For those in budding relationships ...

[arneal]

Good for you, Needytoo. Much of the dating material I've read indicates that there is a fine line between being available and too available in the early stages of a 'relationship'. It is hard to tell when the line has been crossed! Being perceived as too unavailable, and a potentially good match gets creeped out. Being perceived as too available, and we might end up taken advantage of and hurt. Communication is key, as is doing what you did, Needy, in my opinion. Sharing that we love our NGs (if that's not too strong a word here) but that we can get along on our own is important.

[trying2breathe]

Hope that everybody is doing okay.  My in-laws and my kids are here, NG's kids are in town too.  Count down to Christmas - so far so good.  NG and I  are each doing our own thing and not co-mingling, not sure if I'll meet his daughters and that's okay.  NG and I talked this morning and he sounded stressed, I hope to get a chance soon to find out what's going on with him.  I let him know in a kind way that I have no expectations this holiday, other than family time and hopefully some good food.    He told me that it bothers him that we're not continuing our relationship in a normal way right now, it does feel odd to have a change in routine because our families are here.

 

Needy  Yay for you on dealing with your stuff, bet it feels good to make progress and not rely on NG.

[Virgo]

I'm a little disappointed with how my new guy is handling the holidays with me. I understand that the holidays are rough for people for different reasons, obviously I can relate, but barely any communication at all.  I guess I expected more...to much maybe.

[arneal]

Happy Christmas (Kwanzaa, Solstice ...) everyone! I made it to my mom's safe and sound. It is funny how places look different after a time away. I got so turned around, trying to drive to her house from the airport  ;D Fortunately the plane got it super-early so if I hadn't said I got lost, no one would have been the wiser!

 

So, milestone: I went to NGs on Saturday, determined to get a photo for my mom (or I'd never live it down, even though I could and did show her other photos on his social media). I did the usual, texted to say I was parked, and he was outside when I got to the door. He asked me if I'd brought my computer and I laughed, patted the pocket in my bag, and said 'like you gotta ask?'. We set up our computers to play the game we are both in and I was commenting about it. He was making fun of how enamored with the graphics and effects I was and said, 'My girlfriend is such a gaming noob' -- I tried not to grin my face off that he said it. So now I know. I waited until the end of the night and before he walked me to the car I said we had to take a photo. He suggested we sit in front of his Christmas tree. It wasn't a huggy-kissy sort of photo, just us sitting next to each other. My mom said I looked like I was going to burst; I realized after I had this cheesy grin lol. Anyway, he wanted me to text him to let him know my travel progress and when I landed and texted him that, he told me to tell my mom Merry Christmas and whatnot. I am planning to take a photo with my mom and text it to him with the one we took together. He did tell me my gift was going to be belated and I had already said the holiday isn't about all that; I think once we've been through losses like those of us here have, it's more about spending each day, being happy, rather than all the material stuff. But I am curious about what he's going to come up with. He does have very good taste so we'll see!

[tybec]

Woo HOO!  Made it through the Big Christmas Day! Now to get through NYE!

 

OK, not that bad.  After very little contact in 3 weeks, NG had kids from winter break starting to Christmas Eve at 8.  He took off time but I had to close up my work practice out of town.  Scheduling conflict.  WE finally got together briefly Friday, and my son taught his sons some coding with their new chrome books and robot.  Sat. we went on a cave tour (still not my thing), laser tag play as his son's birthday is today. We had his birthday dinner at MY house, as I have more space, and they hadn't been here for a month.  His mother made a cake, too.  It turned out nice.  Kids played video games for a while.  We had lunch on Christmas Eve and we chose to stay home, not go to church with them. NG invited me and my son over after he dropped his kids off to their mother, Christmas Eve. He was sad, ate almost a whole package of oreos with his bourbon.  YUCK.  His mother flew out Christmas Day and he went to Christmas Day dinner with me and my DS at my bestie's home  1 1/2 hr away.  My bestie's husband was my LH's best friend.  They are very welcoming to NG.  He stayed over, then , and we watched my favorite romance movie.  He had shared a couple of his favorites in the time frame we have dated. Different holiday than I have ever had. It was okay. My son is dealing well as we had NO family, a first ever.

 

NG and I had a long talk today about lots of things.  He listened well, and we talked about some ideas for the new year to help with contact. I explained I felt abandoned these last 3 weeks after I told him before Thanksgiving it is a dark time for me, and my mother just died, too.  He was logical, and I acknowledged what he said was true as far as time/schedule issues, but still, my feelings are important nevertheless.  He stated we had a good talk about things, and it is just going to be some inconveniences.  He is gearing up for court in March, and I  acknowledged he is going to be moody, as well, as he preps.  No great solutions, but talking.  So, see where this goes.

