your children -- is it because you don't want commitment, or don't want it with him? No need to answer as I offer the questions as food for thought. There is a big difference between a desire for commitment and a desire for companionship and knowing where you are and where he is on the continuum will be important for both of you.

My weekend went well, thankfully. I love how the Universe often conspires in our favor. So I did respond (obviously) to the dinner request; I told NG I'd planned to make a certain dish that I hadn't tried before and suggested we could go with that or we could go out. He wrote back that he was intrigued by the dish I mentioned (tikka masala pork chops with rice and veggies), so we agreed we would stay in, eat, and watch movies. Dinner went so well that he said, 'Be sure to cook more chops next time, dear' LOL. We watched two movies, the first of which was a Swedish film called 'A Man Called Ove', which was very good, and Wonder Woman. Sunday morning on the way to breakfast, he asked about my son and his health, having remembered that Khalil had been in hospital a little over a month ago. We had breakfast and once we came back to my house, we were outside, looking at the mountains and talking about various adventures. I broached the subject: 'If you want a real adventure, what do you think about riding out with me to meet my son?' and he said he thought that was a good idea (can't remember exactly but it was something like that). I warned him that because of his special needs, Khalil has no filter and will probably be all up in his business. NG smiled and said something like that's what all young people do and he was welcome to ask anything. The conversation went on from there about other things.

Overall, I think it went well. Now, the real next step: setting up the meet and greet ... Yikes! I am thinking not this coming weekend but the one after.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: marriedwithkids77 on August 08, 2017, 11:39:56 AM
Thanks for that, Mike. I think sometimes we want to stir the pot, not in a malicious or harmful way, but because we all still have a bit of neanderthal in us in a way ... when we don't know how to react in a situation, nothing beats the old grunt and growl method  ;D

Seriously though, trying2, it sounds like your guy is just in a relatively good place in life. I try to make that a goal as well, to not have much stress if possible. Is there a reason why you haven't introduced him to your children -- is it because you don't want commitment, or don't want it with him? No need to answer as I offer the questions as food for thought. There is a big difference between a desire for commitment and a desire for companionship and knowing where you are and where he is on the continuum will be important for both of you.

My weekend went well, thankfully. I love how the Universe often conspires in our favor. So I did respond (obviously) to the dinner request; I told NG I'd planned to make a certain dish that I hadn't tried before and suggested we could go with that or we could go out. He wrote back that he was intrigued by the dish I mentioned (tikka masala pork chops with rice and veggies), so we agreed we would stay in, eat, and watch movies. Dinner went so well that he said, 'Be sure to cook more chops next time, dear' LOL. We watched two movies, the first of which was a Swedish film called 'A Man Called Ove', which was very good, and Wonder Woman. Sunday morning on the way to breakfast, he asked about my son and his health, having remembered that Khalil had been in hospital a little over a month ago. We had breakfast and once we came back to my house, we were outside, looking at the mountains and talking about various adventures. I broached the subject: 'If you want a real adventure, what do you think about riding out with me to meet my son?' and he said he thought that was a good idea (can't remember exactly but it was something like that). I warned him that because of his special needs, Khalil has no filter and will probably be all up in his business. NG smiled and said something like that's what all young people do and he was welcome to ask anything. The conversation went on from there about other things.

Overall, I think it went well. Now, the real next step: setting up the meet and greet ... Yikes! I am thinking not this coming weekend but the one after.


So true
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 09, 2017, 08:41:27 AM
Glad that your weekend went well, arneal.  Sounds like a meet & greet will happen soon, big step and it's great that it's moving along in a natural way.  And your evening was a comfy way to spend time with your NG, doesn't get any better than that!


About my NG - he is in a relatively good place, can't critique his lifestyle as it works for him and I'm not out to change anything about him.  We are exclusive and he's asked for commitment, and so far I can't distinguish between the two.  I'm avoiding the girlfriend label - something that he's asked for.  What I'm beginning to understand is that he's a good companion, it's comfortable and feels okay right now.  Commitment vs. companionship - what is the difference?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 09, 2017, 10:28:17 AM
I guess it's the depth of companionship in my mind, trying2; exclusive and spending some time together on a regular basis like for a day on the weekend is a serious form of companionship while having conversations about where things are going, talking about some sort of future together is heading more toward longer term commitment. The second definitely takes varying amounts of time and of course depends on what it is both people want as well as how soon they have the conversation. I think of my mom: she is very clear that she has a 'companion' -- they spend as much or as little time together that they want, he has his house and she has hers, and there is no desire to cohabit or marry. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on August 10, 2017, 01:23:18 PM
Oooh  I think I'm having a companionship vs committment problem.    I don't know what I want or need.

The guy I'm seeing has a business that runs itself. He's used a house with teens being around and with his divorce  now lives on his own. He's lonely ,in the i can't stand being in my house alone, lonely. I feel that's why he's in hurry to "commit" , to recouple.

I on the other hand ,similar to you trying2,  I have kids, household duties and a full time job. I want companionship and I think I want to move toward a life together but I'm not in a rush.

I had a really good time on the holiday we went on but I was quite happy to get home and get some me, alone time.........I don't know what that says about what I'm thinkng about this relationship. Sometimes I think I hold back because he is trying to move forward too quickly and I'm trying to find a balance, Sometimes I think I'm holding back because on some level it is not right .....

damn this dating stuff is confusing.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 10, 2017, 03:13:11 PM
That makes sense, klim -- you need 'you' time while your NG doesn't. If you are not ready for someone who is more clingy than you, it's time for a deeper conversation ... just a thought.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 10, 2017, 05:26:04 PM
The guy I'm seeing has a business that runs itself. He's used a house with teens being around and with his divorce  now lives on his own. He's lonely ,in the i can't stand being in my house alone, lonely. I feel that's why he's in hurry to "commit" , to recouple.

I on the other hand ,similar to you trying2,  I have kids, household duties and a full time job. I want companionship and I think I want to move toward a life together but I'm not in a rush.

klim  This is the relationship that I have with my NG.  He is also in a hurry to recouple,  I like the companionship but so far brush off any talk of moving forward.  No rush here either.

I'm also thinking on some level it's not right ..... it makes me wonder if widowhood makes us more cautious.  I've dated a few men in the past year, nobody has come even close to what I feel for NG.  I had an immediate connection with him, and yet I'm still resistant to the idea of a committed relationship with him.  But I'm not sure if there would be somebody else - "Mr. Right" - to whom I would be willing to fully commit.  Arrghh - so complicated.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 10, 2017, 05:38:17 PM
Take your time, friends. And while you do, feel free to take out a few of your NGs ready to recouple stem cells and inject them into my NG? LOL! I am joking. He is committed to the process and even though we haven't labeled anything, we are going at a good and steady pace. Heck, if he suddenly got all "I wanna move in together" I'd probably get freaked out!!! I wouldn't mind, but we haven't been around each other long enough to seriously consider what such a thing would mean as far as use of space, sharing of time, and so on. Yikes!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on August 15, 2017, 11:51:37 AM
Never thought I would be posting on this thread but here I am!!

Four weeks have gone by with NG, and so far it has been amazing.  We just fit. 

Still, haven't told our children and I am in no hurry. The time we have together is our time. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 15, 2017, 02:37:13 PM
Welcome Needy  Glad that time with your NG is amazing, it's great to find a relationship that feels right!

arneal  Sending re-coupling vibes your way, pass them along to your NG.  And yes, be careful of what you wish for!

Had an overnight get-away with NG this past weekend, first one for us.  We stayed at a beachside hotel near the home of one of his cousins.   I got a chance to meet his sister, a few cousins and their spouses.  It worked out well - he has what I think of as a good family and I felt very comfortable with them.  Didn't sleep much at all though as it was the first time to spend the night together with him.  ::)   It felt weird to share a room, brush teeth, get into pajamas, etc. with him there - what is wrong with me?!  We have a road trip next week and another overnight, I'm hoping this next one goes a bit better.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: jgib on August 15, 2017, 02:49:57 PM
Needy and trying2 you give me hope......  :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 16, 2017, 01:20:52 PM
Needytoo! So excited for you and your NG. I don't know how long it was before NG told his daughter that he was seeing me; I didn't get to meet her until the Christmas holiday last year, which was a good seven months or so in. I told my son that I was seeing someone but he hasn't met NG yet but that may come this weekend.

trying: The first time NG and I were in the same room, it was in my house, so some of the trepidation was taken away. However, I was concerned about taking it to the next level. I still have those moments where I am self-conscious and I am sure he is too. However, that first time was nearly a year ago now ... amazing how time flies ... because it was in early fall if I remember correctly. Now, it isn't even a thing. He and his daughter (who is an adult) share an apartment, so it is a rare thing for me to stay there (so far it's been I think twice times I've stayed at his place overnight) but he has spent several weekends at my house. Over the last couple of weeks we have had mid-week visits as well. He had a day off from work and came here to hang out; he took a nap while I finished a work meeting and then went home. I went there yesterday and we ate and watched movies, after which I went home. It's the development of a comfort level. I think some of your sent vibes got through, which I appreciate! Keep sending them as I expect to need them to get this meeting with my son to go well. My son has no filter so I am concerned about what may fall out of his mouth in conversation that will send me scurrying away in embarrassment. Also, NG is off from work for the rest of this week due to nerve pain; I am wondering if he will not want to make the ride. Will wait until probably early tomorrow to text him to ask as I need to make the arrangements with my son's caregiver about where we'll meet. More updates and hopefully good ones by the end of the weekend!

jgib -- it will come! Keep the faith and know we are rooting for you!

Best to all of us on this rollercoaster!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 18, 2017, 07:14:29 PM
Hi all and welcome to another weekend :) So this week's junior high update ...

I got a message from NG on Tuesday that his doctor put him off work for the rest of the week because of a nerve injury. He's on some heavy duty meds to alleviate the discomfort. I offered to take some dinner round for him and his daughter; I figure she's back in the classroom (she is a teacher's aide if I'm not mistaken and working on her teaching certification) and he had been fussing about a messy house (as she doesn't clean enough of her dirty dishes and so on for his liking). I had some running around to do, spending time with friends who were driving cross-country to their new home and such. I also had to pick up my mobile from the shop because I had it in for repairs. In the process of getting mine back, I had to reset everything. When I got to his place, the contacts had not updated and I couldn't get access to his number. One trip to the leasing office at the complex later and I let him know I was there. We hang out for a while and I head out. Remember: this weekend was the possible meet up with my son. After seeing his condition, I'm figuring he isn't up for it. I give it until yesterday to send a text to ask. No response. I give it until noon-ish today to hit back again with 'Not sure if you are getting my messages after the phone issues the other day but I wanted to check on whether I should consider another weekend for the son meeting'. He texts back in a short while with an apology, mentioned the medications, and said another weekend would be better. I replied that I figured, particularly since he has to get off those meds to get back to work on Monday. Now to see what sort of messages if any come at all this weekend  :o I feel bad about it from all directions -- selfish because I want my son to meet him, compassion because I know what being on painkillers is like. Fortunately, it is due to be a warm and lovely weekend, so I have more than enough to do to keep myself entertained, whether I hear from him or not :)

Hope you all have a great one!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 19, 2017, 08:40:54 AM
arneal  Bad timing with your guy on meds, probably wouldn't make for the best meeting with your son anyway.  He's lucky to have your offer of dinner and support.  I love your attitude, you have plenty going on with or without your guy!  In our youth there was little downtime with ailments, aches & pains - so much different now, dating later in life. 

