Where will you be buried?

[serpico]

Not sure I'm really looking for advice but maybe stories on how others have handled this.

 

I was married ~15 years to my first wife who, like me, was Catholic.  She's buried in the church cemetery and there is plot next to her, ostensibly for me, and I also reserved a third plot in case I remarried.  The problem is that my first wife is buried in the middle of the three plots, which I knew would make it awkward if/when I got remarried, but I didn't realize this until long after she was buried.

 

Fast forward almost 4 years, and I'm now remarried to a non-Catholic, and after her Mom brought up the topic at Easter yesterday she's been asking some questions like... 'If you die tomorrow, where will you be buried?'.  She doesn't like the idea of me being buried next to my first wife, and I get that, so I told her just to cremate me and put me in a sand trap at my local golf course.  I really don't care, and I stressed to her that I'm her husband now and my first wife (or her family) doesn't have a claim to me or my remains.  She worried, though, that there will be pressure from them (or even my kids, for that matter) to bury me next to my first wife.

 

Anyone else deal with something similar?

[Wheelerswife]

Hi, serpico.

 

I imagine that you have seen some of my posts in the past about this.  My widower second husband and I decided to be cremated and split to have half of our ashes buried with our first spouse and half together.  My first husband is buried on the east coast.  My second husband's late wife is buried on the west coast.  I did what we agreed to do and I buried half of his ashes in California.  I have a plot here in Kansas for us, but have yet to actually inter the ashes.  I guess I just haven't been quite ready.

 

My first husband was Jewish and I am not.  In order to be buried together, I chose to place him in our local town cemetery.  I was raised by conservative Catholic parents, although I no longer practice.  The Catholic Church, however has some rules you may wish to consider.

 

"Historically, the Catholic Church has not supported cremation. However, these days it is acceptable for a Catholic to be cremated. That said, most churches prefer that the body be present for the Funeral Mass, meaning that cremation should occur after the Funeral Mass. Remains should be buried in the ground or at sea or entombed in a columbarium, and should not be scattered."

 

You may find that this matters to you or other members of your family.  I have specifically chosen an executor for myself that understands my wishes and will follow through as I would like for myself.

 

I understand that this is a really sensitive topic and I wish you well in coming to a solution that is acceptable to you, your wife, and your family.

 

Maureen

[Abitlost]

She doesn't like the idea of me being buried next to my first wife...

 

Serpico,

 

You haven't asked for advice so I will not offer any. Rather, an observation in combining this post with your recent "Marrying a Widower is Tough..." post: it sounds as though there are significant insecurity issues going on. I am not suggesting they are coming from you, because from what you write, it appears you have made attempts to assuage any feelings that your current wife is second fiddle. Still, it seems as though she has lingering resentment manifesting in passive-aggressive ways. That would be of concern to me if I were in such a position.

 

To answer your question, I will be buried next to my husband.

 

abl

[daysofelijah]

NG and I had a talk about this not long ago. He thought I would want to be buried next to late DH. I don't really think I will though. There is a plot available next to his grave, but it is a state away and my time in my life with DH seems so small and I anticipate being married again.

 

NG wants to be cremated and have the ashes put in a favorite jar of his. I told him that sounds good, but I want to also be cremated and (assuming we end up together) we will have a plot together, I'm not keeping his ashes in a jar on the mantle. He seemed to think that was okay.

 

I agree with abitlost's post above. Your wife does sound very insecure, to the point it is causing problems. She seems to be worrying about things that aren't worth worrying about. I hope she can seek some counseling or something to help her through that. Best wishes to you.

[Trying]

I am remarrying so this has come up for me as well.  My first husband, Catholic, was cremated and remains are buried in a cemetery with a headstone that has a place to add my name.  I will have half of my ashes buried with him so our children can visit us both if they so wish.  The other half will be up to my second husband if I die before him.  I have told him that I would want him to do whatever feels right for him, I will be gone so it doesn't matter to me if he wants a plot, wants to scatter them at Block Island where we are getting married or keep them in a drawer.  If he dies before me I want my remains to be wherever he is.

 

It is a touchy subject and many people have very specific religious, cultural or personal opinions about what is right. 