 

We had talked no presents, and he got me a necklace with a heart, my first present besides flowers and experiences together. So, will see what I can do  We haven't had a get-a-way since Feb. That is too long.  So I may plan that. 

 

The holidays.  Mind fields for sure. 

[arneal]

Hey tybec - glad it went ... well? Sounds like you stood your ground and said what needed saying. That's a good thing.

 

My mom was so excited to see BFs (I can say that now ) photo. She couldn't wait to ask me about how we met and all that. It was fun telling her the story. While we were out yesterday, she decided she wanted to mail him a 'thinking of you' card just because. She had me write in it that she was sorry he couldn't have come with me. Made me glad to see she was so accepting, not that I doubted it but good confirmation, you know? I popped into the online game we are playing and caught a bit of chat with one of our other team mates; BF and the guy were writing about relationships and he wrote that I was the most down to earth woman he's ever dated. Wow ... yay, me  ;D

 

I went shopping yesterday for all sorts of food items that I can't get at home. I told him I was bringing a bunch of stuff back that we can have at new year's so we'll see how that goes.

[Virgo]

Arneal- It sounds like your mom is happy for you.

 

Since I didn't hear much from my guy during the weekend I decided not to contact him. The last time we spoke was Sunday, and we texted Monday. I find it hard to believe that work is so busy and stressful this week that he can't send a 5 second text message here and there. Even though we planned on being together this weekend I'm starting to make other plans. We've been talking about NYE for weeks now because we have a bet going for the Vikings vs Bears game. It's been fun teasing each other about it. Honestly, even if he does want to get together this weekend I'm not sure I want to. We'll see.

[tybec]

Today is my wedding Anniversary.  Would have been 27th.  NG had time to burn this week,  and he swears he told me.  I swear I would have remembered that!  He is off today.  But I made plans to do some work stuff at my new job.  He saw me last night a couple hours but given he was off, he could have stayed at my place.  😑.  I just don’t understand it.  We are talking about it.  He is volunteering tonight at a homeless shelter so staying all night.  And then delivering meals in the a.m. for another organization.  All very honorable things but it is the holidays and his kids at at their mom’s and here I am.  He invited me to deliver meals tomorrow.  He has a list of chores but states I am on the schedule.  No definitive plans for NYE.  We are going out tomorrow night.  Last date night was November 11.  We have spent time together but not an adult date.  He is a very good man and great father.  He talks long term.  He sends me sweet memes about growing old together.  I still have to see about us long term.  Not sure if our ideas of how couples are will mesh.  (Have I mentioned my brother is a marriage and family therapist and he and my sil do communication seminars and marriage enrichment weekends? 40 yrs together.) I wonder if this could have lead to the demise of his marriage.  Good provider, volunteers, but wasn’t there for her emotionally or physically.  Idk. 

 

He has text me today, asking if I am ok.  That has been his Mode of Operation.  Just check in.  Keeping on. 

 

To a wonderful new 2018!

[trying2breathe]

Meh ..... this holiday stuff is making me question my relationship with NG.  We've seen each other once this past week, we're both managing visiting family, etc.  He's been good about keeping in touch but it's wonky, for lack of a better word.  We haven't exchanged Xmas presents yet and I'm thinking of telling him to forget about the gifts as it seems so anti-climactic at this point.  To add to the frustration - I did end up meeting both daughters on separate occasions, both were not happy to be there and it was obvious that NG forced them into meeting me.  It was painful to sit across the table with a 23 year old that refused to talk and was on her phone pretty much the whole time.  Is it unreasonable to expect something more from a 23 y/o?  Why would he force DD's into meeting me if they didn't want to be there?

 

NG mentioned New Years - we'll see. 

[arneal]

Happy New Yr to all - I am at the airport awaiting my last leg of the trip home. I am glad I spent time with Mom. We are all getting older ... I saw one of my dearest friends (we have known each other for like 40 yrs) and LHs cousin and her boyfriend. She is more family to me than some actual relatives. Her BF was a very nice man. She was so tickled when I showed her the photo of me and NG together and when I said he was my BF. I kept up with my game play so he and I messaged during the week. Not sure if he will come over on Saturday or Sunday or both but we will see each other. My mom was happy and wants to meet him. I am sure she would enjoy feeding him as much as he would enjoy her cooking! I will be glad to get home and back into my routine though. Traveling is hard on the body!