My weekend is busy, DD and I are packing in preparation for drop off at college this coming week.  :'(  DS will be with us for the trip, I'm thankful for the added help and support from him for the process.  My daughter starts her freshman year, she's ready to go and I'm ready to let go but no doubt it will be emotional.  On another note, I haven't seen NG much this week as I was away for a short trip and have been busy with family obligations.  Our relationship is feeling like a friendship more than anything, and I'm not willing to settle for this. It might be the transition of DD's school drop off that's keeping us separated emotionally, I'm not sure.  He tends to stay away when anything less than happy is going on.  I call him my Good-time Guy, always around for the good times but tends to disappear when things get tough.  I'll let the dust settle and re-assess, don't want to have a relationship talk that might change things with everything else that's going on right now.

Happy Weekend All ~
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 19, 2017, 09:15:15 AM
Hey there trying2: congrats on having a freshman! I was so glad to get out of my folks' house at that age. I used to not understand those who got homesick.

I worked yesterday from 4 am until 11:30 pm. House stuff, errands, and end of course grading. I hope to finish up some housework after my volunteer today and then take a nap! Yeah, it was sucky timing. You gotta eat your Wheaties before dealing with my son LOL!

Yikes - I think all of my Jersey attitude would come out at your NG for shrinking back when things are a bit less sunny. This is real life and with what we have already been through, I know for me having somebody who can handle the truths of life (I hear Jack Nicholson's 'you can't handle the truth!' right there) is very important. Pray that it gets sorted and soon love.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on August 23, 2017, 05:52:49 AM
Hope everything works out for both of you. 

Last week I tried to tell my sons about NG but my eldest (the one that you need to eat your Wheaties before addressing anything serious) didn't want to listen to me. So now I want to tell them separately and start with my youngest son who is a bit more reasonable. 

Last weekend met NG's sons. They are 13 & 10 and are special needs kids. All I saw was kids, NG was getting upset because they were acting up a bit.  I think he is so nervous that I will hit the hills but seriously all I saw were kids. I actually thought this was going to be a problem, being 50 I didn't want to deal with young kids unless they are grandkids but I really enjoyed meeting them.   

Met NG's Mom last night.  What an amazing woman 82 and she looks 62.  I really like her too. 

Just can't believe this is my life right now.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on August 23, 2017, 07:56:06 AM
Great update Needytoo!  Good luck with telling your sons about NG, I know all too well how stressful that can be!  I went through some tough times with my older 2 early in my relationship but they eventually came around.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 23, 2017, 11:53:56 AM
Thanks for sharing, Needy. I am so excited for you as you meet more of your NG's important people. My two previous husbands and NG did not have their moms anymore by the time we met, which I do regret. Mine is still living and she met the husbands. She is back east but so is NGs sister; I often wonder if we'll do a major trip like that together. If we do and if I get to meet her, that would be a giant thing.

I warned NG that my son has no filter and will ask all sorts of things. He was okay with that but I am still nervous as all get-out about them meeting. I realized that I am probably more nervous because my son is a man now and he was just a little boy when he met LH. However, he was wary of LH because he was very protective of Mom. When I told him I was seeing someone, he was genuinely happy because he said he didn't want me to be by myself.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 24, 2017, 09:56:28 PM
Needy  So good that intros are going well, exciting time for you all!  It's funny how as parents we stress about our kids behavior and reactions and oftentimes things go better than we expected.

Back from a long week of travel, dropped off DD at college and she's happily settled and doing well so far.  NG flew to meet me in a city half-way home and we road tripped 2 days back together. He's a nice travel companion, we enjoyed sightseeing and stayed last night at a romantic bed & breakfast.   Something is missing though - I'm attracted to him but not feeling the spark of romance.  It's starting to feel like a friends with benefits relationship, not sure if I'm unrealistic in expectation of how a relationship is supposed to be but want more and am trying to figure out what that really means.  Maybe this is the best that it gets?  He's talking about celebrating our fall birthdays together and I'm sad thinking that far ahead about it.  I need to have a conversation with him and don't know how to start it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 25, 2017, 10:45:25 AM
Something is missing though - I'm attracted to him but not feeling the spark of romance.  It's starting to feel like a friends with benefits relationship, not sure if I'm unrealistic in expectation of how a relationship is supposed to be but want more and am trying to figure out what that really means.  Maybe this is the best that it gets?  He's talking about celebrating our fall birthdays together and I'm sad thinking that far ahead about it.  I need to have a conversation with him and don't know how to start it.

trying2: what got me in your post is that you are sad thinking about celebrating your birthdays ... It seems like there is certainly something going on in your heart that needs sussing out. As far as romance is concerned, I would think that depends on how you define it. You mentioned that the two of you stayed at a 'romantic bed & breakfast' yet there seems no spark. What is 'romantic' for you? What is romantic for NG? I read somewhere that one way to draw closer to someone is to mirror what they do ... if for example  if you like to be held close when you kiss, hold him close. The idea is that eventually, you will find a place of sync and if you do to him what you like done, he will do it back. It's not foolproof but I would say there's something to it if just saying what you want seems not the way to go about it. I often find 'doing' works better than saying ... kind of like show and tell for grown folks  ??? But it all boils down to whether you want to share your romantic heart with him and only you can know that. Hugs, darlin!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on August 25, 2017, 01:31:15 PM
Trying2 I totally get you. I vacationed this summer with NG and it was very pleasant, and there was some intimacy but we're in my view we're just not connecting on all levels. In his view he just wants to be with me because he loves me. He says love conquers all. I disagree if there are incompatible issues, someone is going to have to change and really I'm not sure I want to change , or change him. I want a match that is more natural.
I'm struggling at the moment and yes it has to do with I don't think he's right for me but close) but i don't want to be alone and also because he is so in to me i don't know how to approach it........and I've been fluctuating back and forth for a while so who knows tomorrow I may feel different.

This is not easy.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 25, 2017, 02:10:12 PM
klim -- interesting points you make here. I guess I don't understand the 'connecting on all levels' or 'a match that is more natural' part of your post. I am quite literal in many ways so do forgive me: I don't see how people could possibly 'connect on all levels' because we are all different, with different ways of seeing the world. There will always be some level of incompatibility as even identical twins are not fully compatible ... such incompatibility could range from not agreeing on which way to hang the toilet paper roll, anger over the seat up or down, leaving dishes in the drainer or drying and putting away all the way to sexual wants/fantasies/willingness to try things to differences in final wishes. If the two of you were drawn to each other, isn't that something of a 'natural' match? It seems if NG is into you, that talking about the things you like and don't like should be easier to discuss?

However, getting a sense of the deal-breakers in my view comes pretty early, before intimacy. I guess on some of those things, I am very clear on what I am looking for. I remember one time before we were ever intimate, I told NG how I had regretted in some ways that I had not had a child when I was with my second husband. He said he didn't want more children and I clarified that I didn't either but that it was something that I had thought about when I was younger.

That said, I struggle with getting across that I would like our relationship to deepen because I feel, when I step back and look at the whole thing logically, I am rushing. I have taken small, bold steps though. Like when NG was here last Sunday -- as he was leaving, I told him I need cuddle time (we were at my curb and he had his bike running so I was talking loud to be heard, so saying I wanted ... you know ... would not have come across very well), which is something I would never say LOL. He said him too and that I probably could have stayed the night before (I try not to push that when his daughter is home though) but that we would have a stay the night soon. We have been more communicative than before, so I know things are moving.

I guess where you (klim and trying2) are looking to cool things down a bit maybe, I'm looking to turn the burner up :D

No, this isn't easy, any way you look at it. Let us keep pressing forward though to get what we need, want, and deserve!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 25, 2017, 05:05:43 PM

I'm struggling at the moment and yes it has to do with I don't think he's right for me but close) but i don't want to be alone and also because he is so in to me i don't know how to approach it........and I've been fluctuating back and forth for a while so who knows tomorrow I may feel different.
Yup, this ^  I'm afraid to break things off with my guy because I'm not sure if I'm being unreasonable in what I want or what a romantic relationship should look like at this point in my life.  He's divorced x2 and as a widow, naturally there's lots of life experience between us and for me the magic just isn't there.  There's a sense of cynicism in our relationship, a "been there-done that" attitude that I feel from him. Is it possible to have some romantic magic at this stage in life?   And is it reasonable to want some magic?  I agree with arneal that a connection on all levels would be difficult, but certainly it's reasonable to expect a deep connection of some kind. 

I like the mirroring idea, arneal, and will try this.  Glad that things are moving along for you, and that there's more communication  :)
 
Happy Weekend All ~
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 25, 2017, 05:28:19 PM
Yes, oh yes to magic! But how you define it is the thing. If your guy isn't a magic sort and is more concrete, meat and taters, well, what do you do? Can you live with that? If not, there's your answer. Going out there and making sure 'magic' is somehow part of your criteria will be mandatory. Defining it once you meet that guy who you thing will make the grade is certainly mandatory.

It all boils down to, at any age or point in life, what is magic? Does the definition or parameter change over time? Is it like amusement rides -- when I was younger I thought roller coasters were great, to a certain extent. The first husband made me get on this ride once and I thought I would die; I haven't really been on any such thrill rides since. While I think roller coasters and the like are neat, I think such from a distance. Does the way we see magic the same, in that it changes due to experience or age or time?

I think I shared this, either on this thread or somewhere else, but I gave my NG coupons as one of his Christmas gifts; I included some that were a bit closer to NR than G in the rating scheme :) It's been almost nine months since I gave him those and he still hasn't dipped into more than a few of them. When he read the one about engaging in a fantasy, he replied that his were pretty tame but never elaborated. In truth so are mine, but I wanted to share that intimacy. I think when it comes to such things, he is more meat and taters. And that's okay with me. I've never been one for fireworks, so if we never do anything wild and crazy in that department but continue to grow more comfortable with each other as time goes by, I'm good.

Maybe that's what klim meant by someone needing to change, which is in my book, part of growth. Now if it's a matter of compromise where one person cuts him or herself off from how they truly feel to stay with someone else, that is problematic.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on August 25, 2017, 08:03:20 PM
ok I'll elaborate with the not on all levels.
While early dating was nights out at restaurants or dinner at someones house and a movie. Attention was new and appreciated. Him saying he didn't want to leave seemed sweet and endearing.
But I've learned he never wants to go home( or if I'm at his place he doesn't want me to leave) or even transition from one activity to the next is difficult. While on vacation , I was pushing for every transition.  He liked to just sit together, never was ready to move to the next thing. He clings, in every aspect.