 

I know that you said you don't want any advice but I feel that your children are an important consideration in addition to needing to be considerate of your current wife's feelings.  Hopefully you will come up with a plan that will work for everyone and then get your wishes in writing.  I think it makes things easier on those left behind if we are clear in our wishes so that no one left behind takes the blame if someone doesn't like it.

 

Perhaps your current wife is a bit insecure or maybe she only comes across that way in the way you relate your story, I will not judge her based on so little information.  However I don't think many people would be comfortable with having a first wife buried in between them and their husband.  You would think the cemetery would have known to make the arrangements differently so she wouldn't be in the middle.

[Julester3]

Not remarried or in a relationship but I bought the plot next to my husband in an interfaith cemetery so we could be together again someday. He was Jewish and I am Catholic.

 

A good friend of mine had the plot next to her husband as well but she remarried and let it go back to her former inlaws. She plans to be buried next to her current husband if something happens.

[fairlanegirl]

No religious beliefs to contend with here so easier I guess. My husband was cremated and most of his ashes buried apart from some with his family. I have not remarried but all going well will remain with my current partner and maybe marry when we are older. I intend to be cremated and have my ashes split, half buried with DH, half with my partner.

[tybec]

My LH was cremated and scattered in the garden at the Veteran's Cemetery here.  He has a headstone and I can be put on the back as I won't be buried, either.  Interesting to think about.  My NG is 20 yr. retired vet.  Not talking marriage for a while, but not sure.  Could you be on two headstones, with your date of marriages?

 

Crazy stuff we have to think about.  Geez.....

[Wheelerswife]

Could you be on two headstones, with your date of marriages?

 

My name is on 2 headstones now.

[Bunny]

I do get your wife's insecurity on the subject, as I think women struggle with these kinda feelings more so than men seem to. My boyfriend, though on the jealous side when it comes to live men, is perfectly fine with my ashes being buried next to my husband's. It's a double plot, but he has a separate stone so potentially anyone could go there- I already offered it to his best friend.

 

Me? I told my bf he could put my ashes in the dumpster if he wanted as I'm just not that sentimental about the subject. But I'm also childless. You have a lot more people to try and make happy. The dead wife isn't gonna care what you do, so I suggest you concentrate all your energies on making the live one as happy as possible. Come to a definite decision with her on the subject and Put It In Writing so she's not the 'bad guy' if you die first. Many of us have seen first hand just how unreasonable loved ones can get over a dead body. At least spare her that particular heartache.

 

Maybe offer the two spaces next to your first wife to your in-laws? Perhaps they, or a stray uncle or cousin, could use the space...

[tybec]

Thanks Wheelerswife!

 

Ya know, it wasn't that long ago when people didn't live long and remarriage was common.  Child birth issues, poor health, accidents even more. 

 

The miiltary thing is the big deal.  I can't have my Dh's benefits if I remarry, so would the Veteran's Cemetary allow my name twice if it happened like that?  Don't know.  Anyway!

[tybec]

I am not sure of my decision if I remarry, but I have one son.  He will be the one, if anyone, comes to visit my grave site, so I think I would want to honor that is some way.  I don't know.

 

My father is buried way far away in a small, small town in a tiny cemetery plot of an old family church.  He had the plot for yrs.  Have never been to visit.  My mother will be placed there, too.  She knows we won't go.  It is so far away, off the beaten track.  So, maybe my son won't visit.  Hmmmm......

[swilson]

I told the boys it didn't matter as long as they carved my departure date on our monument. They can share ashes or scatter.

[Sugarbell]

My DH has Headstone on a single plot...smack in the middle of another huge families area. (Like he's surrounded by another last name family that I have no clue who they are). He was cremated none of his ashes are there-it was more of a Memorial place for my kids and all 3 of their names are on it under "Our Daddy"-His ashes are scattered in the WV mountains and I have a few set aside. So I never intended to be buried by him (I also plan to be cremated).

 

I think really it's hard to say what you would do...like if you died tomorrow...sure for the kids sakes I would want to be buried next to their Mother. But shoot...if you live another 40-50 years with new wife-you've had a long life together, long history with the kids, grandkids, etc...You two may want to go off and be buried on your own elsewhere. Or maybe all you together I dunno.