[Needytoo]

Part of me will be so glad the holidays will be over with. My oldest son has been a royal pain in the ass, it really hurts to say but he is on the road of being an alcoholic just like his father.  I on the other hand refuse to be an enabler any longer. In a few weeks I will tell him he must leave.

 

I took your advise Arneal and tried not to be so accessible to NG. On Christmas Eve Eve, I spent it at my girlfriend's.  Her and her husband separated and she was dating a guy before her husband even moved out. I try not to judge but she had no problem judging me.  She knows I was upset because NG and our plans got changed last second because his ex-said he could have the kids and she said that I should drop him. Her NG she calls a sugar daddy and that I should find one as well. We talked and I said I often didn't put my husband first and that I want to put NG a priority but unfortunately right now he can't put me first and she said another reason I should drop him. 

 

Christmas afternoon I needed to get out of my house (mostly because of my eldest son) and I spent it with NG and his Mother.  I really love this guy. I thought I would spend more time with my kids but my youngest doesn't want to because of the oldest drinking and he is spending time with his friends while my oldest continued on his drinking.  So I spent some time with NG and his kids and really enjoyed myself.  Today he brings them back and he has booked us a fancy hotel for the new two nights.  I can't wait!!

 

On a side note how does one deal with the crazy ex. This woman has threatened to have NG killed.

 

 

[tybec]

Well, NYE's eve eve...

 

Arneal, So happy you had a good visit with your mom and finally got a pic you wanted to share.  Sounds like it is coming together.

 

Needytoo, Trying2breathe and Virgo.  I don't have the exact situation but I feel it all.  This new stuff is difficult.  How do others just seem to seamlessly flow through it all?  I guess with our losses, we overthink a lot.  I am not ready to jump into all of it, like at the beginning of the fun dating euphoria.  There is a lot to consider.  IDK.

 

I made it through what would have been my 27th anniversary.  It was the least upsetting.  IDK why.  NG worked on pics yesterday.  He files them, shares on FB the best ones, burns CDs for back up.  Very organized.  He posted 4 with us or me with the kids on FB.  We are truly official.  He knew the day.  Timing?  Many friends gave kudos.  I don't think many remembered my anniversary but a few.....probably those in it. 

 

I did get up and deliver meals with NG.  It was a nice thing to do.  I did lots of volunteer work over the years, but stopped with having a young child and then LH's death.  Trying to survive.  It felt good to do for others. 

 

NG and I will work out this afternoon together. JOY and Health are my resolutions for the year.  We are going to support each other in moving more    Pre NYE party tonight.

 

Oh, yesterday I did call him to eat a late lunch.  I brought up a lot of stuff with my kid.  I am dealing with a surely teen son who is not responding to NG's overtures.  We discussed some things that were not pleasant, and I did bring up some things I thought were hypocritical with him with his boys.  We got through it.  WE are sorting through some of this before major integration.  And he has 10 weeks to court battle.  UGGHHH...... 

 

Again, Happy New Year 2018!

[Virgo]

I think for now I'm done. We went a whole week without communicating. He texted me Happy New Year. I replied with the same. That was it. I'm sure he was waiting for me to act as if nothing happened and make it ok. Not happening. He needs to work through whatever it is he's going through on his own. I'm thinking this was just bad timing, but time will tell. I'm not going to wait around. 

 

I suppose I'll be leaving this thread. I have two other men that have been asking me out, of course I said no before, but maybe sometime soon I will meet them for a drink.

 

I got exciting news yesterday. I have an interview tomorrow for my phlebotomy certification program.  They choose 6 people per class.  There's only one spot available for the January class, but I think I'm interested in the May class. It's just better because of my girls schedules. I'm excited, but scared. I've been a stay at home mom since my oldest (18) was born. Long time!

[arneal]

So sorry to hear Virgo. I hope you will pop in to let us know how you are.

 

I got a call from my cousin today; she told me she decided her NG was better off as a friend. She had told him earlier in the day and wanted to let those of us who knew she and he were trying to grow a relationship that things had changed. She said there was too much drama with his lifestyle and different philosophies about life. So there it is.

[tybec]

Happy Jan. 2!

 

Hope all is settling down!

 

Virgo, I would understand you moving on.  NYE and no contact with him.  Sounds like there are more interesting guys out there.

 

 

So, moving on.  Jan. 20 is my sadiversary, so another 3 weeks and hopefully, I will be able to state I am through the trenches of the last of the lasts.