It's nice to feel wanted but there is part of him that doesn't understand that there is a part of my life that I have to deal with, without him. My house,my sons. He says in words that he understands but I don't think he really does.
Take for instant, this past weekend, we went camping for 3 days, Had pretty good time as it was his first time camping and I was showing him all sorts of new things.. We get back to my place around 9 at night, we unloaded the car, and I give a good hug and kiss goodnight, thank him for a good time......he continues to hug me and I say something like Ok I gotta go and  he quickly , in a pissy manner says ok bye. He didn't show any appreciation for the weekend, just aggrevation from having to leave.

To me that means we have a disconnect. I had hoped when it first surfaced as a problem that if we discussed it that things would change....or that over time the intensity would wain. It hasn't.

So I go between "this  relationship needs to be over " when I think of all this to ...."maybe it'll get better" when I think of the fun we have when we are doing things together.

Like I said this isn't easy.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 25, 2017, 08:11:15 PM
Thanks klim - ugh, clingy. That is a whole different animal and totally makes sense, the disconnect makes total sense. That would freak me completely out. So sorry  :'(
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on August 26, 2017, 09:33:06 AM
It is just hard.  Hot then cold. Or warm then cool.  It is so complicated if you coupled up young and "naive" and now the many facets of remarriage, recoupling, kids, loss.   NG and I are having conversations.  I have talked about what are some things that are acceptable and not, and what I want.  I have been open about accepting it is what it is.  I have shared I will remove myself if I cannot be supportive of his quest for his children.  I have shared about I will not wait for years either. It is wonderful then not, and then everything and then all questionable. 

I am old enough now to not just have romantic notions.  Love is not enough contrary to the songs that say otherwise. I admire those that remarry or commit to long term.  You figure out somehow to not overthink it all, I guess.  Working on that.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: jgib on August 26, 2017, 10:09:52 AM
I am not in a new relationship, so I suppose what my thoughts are may not have as much weight as others that are living it at the moment may have.

I am the type of person that is happy to compromise but not settle.  I know clingy and needy doesn't work for me as I am very independent and would just end up hurting a person like that, and I have no desire to hurt anyone.

My advice to both klim and trying2 is go back and read the things you have written.  This time, do not see them as your own words, but as words a friend or daughter may have written.  What advice would YOU give to someone you cared deeply about, that was in this situation?  Do you see how that might change things.

Good luck to you both.  I know what I would do, I believe that is irrelevant.  We all find our own path, it is nice to have some support along the way!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 26, 2017, 11:16:26 AM
klim  Sounds like your NG wants to live together?  He's acting in an immature way, that would be difficult.  Sorry that you're dealing with this.   No easy answer - maybe it's something that with time, can be worked through?  Like you, I really enjoy  time with NG, but switch from yes it's good to it's time to move on.

tybec  Having conversations about what is acceptable, a good idea.  Looking back at pre-marriage dating and my marriage, I had many of the same struggles that I feel now, but now is much more complicated with kids, grief, divorce, in-laws, etc.  I'm realizing that my wants and desires are not so easy to figure out.


Now if it's a matter of compromise where one person cuts him or herself off from how they truly feel to stay with someone else, that is problematic.

^^ Yes!!
arneal  Yup, my guy is the concrete, meat & taters type. He's methodical, thinks everything through, has an answer to most everything and if he doesn't, works hard to find out.  Widowhood has pushed me into being more of an intuitive, spontaneous, feel the moment, oh well - let it go, kind of a person.  Last night he was griping about the fact that the grill in his complex doesn't heat to over 400 degrees.  He went on and on about it - I started to laugh because, really, what's the big deal??!!  (Apparently it is a BIG deal if you're trying to grill steaks.)  ::)  Today he's taking the grill apart to try and repair it.  I appreciate the practicality of my guy, I'm seeing some humor in this but it is hard at times to feel the magic.  We've been out at dinner, and he has pointed out the intricate links in my bracelet, and talked at length about the details of my car and what I should do to maintain it.  Ahhhh.....feel the magic!  ;)  If I get him to repair my grill, maybe I would feel some magic? ;D   Having somebody around to fix things is certainly acceptable, what I'm not sure about is whether I can forego romantic notions which for me still need some definition.

jgib  I like the suggestion about reading from another perspective, will give this a break and go back and read again
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 26, 2017, 01:20:35 PM
jgib -- you make a good point about how long we've been at this thing called a budding relationship  :o We all have to take the road at our individual paces, don't we? I was just joking with the (30-yo) daughter of one of my dearest friends who moved back to the northeast last year and yesterday was talking about how she was waiting for 'her man' so they could go out. I made a comment about how it seemed sort of quick that she was laying claim to someone (and left a reminder that he is his own man, no human ownership, especially if there's no ring on it  ;D). I added that it was a comment from an ol' lady as well  :D I feel that my situation is very much still budding because if I were to line up all the days back-to-back that NG and I have spent together over the last year and several months, we would have only been dating for maybe three months. It helped me put into perspective that while we have shared a lot of ourselves with each other, it is evolving and we are learning.

tybec -- I was very much young and stupid my first go round, which is probably what kept me in an abusive situation. I am grateful for my second marriage because it helped me get rid of the hard edges and come to a place where I could begin to explore the notion of romance; I don't know how LH put up with me or what he saw in me because I was VERY meat and taters. The first time I showed him my apartment, I let him in the front door, up the steps (it was a second floor unit), stood in the dining room and pointed to what rooms were where, and ushered him out the door. He asked later why I did that: I said that I agreed to 'show' him my apartment, which I did. Further, it was a first actual date and I was unsure of whether he was an ax murderer or not. We laughed about it and to hear him tell the story, of how he nearly got whiplash from how fast I got him out the door, was priceless. But he never gave up and I am grateful for his lessons because they have enabled me to get a sense of what I would like moving forward as a single woman.

trying2 -- while I and my NG are meat and taters sorts, I get where you are coming from. I get caught up every now and again, describing something like a movie I watched and he just looks at me and cracks a joke about now he won't have to watch it or whatever. But when it comes to romance, I am trying to figure out what that means and what is acceptable to me. It goes back to the mirroring comment: if we can't show what is romantic, I don't think we'll get it back. I have tried the outward appearance thing: I am no supermodel (or even an average model  :o) so sexy undergarments or nighties are not part of my repertoire but I've found several that I think are nice and that I am comfortable in.

Quote
I'm realizing that my wants and desires are not so easy to figure out.
Yes, trying2, this!

I am still trying to get a handle on that myself. What it seems to boil down to is what makes you comfortable in your own skin? Can your NG handle that and does it make him want to draw closer, or does he not notice your attempts to be outwardly romantic? Do you like mushy cards at Valentine's Day or your birthday or just whenever? I tried that as well, sort of. I gave my NG a card at Valentine's and then another at his birthday with his gift; neither were especially mushy but I thought the sentiments were heartfelt. He seemed surprised at the Valentine's one and genuinely touched at the birthday one, which he read out loud, put up in his room for about a month or so (can't remember if it's still there ... now I will have to try to remember to look the next time I am there  :P), and said he couldn't remember the last time he'd gotten a card or gift for his birthday. Even the first husband and I would give cards for special occasions, so that really hit me. I think because he's never had anyone give those little things, he isn't sure of his desires either. We have had those (me) 'what do you want to do?'/(him) 'well what do you wanna do?' sorts of conversations more than once above different things, so as I write this, I think I just hit on something ...

If our various NGs are not clear on what they want when it comes to wants and desires, and we aren't sure of exactly what we want or desire either, it will be a bit of a cloudy area, won't it?

Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Sugarbell on August 26, 2017, 08:23:55 PM
Kids, families, previous lives, crazy exs make this stuff hard.

Loving NG isn't hard...it's easy... It's meshing all the other stuff that's hard.

I'm a WV girl...but growing up loved the outdoors but wasn't country.
He's country...real country...his family is very country...almost klan like country. We get along..but damn I don't know if I could handle all of it. This is why I believe in dating (and we are exclusive)...Like a long time! Lol..I've been on back roads in my county that I never knew existed since dating him. And I grew up here.

This is a different world to me...You guys are right... "Love" alone isn't enough it's the compromising on all the other junk that makes it work.

Verdict is still out on how much either one of us is willing to compromise.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 27, 2017, 03:21:30 PM
Interesting point about budding relationships, I would put mine into that category still.  And I now see NG almost every day, not sure what this adds up to but I would guess 3 months at least!  Last night we met up with several other couples, and one of the wives asked if we were boyfriend/girlfriend. With NG listening, I responded that we had been seeing each other for a few months.  I still have no desire to have that label put on us, taking my sweet time, having fun and he knows where I stand.  Even though he wants that label, I'm not ready and no harm done in my opinion.

I think it's really important to be able to act yourself, and as you say arneal, not cut yourself off from how you truly feel to stay with somebody else.  I've made it a point to present my true self to NG, and am speaking up more with what I believe.  And he does draw closer, what attracted me to him in the first place.  I'm realizing that it's the trivial stuff and some of the outlying social things that are giving me hesitation.  NG was romantic at first, he's not making attempts at romance now.  I read recently something about the Five Love Languages - to me kind of a trite guideline but a way to figure out what is needed to make you happiest in a relationship.  I read through all of them and honestly can't figure out what matters most to me.  Guess this kind of quiz doesn't really work for me. 


Loving NG isn't hard...it's easy... It's meshing all the other stuff that's hard.


^ Yes!!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 27, 2017, 06:33:04 PM
trying2 -- you made a great point there about NG being romantic at first but now, not so much. I read all sorts of relationship stuff as well and so many of the 'experts' suggest that women do this: that we start out, making sure we look appropriate when we go out on a date or even just when we are at each other's houses watching TV for a stay-in date; that we spend time with our friends who we had before connecting with this person, which sometimes means we have to raincheck him for another day or time; that we might have to raincheck him for a day or time because that is the time we spend at the gym. Then we get comfortable and stop trying. These 'experts' seem to suggest women are not keeping up what they did in the first place to attract the other person. However, as you aptly stated, in this case NG stopped keeping up some of what he did to attract you. It works on both sides here. If there isn't positive growth, however incremental, it makes sense that you, Sugarbell, any of us would question whether this is the situation we want to be in or 'fight' for.

Latest increment here: I mentioned that NG was sick and we did not have the meet-up with my son. I was waiting to figure a right time to say something since NG had so much going on -- first the nerve pain, then a lack of communication and all sorts of weird stuff on the job to the point he was putting resumes out there. He had an interview and got a job offer last week so when he said that, I really didn't want to bring it up, knowing what it's like to start a new gig. He came over yesterday and we had a quiet evening of watching movies. This morning before he left, he asked when the next time might be to meet my son. I said I would have to connect with his caregiver and NG asked if my son needed to be accompanied (I already told him about the whole special needs/autism spectrum thing); I explained that no, his 'house mom' would need to drive him. He was good with that and said he would let me know about Labor Day Monday, which I figured might be a good opportunity if he didn't have to work. Also, he mentioned being ready to spend some quality time with my dogs ... now that's almost an even bigger step! My 60lb girl and by 80lb boy have met him already but they are hyper and like to jump so rather than have everybody stressed out with all that, I make sure they are in a separate room (they are totally indoor babies) and that I don't let them out unless he is outside or in a room with the door closed. So the fact that he wants to get them to be calm around him says a lot to me as well.

I might be pushing for more inside my brain, but these things tell me that my 'let what happens, happen' actions are on the right track. And if anything, I try to be more open as time goes on. Like I mentioned, he's always been the 'what do you want to do' sort so I have been challenged to keep things fresh to maintain the attraction. But it's a good challenge and I think I'm up to it :)

Have a great start to your week, everyone. All the best to each of us!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on August 29, 2017, 08:41:48 AM
arneal   It's great that communication is good and things are moving forward for you!  "Let what happens, happen", it does seem like actions are on the right track and that's wonderful!  Agree about the dogs - I have a frisky 70 lb. rescue puppy, she's a handful - when NG wants to hang out and include the dog too, my heart sings. :D

Interesting points about romance at first, and then not so much.  I keep up my appearance, I'm too vain not to!  In thinking about what's changed - I'm available to him most of the time now.  We see each other most days, there is the occasional time when I back off to take care of other responsibilities.  He has me and knows it, and maybe believes that he doesn't need to make romantic gestures any more. What I did at first to attract him?  I was hesitant to get into a relationship with him, he stuck with me despite my taking a long time to even kiss him.  I don't want to play games now, don't want to back off to make him try more - not sure how to change anything about this.  Maybe a good conversation is in order here.  I too am trying to be more open about what this relationship is, and whether it's something to try for long term.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on August 29, 2017, 12:00:17 PM
trying2 -- well-said about no games. Conversation, yes. If you can't discuss this sort of thing and get clear, moving forward becomes too much of a guessing game, doesn't it? {{{hugs}}}
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: daysofelijah on September 01, 2017, 07:17:55 PM
Gosh new relationships are hard!
It sounds like everyone is dealing well with things as they come. Communication is such a hard thing to balance. I think being widowed makes us more able to deal with the relationship issues after having been through so much.

I don't really consider my relationship budding anymore, so I don't post too much.

Things are continuing to go well. I'm enjoying things the way they are. NG spends nearly every evening here, goes to his place on the weekdays and stays over on the weekends. He spends time with my kids. Right now he's downstairs playing darts with my 14yo.

I started my new teaching job, media specialist, well no kids until next week, but setting up and getting ready. I'm glad to be back to work and have something to focus on so not as much time to get lost in my thoughts. This week my schools' open house was the same time as my girl's open house, so NG took the girls to meet their teachers and do all the open house business for me. He is a great almost step-dad.

No date yet for a wedding, but I'm very fine with it. NG does everything he can to make me feel loved and secure in our relationship. I'm okay to give him time to work through letting go of whatever it is he seems slow to let go of as far as his "freedom" and fear of me giving up on him like everyone else does (in his mind). I think he's getting to a better place, we are both happier. Waiting another year or two is fine with me at this point.

My current stress is fighting the city to be able to put up a new fence around my backyard pool. They are making it insanely difficult. I have had to shell out a ton of money for permits, surveys, variances. And next month I have to go before the city planning commission, and then the city council meeting. All to just replace the falling down fence that is there in the exact same place. It's insanity.

His son continues to cause troubles typical of a wayward 17 year old, so that is a main reason why I'm not in a hurry for them to be moving in. Oh and 17 yo started working on a mink farm, so he stinks to high heaven after work, it's bad, lol. I don't want that stink in my house/laundry room!

I hope everyone has an enjoyable Labor Day weekend!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: mwelchdonovan17 on September 02, 2017, 11:47:56 AM
Over 4 years ago I was conversing with this one guy.  He was twice divorced, once widowed.  He was older than I wanted to start a relationship with.  But I thought what's the harm if we just chatted online?  So that's what we did.  In the morning before he went to work and at night when he came home.  I was unemployed at the time. 

Then the question I had no idea would come up; when do we meet?  I put it out of my mind (changed the subject).  He told me he would be patient.  I guess I wasn't ready?  Eventually I accepted his invitation.  I picked a venue far enough away from my home so that if it didn't work out I knew I wouldn't be venturing to that place again.  After 3 hours of coffee and chatting, he asked me "where are we going from here?".  OMG.  I thought he meant after our date.  He meant later that day.  Mind you I had not been on a date like this since 1979.  He suggested 3 different ideas.  We agreed on a baseball game.  We drove in separate vehicles.  His daughter happened to have 2 extra tickets.  We went.  Not only did I meet his daughter but I also met his two grown grandchildren, some other family members and his FIRST ex-wife; mother of his children.  After the game we went back to the bar where we left our vehicles.  (we took the shuttle to the ballpark).  He invited me to a garden party the following weekend a couple of his friends have every year.  There I met some of his friends. 

A week after we met he met my daughter.  I told her we had been chatting well over a month and met the preceeding weekend.  We went to the restaurant where she works for dessert.  I introduced her to him and she actually sat with us for a bit.  When she told me she had to get back to work she got up, shook his hand and gave him a hug.  I was a bit taken back.  I guess she saw how happy I was.  The smile I used to have had come back to my face. 

At this time of my life I was afraid I would not meet anyone.  But this man and I are in a committed relationship.  My family and friends are happy for me and they all like him.  My oldest sister was a bit defensive about our relationship when I told him about his past marriages.  But when she met him last year she leaned over to me and told me "he's a keeper".  She has always been a good judge of character. 

We decided last year that he would move in with me and rent out his condo.  Two years ago I got a PT job working in an insurance office.  Just so happens my boss and the BF went to the same high school and they get along great.  But then I went to high school with the boss's wife.  The BF has retired and he is just waiting for me to retire.  Our plans now are to sell both places, buy an RV along with a vehicle to tow it and travel the US.  Boy has my life changed since my husband passed in February of 2007.  If someone had told me this is where I would be 10 years later I would have told them they were nuts!!!

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: BrokenHeart2 on September 02, 2017, 12:37:33 PM
Thank you MD17 for sharing your journey with us.  I'm envious  ;)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 02, 2017, 02:15:04 PM
Yes, thank you for sharing, daysofelijah and mw! NG is the closest to my age out of my intimate relationships. The first husband/my son's dad was about 12 years older and my second husband was 15 years older, while NG is only five years older. I guess I've finally reached an age where all my maturity points match  ;D ;D ;D

We will see how the weekend susses out; I have a congratulatory dinner reservation for NG and I because he started a new job this past week and I wanted to do something to celebrate the end of the stress from his last job. I didn't get to clean the house earlier in the week because I put up a small greenhouse in my backyard the other day, so that's on my agenda for today. Hope to spend time with him this weekend :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on September 02, 2017, 02:48:15 PM
Thank you doe and mwd, I enjoyed reading your posts - good to hear of established relationships going well. 

Gosh new relationships are hard!
It sounds like everyone is dealing well with things as they come. Communication is such a hard thing to balance. I think being widowed makes us more able to deal with the relationship issues after having been through so much.

^Yes, they are!  Wish I didn't, but I tend to make things more difficult than they need to be.  ::)  Widowhood has made me more resilient, I'm not sure that I deal with relationship issues any better now though.

Happy Labor Day Weekend, All ~
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 02, 2017, 04:02:54 PM
trying2: I would dare say that widowhood certainly makes us more resilient but probably also gives us less tolerance for nonsense ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on September 03, 2017, 08:33:34 AM
trying2: I would dare say that widowhood certainly makes us more resilient but probably also gives us less tolerance for nonsense ...

Absolutely!! 
However, what one person defines as an idiosyncrasy might be somebody else's nonsense.  In the non-romantic arena, I have little patience for foolishness and won't waste time on something I consider to be less than worthwhile.  In my relationship with NG, there are issues and it's work to define what's nonsense vs. something that I can work with.  I wish it were more defined though, the more I get into this the more complicated it gets!  ::)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on September 03, 2017, 09:58:04 AM
t2b ...yes the work that you speak  of with issues...that is what makes new relationships tricky. For me there's so much thinking that I do now, where I don't believe I analyzed as much when I was young. I just when with the flow.

Sometimes now I go with the flow and it feels easier, but then my thinking kicks in......

The last couple of days I spent at NG's house and I did some things I'd never thought I would.  Let me explain. NG is a farmer/businessman. He was an old school type of guy where his responsiblility was to "work and provide for the family". So his wife also had a traditional role of taking care of house and home. I don't really have any trouble with people taking on roles as long as they are happy with it. The thing is when his wife left he had no "home" skills and  none of the things you would find in a normal home because his wife emptied the house to the bare walls.  When I met him he had developed somewhat , he knows how to cook a few things and can now do his laundry. But his house which is  large and actually could be very nice was run down and dirty. He was living as a bachelor farmer....not really an inviting environment! He doesn't lack money so over time I've suggested some purchases that would make it more inviting. Some extra kitchenware, cushions for his wrought iron patio set(now I actually like sitting outside) but this weekend I broached a couple of things that I felt I shouldn't, but were bugging me. His bedding was dismal and he would let it go too long between washes...I had to speak up.....so a 10 pm run to walmart and new bedding lead to the best night I've had there.
Spurred on by the bed makeover, I suggested painting his living room which was a mess. The previous owner had done some renovations  (like I said the place has potential) but the project was not quite finished. The walls had some  dirty old wallpaper in one area, new construction on another,  half painted in another....a mess. So we spent the day painting.

I'm liking it but I didn't like having to suggest these things because........I don't know, I guess I feel demanding.....( but I didn't demand) . I think he's just oblivious to things that make a house a home.

Anyway that was my weekend.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on September 03, 2017, 11:21:29 AM
I'm liking it but I didn't like having to suggest these things because........I don't know, I guess I feel demanding.....( but I didn't demand) . I think he's just oblivious to things that make a house a home.

Perhaps what you see as demanding he sees as merely being helpful. He might be feeling relieved you've finally shown an interest.  I mean, it doesn't sound like he has a whole lot of interest/experience in the domestic side of a household. Congratulations -it sounds like you've got yourself a blank slate made of malleable clay! Now enjoy being Henry Higgins to his Eliza Doolittle. Just make sure your suggestions always come from a place of good will and you won't sound unreasonable or demanding. A word of warning- men like that aren't usually into sharing the household chores- they gladly hand the reins over to the woman in their lives so be sure to also teach him to take care of shit or you could one day find yourself doing it all!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 04, 2017, 12:25:07 PM
Bunny -- I love your reply!

The role thing  ::) The first husband was one of those demanding, almost caveman types when it came to roles. Women's place and all that garbage. My second husband was the total opposite: could cook like a dream, which had caused difficulty in his first marriage (his ex, once she realized he could cook, didn't; for me, it made me nervous that whatever I cooked would not be good enough, but he was a great partner and I have, thanks to his encouragement over the years, become very comfy in the kitchen), and had no problems taking care of the house when I worked outside the home full-time (he had been retired for health by then). I honestly didn't become domestic until he died. I mean, I cleaned and all that, but the true pride in my home didn't blossom until I was in here all by myself. Sad perhaps but true.