 

NG and I have spent a lot of time together.  His kids were with their mother.  We have had some deep and difficult conversations.  It has been tough.  I don't know where we will land, but we are spending more time together as a couple yet have some real challenges for a real "couple" relationship.

 

I laid out my feelings/thoughts, and it was scary!  I heard what he had to say, too, and it was unpleasant.  But we have it on the table.  It is what it is.  We are not looking at living under the same roof for a while, like a couple years.  I respect he needs to be with his kids as much as possible, time, and  I am unwilling to take him away as I know what limited time is, now.  However, I also am not waiting for years, like his youngest turning 18, 10 years.  I did tell him others have thought he was selfish with his time.  He was defensive, but also saw me as "wishy washy" and I am.  I logically understand his circumstances, but then I emotionally want it all, which I have told him.  I told him my understanding is men will move mountains to get the women they want. He is moving mountains now for his sons.  It is all boiled down to if I can wait, do I want to wait, or not.  I told him I will let him go if it is too much turmoil as he doesn't need it, and I don't either. 

 

BIG kudos to you all that blend and figure it out.  It is hard....

[arneal]

tybec -- good for you for getting it out there.

 

Your post makes me think of a conversation I had with my cousin (actually, LHs cousin but she is more family than some of those who are 'really' related) yesterday: she called to tell me that she is not doing the BF/GF thing after all. Turns out she and he had too much of a difference in life philosophies to continue in that capacity. She said she talked to him and told him she could not be his GF, that at this point she had no intention of marrying him because their life stages were just too different (he is basically co-parenting his two -- of five total -- grandchildren almost full time and they are the youngest, one of whom has major issues ... she set a trash can on fire in the apartment and was happy about it...). When it is time to move on, it's just time to move on.

 

BF came over on NYE; he commented that I had been away for a long time (five days, during which we still communicated in the game chat) and we lauged about that. We ate like hogs (I brought all sorts of goodies back from Mom's -- I had shipped myself a package because I can't get some of those foods in SoCal), played our game and watched movies, and were soundly asleep before midnight  The next morning he said he didn't get a midnight kiss and I said that technically we did -- we just celebrated on east coast time because we were still awake then. Had a good laugh about that as well. He talked to my mom on NY morning and said to her that he was sorry to have taken her daughter back so soon (I did my best not to grin like a complete idiot but don't know if I succeeded). It was a nice morning and I sent him off with lots of leftovers. It was not the most romantic of get-togethers, but it was nice to spend time. I hope to get tickets to the comedy club we had gone to last year for this coming weekend. We'll see.

 

On to 2018!

[trying2breathe]

NG and have had little time together the past few weeks but spent NYE together and it was good.  The relationship has shifted though, not sure how exactly but I plan to have a conversation with him about this.  He runs hot and cold, I never know what I'll get these days with him.  I'm in love with him, what started as wanting to just have fun has turned into something serious and different and it's starting to drive me crazy.  Ugghh - wish I could go back to those early easy days when the relationship was simple.                                                                                                     

 

Virgo, sorry to hear, a week without communication - hmmm.  Keep us posted on what's going on.

 

tybec  I bet it was tough to have those conversations, so good to do that though.

 

arneal  Glad that things are going well!     

[arneal]

You know, I find the whole dating thing strange, from beginning to now ... I was horridly nervous when we got together and have my moments when I am still nervous. Well, maybe not nervous exactly, not sure what to call it. I plan to go with the flow though. I realize that the first marriage was such a disaster because it was rushed; I was young, stupid, and wanted to be loved and in a relationship so allowed myself to be blind to the horrible parts of the connection to that man. I am grateful that the web was still in its infancy back then -- had tinder existed, I might have found myself in dire straits of pain and even more stupidity  My second marriage was good, a training ground to know what love could be. LH was a kind, thoughtful, funny, intelligent, caring, and patient man -- more than what my son and I deserved. I am grateful to have known and been loved by him and to have loved him. This thing is different yet; having met via an online site and the amount of things we can relate to each other on is so different overall. It's comfortable, nice, and I don't want to screw it up!

[MrsDan]

 

I logically understand his circumstances, but then I emotionally want it all, which I have told him.  I told him my understanding is men will move mountains to get the women they want. He is moving mountains now for his sons.  It is all boiled down to if I can wait, do I want to wait, or not.  I told him I will let him go if it is too much turmoil as he doesn't need it, and I don't either. 