I think about it now and in a way it goes back to something in an earlier discussion about getting comfy and losing the desire to work for the romance. While cleaning and cooking did not seem like aspects of romance to me before, they certainly do now. The first time NG and I had a conversation about him coming to my house, I warned him that I live in chaos theory ... I said it's clean but cluttered  :D When he got here, he looked around and said, 'this is not cluttered!' He's always liked my cooking, even when I wasn't happy with it. Needless to say, that encouraged me to keep at it.

I made cookies on Saturday and took some to his place yesterday; I had made reservations to take him out to dinner to celebrate his new job. He said he didn't think he'd ever had snickerdoodle cookies and when he bit it, he said the texture was perfect, reminded him of his mom's lemon cookies. I had to remind him we were going to dinner because he tucked in like he was going to make a meal of them. We got to the restaurant and just as we were finishing I went to the restroom. On my way back, I snagged the server and asked her to bring a slice of cake with a candle in it as a surprise. He was so shocked when she brought it. I guess it was a combination of cooking and not cooking  ;D It was a good day overall. I did want to stay over, but knew he had some studying to do for a project he's been put on for this new job so I didn't pout :) I have to travel for work next week myself, so we'll see what next weekend holds before I go!

Enjoy your Labor Day all!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Bunny on September 06, 2017, 10:52:24 PM
Today my boyfriend seriously pissed me off and it ended up making me miss my husband.  My husband couldn't bear for us to be angry at each other for very long, but my bf can go all day holding onto his grudges. Funny how my husband had the much shittier temper but wanted things resolved Right Away...

As for cooking- my husband taught me how to cook and I did end up doing the majority. My boyfriend enjoys cooking, so we share that task pretty evenly. I much prefer baking actually- though he is in charge of the pie-making.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 07, 2017, 09:42:42 AM
I am so sorry, Bunny. I hope you will be able to talk with him about how him holding grudges makes you feel. My NG can be the same way but it has always been about others in the past. I try to talk about how it often hurts us more to be that way because the person we're holding the grudge against has most likely gone on with their life and isn't thinking about us, so we should move on and let it go. He's not quite there yet as some of his hurts go back a long way and are deep. But I am not sure how I would react should he be that way towards me. Probably not very well  >:(
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on September 07, 2017, 10:55:39 AM
Bunny,

Thanks for sharing about that.  I find myself missing my LH with all the complications of the NG and our process of learning to manage things, like a fight/fuss.  It was so easy due to trust and knowing we would get through it with LH.  I wish I didn't go back to LH so much in my thoughts as it doesn't help me at all.  Oh well.  That is where I am.

Hot then cold.  Spent every night with NG for Labor DAy weekend.  Had MIL come visit at the new house.  She is moving next Friday back to her family, her HOME, she has always called it. Passively/aggressively posted on FB that she is moving because I moved with her grandson. LET IT GO, Tybec! 
 
Now, this week, no contact face to face.  Busy.  Work, other activities.  NG volunteers for the VFW now one night a week, is a cub scout pack leader, so that is one night a week, has his kids one night a week every other week.  Unbelievable we can be together so much and then, poof, gone.  I start a small group next week on one of his busy nights to get out, meet folks and learn.  My child is likely to get rolling soon, too, as school has been in a month and he is signing up for activities.  I guess it is just the way it is. 

I told him I need a night away, a B & B, something where we don't have to get up and do anything if we don't want.  He acknowledged it but when?  Patience.....
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 07, 2017, 11:10:14 AM
<3 tybec!


You bring up an interesting point about in-laws. I was just going through photos for a Facebook Throwback Thursday post and have been tempted a few times to post one of LH but can't bring myself to do it. I have minimal contact with his family, primarily two cousins who count me as family, and occasionally but less frequently, his daughter. I struggle with being the one who feels like I am ghosting even though the others don't really reach out to me much. I have a bunch of hard-copy photos in my garage that I am thinking of sending in one giant bundle to the one cousin so she can share them with those who want them during the holidays. I don't know. Wish this part of moving forward wasn't so weird and difficult, which I think it is because I'd like to manage other people's reactions ... if I could make it so they were okay with my life ... and we know how impossible that is sometimes ... Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: marriedwithkids77 on September 08, 2017, 03:17:25 PM
Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on September 12, 2017, 11:12:01 AM
Everything is going very well with NG.  Hard to believe it has only been 9 weeks since we have met, I feel like we have known each other for a very long time.  Everything I wanted in a partner is in this man.  Feels great but then there is that part in your brain just waiting for some kind of deal breaker to happen.  (weird how our brains work).

I have met his Mom and his kids.  Told my kids a week ago.  Youngest took it not so bad, oldest not so well.  Last night NG came over to my house met my youngest my oldest avoided us.  Just letting my kids adapt to all of this. 

Need everyone's opinion on one thing which I find kind of interesting.  After my husband's passing, I really had a hard time excepting that I have to do everything on my own. I remember being so angry that friends/family weren't giving me support.  Sometime during this journey, I guess I have just accepted I have to do everything on my own. Now letting someone help feels good and very strange to me at the same time.  Anyone else having the same problem? 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on September 12, 2017, 05:13:31 PM
When I was first started dating fiancé, well maybe for almost 2 years into dating him, I found it very hard to ask for or accept help from him.  Like you, after being frustrated with the lack of help I had after DH died I had resigned myself that I was on my own and had to do it all.  Asking for help made me feel weak and vulnerable.  What if he left me and I was on my own again?  Thankfully I got over it and am so happy for the help, wish it hadn't taken me so long to accept it.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on September 12, 2017, 07:09:00 PM
i definitely have an"I can do it myself" attitude and have a hard time accepting help.

Even at the beginning of this journey I didn't want help. My grief would have felt worse if I felt I needed help. I wouldn't even let anybody drive me and my kids to the funeral. Somehow I needed to be self sufficient. It helped me.

I've done all the maintenance on the house and brought my kids through the end of highschool and on to University. I'm used to it and there's a certain pride associated with it.

My worst stumbling block has been car maintenance so that is where my NG has succeeded in helping me. And I admit it feels good. Maybe I'll figure out how to accept other forms of help.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 12, 2017, 11:11:25 PM
Glad things are good for you and great question, Trying (and thank you, klim!). I guess I've always been one of those 'I will do it myself' sort of people, particularly after the whole first marriage. An abusive spouse teaches resilience, at least in my case. However, as an only child whose parents did not coddle, I guess I was resilient before him. Anyway, my second husband was ill and as a caregiver, I did most everything, particularly that last year. Before that and when he retired due to his health, much of the 'heavy lifting' went to me. We didn't have help from family before then so I didn't expect it after. I am thankful that not many of his folks have been in the picture (my family is small and have never been close to me, beyond my mother) since now that I am moving on with NG, I don't want to hear anything about how I am living my life.

As far as asking NG for help, I don't do it often. I ask his opinions or I announce I am going to do something and he will provide feedback. He sneaks in the offer sometimes though. I am not at home right now as I have an on-ground teaching assignment this week. He was so sweet this past weekend; he actually asked me for help with something and when we talked it out, he asked me when I was leaving. I told him and he asked if he was going to see me before I left (thank God we were on the phone because I am sure I was grinning like an idiot). I went over and we had dinner and watched TV for a while before I needed to go so I could rest up before leaving. He asked me what time I was leaving and if I had someone to take me to the airport (when I went in the spring, I asked him to take me and he did); I told him I was driving this time and when I was leaving. He gave advice about where to be careful of speed traps and such. Well, the next morning when I got up and was packing the car, I see he sent me a text, telling me to have a good time and to text when I got there.  :-*

I think he knows I like to do things on my own, as he does, so I think it's a good balance  :D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 17, 2017, 02:02:39 PM
Hello all: hoping you all and your NGs and families are well. My drive to my teaching assignment (all ~650 miles round trip of it) was quite cathartic. It's the farthest I've driven by myself in a long time and the last time I went that way, my LH and son were with me and I was a passenger. To traverse those roads, to see the places we stopped along the way, to realize I can do this life on my own in all ways with God's help and leading, was wonderful. I sang along to satellite radio all the way there and back, and laughed at how filthy my car is as it sits in my driveway. I texted NG to let him know I'd made it back but saw that he'd worked a killer week (50 hours plus another 25 hours of driving), so I haven't heard from him. I have been fighting the urge to text today and have determined that I won't.

Pray for me because I want to see him, but don't want to be the one to act like I have nothing better to do here than ask :-[ I have plenty of work on deck, so that certainly isn't the case. But I would leave a bit more until tomorrow if the opportunity came to spend time with him :-\ ???
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on September 17, 2017, 09:52:01 PM
Oh i wouldn't hold back on texting...let you're feelings be known. You've been going out with him long enough you shouldn't have to pretend or play coy. If he's too beat to respond it's understandable but I see no problem just putting your' thoughts out there.



Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 18, 2017, 09:30:28 AM
Thanks, klim. I think I struggle with the same thing many here have mentioned and that is being the one to make the suggestions. I want things to stay fresh, not drop into a too-familiar pattern, you know? I felt like I had done enough for a minute  :D So here's what ended up happening: I went on with my day's work and heard my Facebook Messenger go off. I looked and it was him -- he's never hit me up on IM but always texts. I open it and in the message he's let me know his phone is down. I message back and ask him what he's up to. He says something like, 'Not much, just some laundry.' So I get it, but I'm not going to make it too simple: I reply with something like, 'So, whatcha cooking? Since I was gone for a week, haven't thawed anything.' He comes back and says he hadn't thawed anything either but he'd look. He then says 'I'm thawing steaks -- come on over!!' He's a great cook so I was thrilled that he was on the stove instead of me for a change. We ate, talked, and watched movies until about 8:30/9, which is time for both of us to go to bed to get ready for work. I asked what happened to his phone since he it was on and I heard his traffic alert -- he was using it on wifi because he had to wait until payday to pay the bill. As we are walking to my car, he asked me when I had gotten home; I say Friday and that I'd sent him a text. He says, 'Oh, well, I will get that text on this coming Friday!' and we laugh about it.

In the end, I would have frustrated myself if I'd texted and not gotten an answer a second time by Sunday, so it all worked out.

However, it's been a little while since we've had extended cuddle time. I get it -- I traveled, he had the job change and associated stressors. But know that when I sent a 'thank you' Facebook Messenger message last night after I got home, I hinted that if it hadn't been a work night I would have given a proper thank you  ;D ;D We'll see what sort of response I get the next time we talk or see each other.

Have a good week, all! As my dear friend says, let the junior high moments of dating continue!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on September 21, 2017, 09:36:33 PM
I have mentioned in previous posts that BF is clingy.....When we are together I am  really happy, having a great time, no issues. The only issues arise when he has trouble saying goodbye/being apart.   Part of it is he is bad at communicating when we are apart. Really no texting at all sometimes. It's like it's all or nothing.
I'm trying to get him to communicate more, partly because I like it, and partly because I think if he's able to touch base when we're apart he won't be as clingy.
It's going pretty good this week,way more texts. :)

As an added bonus, he brought me a little necklace back from a 2 day business trip. It's been the first gesture of that type and I really appreciated that......I think because the lack of communiication had made me wonder how much he thought about me when we were apart...and now I know he was thinking of me while he was away.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 21, 2017, 09:53:15 PM
Yay, klim! I hear you about the no or little in between. With patience and persistence we will get there!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on September 28, 2017, 01:20:44 PM
Hi All  Hope that everyone is doing well.  I'm back from a few weeks of vacation, it was a hectic departure as I evacuated with my elderly mother a few days before Irma, all is okay in our area and I'm very grateful.  While away, I got the chance to witness NG in action as he stayed at my house and took care of all hurricane preparations.  After the storm, he secured 2 fallen trees and cleaned up the aftermath. Swoon - if there was any question if he's a stand up guy, this affirmed that he is and it's pretty awesome.

To traverse those roads, to see the places we stopped along the way, to realize I can do this life on my own in all ways with God's help and leading, was wonderful.

^arneal  I love this, I have felt the same recently.  We can and are doing this life on our own, lately I've felt stronger than I have in awhile and I'm so grateful to be blessed with good health and a strong disposition to carry on.  Who knows what's coming, but for now I'm happy to be in a good place.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 28, 2017, 02:04:31 PM
Glad all is well with you and yours, trying2. I've been under deadline for work and decided to do a debt consolidation to get these two broken vehicles off my property and largely off my monthly expenses. I also traveled for work. In the meantime, NG has been getting overtime at his new gig, which is good for him; he likes his co-workers and as a team lead feels validated for his skills, which are strong. I don't just say that because I like him :D but because as someone with tech skills herself, I see it. Anyway, we are finally on the books to have him meet my son this Sunday. I have been pondering the horrors of what this young man might say -- as I've mentioned he is on the autism spectrum but more importantly, he has no filter. If he meets someone I am friendly with, he assumes he is friendly with them too and will say anything. I am happy but nervous just the same. it will certainly mark a leveling up as far as I am concerned, that NG has been interested. I made the suggestion a couple months ago and we weren't able to make it happen then; he brought it up again first, which I appreciated, and when I asked if this weekend would work, he was all in.

Hoping everyone else is doing well and I will pop in to update you after Sunday. Know in the meantime, I have the playbook of conversations, responses, and scenarios running in my head!  :P :-[ ;D
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on September 30, 2017, 07:30:30 AM
Hope everything goes well on Sunday Arneal.  My NG’s sons are adopted the oldest has autism, and the youngest has fetal alcohol syndrome. NG was so when I met them because they can be a handful, but honestly, I just see kids, and we get along very well.  NG still hasn’t met my oldest but maybe on Sunday.

Thanks everyone for your responses on allowing someone to help you.  This is one quality I want in a partner, and I am trying to let it happen. I have been married twice before and never had a guy who wanted to help me more than Andy. He has opened up so much to me, and this is another quality I want so much. To have intimacy have a partner. I have opened up and shared things in my pass, and I have hinted at things in my life that wasn't very nice, but no I haven’t opened up everything.  Is this something I should do? 

Now for another question.  NG is separated and pays a hefty spousal support, a huge truck payment, and lawyer bills. Money is tight for him. He isn’t in debt (besides truck payment) and refuses to go into debt. He is very open about all this.  Me, on the other hand, I haven’t shared too much of my financial issues, but I do have a little more free cash than him.  There have been a few times where he has neglected to pay me back. It isn’t a huge amount, but it is there.  Next weekend we are going to his hunting camp. We have planned this for a while now. He mentioned a few times that this weekend is on him until yesterday he said things are tight, and he might have to dip into his savings for groceries on the weekend.  I so much want a relationship that communications well but I am having a very hard time on when to communicate. Do I bring up he said he would pay, stay quiet or just offer to pay for the food? I am 50 years old you would think I would be able to know how to answer this.

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: jgib on September 30, 2017, 09:22:17 AM
I would have trouble in this situation as well, so I am gong to be no help!:(
Is he manipulating you because in the past you have fronted up and paid.  Why else would he mention he has to dip into his savings.....
Don't let feelings of resentment slip in, they can be tough on a relationship.  Just because you are more organized financially doesn't mean you should pay for everything.
I believe I would just ignore his comment and let him get the groceries.  He knew the weekend was coming up. 
Instead what he said, he just could have asked if you would mind picking up a few things as well, so it was a split for the food and drinks.
I hope it gets worked out smoothly for you.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 30, 2017, 09:47:58 AM
Thanks, Needy -- NG told me he once dated a woman who's son was on the spectrum so I am sure it will be okay. I made a comment when we first started talking about it that my son might just say or ask anything because he doesn't have a filter and NG just smiled and said he could ask anything. I was like, be careful what you ask for  :P

As an aside, there is a new show on TV called the Good Doctor; it's about a young doctor with autism. I watched the first episode last night and part of it had me in tears. I posted about it on social media and someone I know got into all this stuff about how bad of a show it was because it's so not believable. She was stuck on the fact that if a person acted like the main character, they could cause the hospital to get sued (not quick in responses, etc etc). I lost it and commented about how I have enough reality and wasn't watching it for that but wanted to see how they portrayed a person with autism, that I don't usually watch major network TV but will support this for my son and others like him. She had admitted she doesn't have the expertise to comment on the autistic behaviors but went on about the lack of realism in other ways. I mentioned my background -- dealing with the abusive first husband, my son's dad, and how the one speech the guy in the show made had me crying. No more responses from her. I mention it because you said something about how much to share, Needy. Different context I know, but there are times when it can't be helped ...

Specifically to your point, you asked about how much to share. I have used that phrase, that things weren't very nice, when I talk to my mom -- she knew about the first husband to a certain extent, more because she got a vibe from him, but I have never told her much because I didn't want to hurt her. Anyway, NG was very VERY open from the first telephone conversation we had. I think it's because he just wanted it all out there, accept me as I am or don't bother with me sort of thing. I figured if he can put it out there, so can I. However, the really bad parts I didn't share until we were well into our situation and he had shared something about his last marriage. I think I told the story somewhere on here about how he asked me to sit down at my kitchen table because he had something to tell me. He described this situation that had happened between him and his ex. They were just separated at that point -- he had told me that from the beginning and made it clear that he was getting divorced; even shared that he had messed up at one point because some paperwork came and he wasn't aware of the deadline to get it back in ... sent it a bit late but the divorce went through without any issues. Anyway, he told me of the incident and said he just wanted me to know in case things got ugly during the divorce, just so I would know his side of the story. He was shaking, so nervous to tell me. That night, I told him of the really bad things that had happened in the first marriage. We've shared some other things along the way as well so it's been quite open on that front. Like you, Needy, I have been married twice (widowed twice as well) and he describes himself as being married and divorced twice, even though there was no official marriage between him and his kids' mom.

I was smiling a bit as you describe the financial thing. So I am less of a 'saver' than NG is at this point I think. My second marriage was to a musician and despite our best efforts, we always lived on the edge financially, especially after he got really sick and couldn't play anymore. Thank God for retirement because he was able to get social security early. However that went away after he died of course and everything is on me. I work at three different universities as I do not have a single full-time gig. I just did a debt consolidation to get two broken vehicles off my property, so the bad credit I have is about to get worse for a minute. I am not concerned as I do already have a mortgage with a locked in rate and have a working vehicle as well, so there it is. Praying nothing goes terribly wrong in the next three years or so while I work this program! Anyway, a few months ago, NG ran into an issue with work. The guy he worked with was keeping all the work for himself so there were weeks when NG had no work (and no pay). He was short a little to pay some bills, so I lent it to him. Time went on and he didn't mention it. I had to travel a couple weeks ago for work and thought about asking for it back, but something just didn't feel right, so I didn't. The day before I was due to leave, he called me (very rare because usually we text about plans). He was in a panic about the rent and asked if I could help, even though he already owed me, because they were going to get kicked out; he lives with his youngest daughter (early 20s) and she hadn't given him the notice (needless to say, I wanted to say something about that, but didn't). He had started a new job, but with the way they hold back a week and them not paying except every two weeks, the timing was crazy. I told him I would see what I could do. In the end, I was able to help but I would be traveling and needed a way to get the money to him. Without hesitation, he gave me his bank information -- we use the same bank, just different branches -- so I could do a transfer. I have copies of his driver's license and social security card from when he was doing a job application last year; when he got this new job, he couldn't find his social security card and texted me from the office to see if I still had a copy. I did and sent him the picture of it. A week ago or so, he made a comment about owing me, so I know it's on his mind.

Before all this bumpy road, we never talked money much unless it was about us going somewhere. If it was an in-between week for me, I would say I was willing to cook at home because my pockets were kind of thin. He would do the same. We have a joke about it, actually. There have been times when we've gone out even when we were both sort of on the low side and he'd pay for dinner and say 'you got that?' if we were going to the movies too, meaning was I able to pay for the movie tickets.

I often think about the scripture that basically suggests that if you can't give, don't lend. I remember when I was going through something last year and couldn't get some medical tests done because I don't have traditional insurance. He asked how much it was going to cost and I told him I didn't know because if they found something I wouldn't be able to pay for it anyway. I think he was going to offer, but I wasn't trying to go there because of the potential future costs. I believe if I was in a situation, he would help me, but -- and back to the asking for help thing -- I try not to. I have been quite independent and want to be more so. I am trying to get into a better financial state because if this relationship does go forward and say we were to get to a point of talking about sharing space, I want to be clear that I can hold my own better than I do now.

It's not easy, Needy. I'm spitting at 50 as well and like my play-little brother says, dating is so junior high. Bottom line, I don't often offer to pay for stuff when we are out ... it just happens organically. NG is clear to say when he doesn't have any extra cash at the moment to go out and I do the same. Either he or I will cook at home in those cases. If you all are going somewhere, if I were you, I'd have some money tucked in my pocket and see what happens. If your NG says he can't, decide whether it's worth going or whether it's just easier for you to get the food. You've known his financial situation and it's up to you how you feel about it. If you all need to talk, do it soon. The 'experts' say that money is one of the main reasons relationships get weird or end. Is your connection to him worth it? Only you know.

{{{hugs!}}}
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: tybec on September 30, 2017, 10:17:51 AM
Oh, the money stuff.  HARD.  Yes, have read the stats on marital break ups over money management.  New territory.

Quote
NG is separated and pays a hefty spousal support, a huge truck payment, and lawyer bills. Money is tight for him. He isn’t in debt (besides truck payment) and refuses to go into debt. He is very open about all this.  Me, on the other hand, I haven’t shared too much of my financial issues, but I do have a little more free cash than him.

This is me.  I am not rich, either, but have some financial luxuries others do not, TEMPORARILY.  I live on SSI for now, work part time, to take care of my dying mother and my now teen son.  It is temporary.  I don't spend big.  The money issues are tough to maneuver. 