 

 

I think a lot of parents who are not widows have the mindset of "Kids kids kids above all else" mentality and while that seems admirable, losing my husband has drawn into sharp focus how critical that partnership was. Kids depend on us to look out for them. But our SOs have needs and vulnerabilities too. Before Dan died I would have told you that my daughter was the absolute center in my life, and that her needs superseded all others. Now I know how ridiculous that is. Dan was my best friend and partner for 14 years. His death gutted me. So I value my BF with the perspective that he doesn't quite have. I'm not expecting him to put my needs above his daughter's, but rather I expect him to balance them in a way that is healthy for everybody, and i try to do the same. He's made a lot of progress there. But when you're dealing with the court system and exes and all that  it makes things even harder. I knwo a lot of dads in particular feel backed into a corner.

[daysofelijah]

Fiancee was all about "kids come first" at the beginning. He said it a lot in the first few months. I don't think that's the way it goes in a healthy relationship, but I gave him time. My marriage was not a very happy one. To my fault I focused way more on the kids and did not do enough to grow or repair our relationship. So I know too much of "kids come first" can be damaging.

 

Fiancee is more balanced now. Of course his kids are 3 years older than they were at the beginning too, and almost grown. I think he was just afraid in the beginning and it was a good barrier for him to put up to hold back from too much of a commitment too fast. Interesting the way things have evolved.

 

 

 

 

[Captains wife]

 

I logically understand his circumstances, but then I emotionally want it all, which I have told him.  I told him my understanding is men will move mountains to get the women they want. He is moving mountains now for his sons.  It is all boiled down to if I can wait, do I want to wait, or not.  I told him I will let him go if it is too much turmoil as he doesn't need it, and I don't either. 

 

 

I think a lot of parents who are not widows have the mindset of "Kids kids kids above all else" mentality and while that seems admirable, losing my husband has drawn into sharp focus how critical that partnership was. Kids depend on us to look out for them. But our SOs have needs and vulnerabilities too. Before Dan died I would have told you that my daughter was the absolute center in my life, and that her needs superseded all others. Now I know how ridiculous that is. Dan was my best friend and partner for 14 years. His death gutted me. So I value my BF with the perspective that he doesn't quite have. I'm not expecting him to put my needs above his daughter's, but rather I expect him to balance them in a way that is healthy for everybody, and i try to do the same. He's made a lot of progress there. But when you're dealing with the court system and exes and all that  it makes things even harder. I knwo a lot of dads in particular feel backed into a corner.

 

Love what you said here.....there needs to some understanding of the SOs needs as well as the children. My NG always put his son ahead of everything at the beginning (he was in the midst of a custody battle admittedly) and I explained there needs to be some compromises on both sides to sustain a relationship. Luckily there has been evolvement.

[Needytoo]

You nailed it Mrs Dan, I plan on putting my next SO first, but right now  I feel deep down NG isn't quite there. He is very open but sometimes he makes promises to me but doesn't quite follow through (helping me around the house etc). We are still at the 6-month mark so things are very still new.  I took Arneal's advice and wasn't so accessible and took care of my own stuff. I never thought I would be one of those women who play at the "rules" game but I think there has been a shift in his attitude to please me. Guess I will take that as advancement. 

 

 

[BrokenHeart2]

I would take his original attitude as what will come.  Advancement or "gotta step up to keep her" for now.....

Just sayin

Best of luck!!

[Virgo]

My NG and I talked. He said everything I predicted he would. It was somewhat satisfying to know that I'm starting to read him already. I'm not sure where it will go from here. He said he feels like he doesn't have a lot to offer me right now. He's fresh out of a long term relationship and adjusting to being single again. We went out last night and talked a lot about how we're feeling, great conversation. We always have a great time together.

 

During the weeks that we didn't talk I started talking to a guy I dated before. We've been talking for over a year, been friends even longer. He worked with my LH. When we first started talking he was off and on with his then girlfriend. After he ended their relationship we went out a few times. He said he wasn't ready. Dating just didn't feel right. Now he feels ready and wants to go out.

 

I don't know if I want to date both. Honestly I prefer to date one guy and get to know him, build on that, see where it goes. Both asked me out tonight and here I am sitting at home.  I told both of them I was waiting for a friend to come over to look at my dryer, which is true.

[jgib]

Virgo, I am the same as you, I prefer to date one person and get to know them. 

I am going to say something different in your situation.  I think you should date both for a little bit.  You will know pretty quickly which direction is best for you.  One, the other or maybe neither of them.......