I went on vacation with a family a couple years out.  We didn't decide how to pay for things, and the dad kept paying for stuff for all 6 of us.  I was uncomfortable and then paid for all of us at other things.  I needed to just say, "Let's go dutch."  Well, I like that with NG when he has his sons and I have mine.   Just last weekend, we went to the movies together and he text he ordered the tickets and paid for them on line.  OK.  I planned to pay him our part.  We go out to eat prior, and he says when we go to pay, "Since I paid for the movies, how about you pay dinner.  We are here in the relationship, right?"  I wasn't prepared, and I said I would go dutch.  It was uncomfortable.  I paid him for the movie tickets, then.  But it was still awkward to me. 

He paid for my new washer and dryer as he has a credit card for that store and got $200 off due to his veterans status.  Well, I am paying him back for it in 3 months, though he got 6 months same as cash.  He teases me about owning it, me owing him.  It is funny sometimes, but then I told him I would write a check if that was a problem, so he knows he teased too far. I don't know the answer to all this.

My former house didn't sell.  They backed out of the contract last minute.  So, I have two homes right now.  I am a bit stressed. I am trying to not get upset about something I can't control.  I can survive it, I know, but it is a financial stress.

DH and I had nothing when we got married but our degrees, starting out,  and all we accumulated was together.  WE had one checking account for our whole marriage.  Blending stuff is difficult.  I will follow you all on this for information.
Not sure what I would do regarding lending him money. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on September 30, 2017, 10:25:21 AM
With the money thing....I've had 2 post widow relationships.o   I am financial independant, work full time, own my house, can have nice  vacations as long as I stay in airbnb  instead of the Hilton.

First guy was not on solid financial ground although could hold his own on regular things. It was when we planned a vacation that I worried about putting him in debt if we went 50-50. We discussed it and he refused to have it any other way, said we'd tally everything and split it. I agreed. .....but I snuck a couple of expenses onto a different credit card so it didn't sow up in the tally. I felt good helping out and he wasn't hurt.

Second guy is more solid then me. He definitely has no problem dropping a fair amount of money on tickets or outings. I on the other hand have gotten to this point by being frugal. I contribute to our dating expeditions but I choose the cheaper events to pay for because I wouldn't choose to go to a concert that cost $100 so that's on him. I would say we're 50-50 on who pays but I pay for cheaper things so 60-40 on cost
 We don't really talk about who's paying except when we vacationed and this time we did an honest 50-50.

It's funny I liked when I was able to help first guy and I like that I get treated nice by second guy. Personally if I was able to help with the hunting trip and wouldn't be stinging from it , I would do it even if he said it was on him. ( that is as long as he's willing to accept help)



Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on September 30, 2017, 12:01:31 PM
Great responses everyone. 

I agree with you Arneal, I don't lend money and actually, expect to get it back.  What he owes me is under $100 so no I am not really worried about it and his handyman skills have saved me so much I really feel bad even complaining about it, but yet I have. I had one friend that took advantage of me financially and I am just a little worried that I might be doing it again.

NG is a heavy duty mechanic and makes good money but if he makes more his spousal support goes up. My salary bounces around from semester to semester and right now I am making extremely good money but putting in long hours for it. Andy wants to help me where ever he can, but until my sons accept him I have to turn him down on most of the chores he wants to do around the house.

I need to work on this sharing and communication thing. You are so right Arneal, dating is so junior high. 

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on September 30, 2017, 12:02:47 PM
About money - NG and I split most everything 50/50, occasionally he'll pay for something like theater tix and then I'll do the same kind of thing another time.  I don't share anything financially with him but believe that I have a little more wiggle room with money than he does, so there are times that I don't expect to have him contribute.  He's never asked for a loan, for me this would bring about a conversation about living within a budget and what you can afford to do together.  Months ago I told NG that I didn't expect us to align with each other on all things, financial stuff is hard though and I believe something that needs straight communication.  Awkward to talk about, but like jgib mentions I can see where resentment can easily set in and I hope this doesn't happen for you.  NG and I are talking about going away for Thanksgiving, I'm interested to see what his expectations will be as far as splitting the costs.  Eight months into this relationship, and I feel like now it's getting into some real life stuff.


arneal  My son is a high functioning Aspie, he also has very little filter and there have been times when I wanted to dig a hole and jump in after some of the things that he has said!  If you've let NG know what to expect, I wouldn't sweat it.  I haven't seen the TV show you mention but plan to check it out - living with somebody on the autism spectrum is a challenge and for those that don't understand it, it's frustrating to try to explain.  I'm one to usually stay private, but that would be a time when I would open up and willingly share my experiences too.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on September 30, 2017, 04:32:58 PM
tybec -- yeah, LH and I came into our situation at pretty much the same point; I worked for the community college and was renting a 3-br apartment (one for me, one for my son, and one as a study for all my books) and he was renting a 3-br house and lived in the basement so he had a nice place for his daughter on the times he had her and for him and his dad. When I moved there as it was in the same town as the college, I stayed in the basement with him, his dad had the first floor br and my son and his daughter each had their own room on the top floor. The guy who rented it to him shafted him in the end so when it was time to move, I decided to try and buy. I got the house I wanted and we all moved there, except for his dad, who had died before all the drama with the rental agreement started. When we moved west for my university position, LH was already retired due to his health and we leased a house until I found out how much a house that size costs out here (it was in the $500k range ... nope, we moved immediately). I bought the house I am in now. Each time, even after we were married, he told me to just go ahead and put it in my name. We never had much more than what it took to feed us and the pets and take care of the bills, so living on the edge is where I've been for a while. Now that I am a multi-institution adjunct faculty member, I hustle as much as I can to do what I want. Not easy, but for now, it works. I just have me and my pets to care for.

klim -- you aren't alone on the communication bit. NG and I don't really have deep conversations about money. The who's gonna pay thing comes up as it does and if one of us doesn't have, we say so and make different plans. trying, like you mentioned, NG said he and his ex-wife split everything 50/50; he would ask her for her half of the rent and that sort of thing. That to me is weird because LH and I were more organic; he would ask me how much I needed to pay the bills and sometime I would just say 'all of it' and we'd laugh because either he or I had bought something we really didn't need LOL. I think because NG and his ex had such a distant relationship from the beginning they did it like that. If we were to get to such a point and he moved here into my house, I wouldn't want to share an account and wouldn't expect to sit down and split everything in half. Dunno, just not my way. I'd expect a decent chunk to be able to buy more food and pay higher utilities, but beyond that -- saying of course that my income were to stay the same or increase -- I would be a bit more chill about it.

Thanks, trying -- NG knows that my son is on the spectrum and from his past experiences he sounds like he is prepared. We'll see!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on September 30, 2017, 10:35:51 PM
good luck with NG and your son tomorrow !
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 02, 2017, 12:36:13 PM
Thanks, klim -- it was good and not so good in my estimation. So there's the communication bit that we've been talking about here ... Saturday evening, NG texts me about planning for the meet up; he has been doing a lot of driving for work and was pretty tired and suggested that either I come there and we leave from his place or I come get him in the morning. I ask about the house rule and parking, since he'd been using his extra parking pass for his work truck. He answered that the truck was in the garage so I could use the parking pass and that the biggest issue was not having two bathrooms before; since the new place has two bathrooms, the house rule no longer applies. I laughed to myself about that and told him I'd come over. Just before I left home, I got a text from my son's house mom, suggesting we postpone because my son had not had the best day. I told her I was hoping we could go with it because 1) we postponed before and 2) both NG and I had rearranged our schedules for this weekend. She agreed.

NG and I had a quiet evening and made it to the place to meet my son. I was very nervous but the introductions went well and we left to go to brunch. I had picked this little Caribbean place and they both enjoyed the meal. My son said he had permission from his house mom to go pick up something from the store, so we did that before going back to meet her. The conversations were pleasant and he didn't ask too many questions. At one point while we were waiting for our meal, he looks at me and says he has a picture of his dad (my LH) up in his room, that he missed him, and wished he had been a better son. I told him that none of that mattered because he loved Dad and Dad loved him. My son then says he is grateful to have a second chance and would do better. Mind you, when we were about to be seated, he had asked where I wanted to sit and pulled the chair out for me. He then proceeded to try and tell NG where to sit and we made a joke of it, that he was 'directing traffic'. The waiter laughed too and my son said that he was just trying to be nice to 'his parents'. He referred to us as 'his parents' again when he blessed the table before we ate. I refused to look at NG -- how mortified was I, right?

So we finish up and head back to meet my son's house mom. She thanked NG for taking good care of me, said that we were cute together. However, as it turned out, my son had not been truthful about having permission to make a purchase at the store. She called him out on it and we discussed it right then and there. NG stayed out of it and before we all parted ways, it seemed that things were okay. My son shook NGs hand again and hugged me, we laughed a bit, and then we left. On my way to drop NG off, I get a call. I see it's my son's house mom so I pick up the phone to find out he really acted out on her. I don't usually drive and talk on the phone and am glad I didn't have it on speaker or anything. Just from my side of the conversation, NG could tell I was upset. He didn't say anything but just rubbed my arm.

When I got home, I texted him to thank him for the day and to say I was sorry it got a bit ugly toward the end. He texted me back this morning that he thought it was a nice visit and mentioned an adage about 'praise in public, punish in private' -- he agreed that punishment of some sort was in order but that it probably should not have been a discussion there since it was in front of him, the first time my son was meeting him. I get it -- he has shared that his mom had no problems shaming him in public when he was young. I wrote back that it's sort of a hit or miss because my son is quick to recognize when someone else is in the wrong and has expressed that the person should not act that way. His house mom and I have taken the same tactic with him, that if he acts up in public the discussion about it happens in public. No yelling or that sort of thing but a clear explanation of what the problem is, what his part in it was, and why it was a problem to begin with. This was one of those times that it just did not go very well. I know NGs text this morning was sent probably during a break at work so I don't expect to get an answer any time soon. I wrote a social media post last night about wanting to be a better mom and a blog post this morning about being a better parent. Gonna just lay low for a bit and lick my wounds ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: klim on October 02, 2017, 06:18:02 PM
Sounds all good to me, my sons could cause more problems then that and their not on any spectrum. Your son sounds like he was cordial and perhaps  a bit misguided in the parent comment but close enough ( did the waiter really need to know it was his mom and her new partner , that just gets complicated, I think he just simplified  it.

 As far as the sneaky shopping issue, you handled it there and then because that's what needed done. The punish in private comment, does not really fit here as it's not like you were just dropping NG off and heading back and could talk to your son. It's not something that could be put on the shelf till later . It transpired between your son , his house mother and you. You  were all together it needed dealt with. I'm sure he can understand that. I don't think any of this sounds like bad parenting, so I'm a little confused why you feel wounded.... anyways hope you feel all is good again soon.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 02, 2017, 06:24:15 PM
Thanks, klim. I think it was just that high expectation I put on the meeting. I was nervous as it's such a hard thing. My son wasn't too crazy about LH when they first met because it had been just him and me; he didn't remember his birth father but eventually came to see LH as Dad, which was a good thing. I was hoping he wouldn't ask too many questions and he didn't. I was just sad that the parting was not as positive as the rest of the afternoon had been.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on October 04, 2017, 04:29:39 PM
arneal   Sounds like your Sunday went well, and that NG was caring and understanding.  Parenting isn't easy even under the best of circumstances, things seem to have gone pretty well all things considered.  You prepared for a long time for this meeting, undoubtedly there were high expectations and some stress that went into it.
One of the things that I admire most about my NG is that he is a devoted parent to his daughters, and lately I've bent his ear on several issues with my kids.  He's been a wonderful sounding board and it's been good to share things with him not all of it positive.  Warts and all - our new mantra - with relationships come real life issues and lately I've been putting more of it out there to him and so far so good.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 04, 2017, 06:17:14 PM
Thank you trying2. NG was very understanding. He's working long weeks and I appreciate that he took time out of Sunday, which is usually his day to just veg at home, to go with me and that he said it was nice to meet my son. I am wondering if he'll bring up the whole 'my parents' thing at some point  :o
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on October 05, 2017, 11:39:57 AM
Arneal, I think your weekend went well too. 

My oldest son has always been challenging and NG has pointed out that maybe he has some autism issues as well. It is challenging. 

Just wanted everyone to know that NG did the shopping and didn't ask me for any money.  After work, we are off to his hunting camp for a long weekend together.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 05, 2017, 12:11:21 PM
Thanks, Needy and I hope you have a wonderful weekend of camping!
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 09, 2017, 11:14:47 AM
Happy Monday (and Happy Thanksgiving for those in Canada!): ever have one of those weekends where you're just cranky? That was mine. I was excited because the delivery of my 2 in 1 tablet PC was slated for Saturday (yep, I am a tech nerd ... love new toys ;D) but thought to reach out to NG to see if he wanted to do anything. He messaged back that he was tired from the week, which based on our conversations last weekend had been slated to be brutal as they were under a deadline to get a big job finished. He suggested Sunday instead. I replied sure, let me know, etc. and went on with my day. Sunday comes along and nothing. No 'hey, still not up for going out', no 'gonna stay in and do laundry', nothing. I enjoyed my Sunday but it made me think about our discussions here on communication ... I sent a text a little while ago though to say that I missed having the chance to wish him a good week in person.

I think I mentioned one of my son's friends, the young woman who calls me (more than my son does LOL) and for whom I am like a surrogate mom -- she's been living in a group home for more than 10 years and has no  one to talk to her about life it seems, so she calls me. I've talked to her over the last month or so about things my own mom never talked to me about :o Anyway, she called yesterday while I was in that sort of funky mood; we talked about decision-making. I told her there comes a time when she has to decide for herself what it is she will deal with and what she won't when it comes to her friends (everyone in her circle has special needs like her and she struggles to figure out who she should include as a friend).

It again made me circle back to our discussion about communication. When do we tell the new folks in our life precisely what we expect? How do we have those conversations? Here is where my own lack of good communication comes in. There was no meeting in the middle in the first marriage -- his way or nothing. Life was sort of organic in my second marriage and it wasn't until far into LH's illness that I had a pointed outburst of sorts when I felt like he didn't care about my feelings (in that case, the doctors had said he could not have one drop of alcohol because of the interaction with the medication they put him on after he came out of ICU ... he drank anyway and I was frightened). I want to be in a place where I don't open my mouth and sound like I expect things to go my way all the time. I guess trying to figure out more organic two-way conversations in this area is my difficulty.

This thing with NG isn't like that experience with LH, but I often struggle in the communication department ... sigh. A big part of my angst is about how we left last weekend after seeing my son. I am grateful for tybec's post on another thread ... it is what it is, no matter how I think about it. I am working on living in that space. In the past, people have struggled to understand how I engage with my son so I guess some things don't change and I need to accept that. I am hoping this whole thing is just me, in one of those over-thinking moments.

Thanks for 'listening', friends. Am grateful for each of you.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on October 10, 2017, 08:05:22 AM
It again made me circle back to our discussion about communication. When do we tell the new folks in our life precisely what we expect? How do we have those conversations? Here is where my own lack of good communication comes in. There was no meeting in the middle in the first marriage -- his way or nothing. Life was sort of organic in my second marriage and it wasn't until far into LH's illness that I had a pointed outburst of sorts when I felt like he didn't care about my feelings (in that case, the doctors had said he could not have one drop of alcohol because of the interaction with the medication they put him on after he came out of ICU ... he drank anyway and I was frightened). I want to be in a place where I don't open my mouth and sound like I expect things to go my way all the time. I guess trying to figure out more organic two-way conversations in this area is my difficulty.


Good question - I'm trying to address things as they come up, if it's something that bothers me I speak up about it.  There have been some awkward moments but so far things have been sorted and we move on.  Everybody has different expectations and standards, it's a give and take on both sides.  I don't think that letting NG know how you feel and what you'd like is putting out an expectation that things go your way all of the time, just that you have standards and are seeing if you can co-exist happily together.  I don't know that I would let NG know "precisely" what you expect - give it a little wiggle room and maybe you can come to a happy compromise?
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 10, 2017, 08:46:38 AM
Thanks, trying2. I think it's always a bit more difficult when you aren't sharing space with the other person. We have excellent communication when we are together, face to face; it's the in-between that is weird for me when it's by text. I suspect it's the writer in me, looking for more context than what is actually there. I am working on that 'it is what it is' frame of mind that I mentioned from tybec. It is slow learning for me  :-[

As an aside, he did reply to my text. As I took time yesterday evening to (over)process, I believe it's about comfort level. He is very comfortable with me, trusts me, and sees me as an independent person. I basically do what I want, when I want. I joke that my dogs and I are an unruly pack but at the same time I can be very focused. I suppose he likes that contradiction.

Midlife attraction problems. So junior high ...
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: trying2breathe on October 12, 2017, 08:22:45 AM
I find that there can be a lot lost in texting vs. RL communication.  I sometimes misinterpret his texts or the timing of them, creating something in my head when something else was intended entirely.  It seemed easier back in the day when all we had was telephone or face to face contact. Or letter writing!  I have a collection of written notes from LH, do those even exist anymore?  lol
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on October 12, 2017, 11:09:47 AM
Communication..... I really need to work on that. I have had so many issues with not being a good communicator, even with DH I just couldn't voice my words because I was so afraid of hurting him which actually caused a lot of pain and suffering on my end. 

NG loves to talk but sometimes I don't think he remembers what he said, I know it just could be a guy thing but it is frustrating but I have no idea how to bring it up. 

Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Captains wife on October 12, 2017, 12:59:45 PM
arneal - just a few words of advice from someone who hasn't been a great communicator (and I can be quite passive aggressive about it - i.e. if he doesn't respond to my text for a long time, I can act like a big baby and not respond to his for a period of time).

Its so difficult trying to understand what a person is thinking, especially in the earlier dating phases. The Sunday thing would have honestly bothered me - but on NG's end, maybe he just had stuff going on. But the lack of response would have left me wondering too (although I gather from your subsequent posts that he ultimately resurfaced).

But saying nothing if its bothering you will only fester and compound - and those feelings wont go away so having a gentle conversation with him (or being more proactive if you want to see him) is a good idea...just so he understands where you are coming from. Maybe he has no clue how his actions are bothering you ? I too also used be very self conscious about my son (as I was dating when he was a young baby and sometimes he would just lose it in front of the guy I was dating...and this guy I was dating wasn't great with kids).

One thing I learned from my ex BF was that I needed to be more proactive in communicating what I wanted and who I was to him - I expected him to read my signals and that's not fair...and I can understand in hindsight some of the reasons he got frustrated with me along the way. I think, too, its all about the way it is communicated. I would let things fester and then it would just come out (and not in a particularly nice way).

In my world now, for example, the guy I am dating used to just go silent on me for hours and hours when he had his son (divorce with limited custody) - but expect me to drop everything to talk to him when he was free. So I sat him down and explained in a nice way that is lack of communication during these period upset me - and this was a double standard...(see I'm getting better !). The end result - he definitely made some changes and acknowledged it. (He had no idea that he was doing that to me). Wishing you all the best in this Chapter 2 - this isn't easy territory.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 12, 2017, 03:27:40 PM
Your post made me smile Needy, about your NG not remembering what he said. Mine does that too sometimes ... he'll tell me something and then several weeks later (sometimes longer if it's a memory trigger moment) will tell me again. Sometimes he'll ask as he starts whether he told me the story before and if so, I'll say yes. Sometimes I don't remember until he's into it a bit and then I say something like, 'Oh, yeah! I remember this' and either leave it at that or recount a part of the story. There are also times when he's into whatever it is and I've heard the story before that I'll just let him tell it. Other times I'll tell him that I remember it. I try not to repeat stories so I don't know if he remembers what I say or not, but if he does and I've repeated, he keeps it to himself. That, or he doesn't remember. Or he likes my stories; I do write fiction for fun after all LOL.

But seriously, I wonder if sometimes for those of us who have been by ourselves for any amount of time or just on our own even in relationship if we tend to not talk generally. I think he's comfortable with minimal talk in between being face to face. I am too but when I want to be clear on plans, yet not pushy. Sigh.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on October 18, 2017, 03:07:41 PM
I also let him retell the story.  It's when he says he is free, then isn't, then right back to being free that is sometimes challenging.  Unfortunately, some of this is out of his control.  His Mom is recently widowed and he helps her out.  Hard to get too upset about that. 

All in all our relationship is going extremely well.  Still waiting for my sons to be a little more accepting but who am I kidding I knew it was going to be like this. 

Still working on the communication thing. NG says I am opening up to him which is good, just really not sure if you have to share all the "nasty" stuff with a new partner. 
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 18, 2017, 03:22:10 PM
Yes, the key there is 'new', needy. Plus, sharing I would say is a two-way street. If he is open to sharing ugly bits with you, hopefully he can stand to hear and be accepting of your ugly bits as well. NG was very open early on, even before we were intimate he shared deep things that I don't think I would have been willing to share early on. I then felt comfortable with sharing my own. Not graphically, but with enough detail to outline the difficulties and hurts.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Trying on October 18, 2017, 08:51:49 PM
For some reason, early in our relationship we were extremely open about our pasts and lots of ugly unflattering things.  I think we were both trying to scare the other off with the truth to avoid being hurt later on.  It didn't work, it ended up building trust instead.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: Needytoo on October 19, 2017, 05:35:38 AM
Last night I opened up to more of the "ugly", NG cried with me. This is what I want a relationship where the other person knows almost everything, and slowly I am doing that.  I can't believe I have only known this guy for three months, feels like we have known each other for so much longer.
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: marriedwithkids77 on October 19, 2017, 02:22:48 PM
I love reading your histories  :)
Title: Re: For those in budding relationships ...
Post by: arneal on October 19, 2017, 05:14:07 PM
Good for you, Needy! It is interesting how we grow and change. Over time, we come to learn more about ourselves and make changes about how we allow people into our inner circle. We figure out what we will and will not accept. This has become more apparent, maybe because it is Diwali and along with my Hindi and Nepali friends am more conscious of renewal and positivity this week. Or maybe I am just learning more about how to heal my own soul spaces. Either way, it is comforting to know that many of us are on the same journey ...