 

 

We can't control (well usually) when we are going to die. We can't control what circumstances are going to be around us when we die...I know it's easier said than done but she needs to relax and not worry about that stuff right now-Unneeded anxiety.

[Portside]

Hmmmmm. . . .  Good question Randy.

 

First wife's ashes were scattered in the flower beds/woods at our home. When R and I got married, we moved to our current home. R scooped up some of the flower bed's dirt and brought it with us to spread on the new house's flower beds. R wants her ashes to be interred next to her mother. I've asked to be buried at sea off of one of the ships my son has served on if possible.

 

But, if I know R, she'll put some of me in the flower beds with late wife, some next to her mother (and thus her eventually), and the remainder will be turned over to the custody of the Navy.

 

I've told all what I want done but whether it will happen or not remains to be seen.

 

It's early in your marriage - these things have a way of getting worked out if the folks involved want to work them out. I guess we simply must hope that those that love us can compromise and reach a solution that mostly works.

 

Happy Easter - Good luck - Mike 

 

 

[Mizpah]

A very different experience with it here, but confronting the issue so that's similar.  I have a grave site next to DH's, in a Jewish cemetery, where only Jews can be buried (NG isn't Jewish), and it's down on Long Island (NG is a hometown boy who hates the City and its surrounding areas).  When I lived in the City, I went out to the grave once a month.  Now that I've moved a couple hundred miles away, I haven't gone, not even once.  Now I have a daughter with NG, and NG and I are together and plan a future together.  (His late fiancee was cremated, and he has a portion of her ashes in our home.  I dug up some sand from DH's grave to bring with me when I moved.) 

 

The difference here from your situation: NG doesn't care, at all, like not one bit, where I'm buried, or where he's buried, or where anyone's buried (he also has not a twinge of jealousy or insecurity over DH - he's basically not human).  (Needless to say, then, NG doesn't have a grave pre-bought, and I *think* he wants to be cremated - I can't see myself being cremated - Jewish, the Holocaust, etc., etc.)  But I worry - mostly about my daughter.  I don't want her to think I love her father less than DH and want to lie with DH away from her dad and her forever, that I love her less than my old life, don't want to be buried far away in a place unfamiliar to her, related to a life of mine she never knew....  But part of me really does want to be buried there.  That place is such a place of peace for me, going there ritualistically helped me heal and I actually looked forward to going there.  And DH wanted us to be buried in the same casket, wanted us together forever, and I do believe he was my soulmate even though I don't believe in soulmates. 

 

But I'm coming to feel more and more like NG, like it just doesn't matter, but also am thinking of being buried locally where I am now, for my daughter.  It doesn't really matter for the ones who are dead - it's for the living, IMHO.

[MrsDan]

I own the plot next to Dan. The plots are in another state from where I now live and where my boyfriend is from. They are some thirty yards or so from my parents' plots. (Dad is deceased, mom has the plot next to him.) I'm not wild about the thought of cremation, I don't know why but I'm just not.

 

BF and I are no where near this discussion. I won't hazard to say where I'll end up, because I don't know his feelings about it at all. I know I want to be next to Dan in some way, which may mean getting over my cremation issue.

 

I understand your wife's feelings. However, here is something to consider. There is a very good chance that your current wife will have a very long lifetime with you. Hopefully you will grow old together. You'll share experiences, probably more than you late wife had. Your wife will get to watch your children grow up. All of these things, your late wife did not have. So, I mean, maybe it's reasonable for her to have you in your final resting spot?

 

I'm not saying this is the view you should take, just things to consider.

[Mrskro]

My mother passed away in 1991, my father then bought 12 plots.  2 for himself and my mom, 2 beside him and he planted a tree there.  The tombstone already had his name on it, he had them put in a cement bunker to prevent water from getting in.  He was always going to be buried there.  The plots are all in two rows, the headstones back against each other.  The 2 behind my parents were for my step mother and my sister in law.

I have a spot in the middle of my sister and brother. 

 

When my husband passed away my step mother gave me her two spots, and her spot was shuffled down by 2.  This was her idea.    I'm not sure if she knew she didn't want to buried there or it was just easier than involving moving my siblings plots around.  Like I said there's 10 spots excluding the tree.

 

My father passed away last January so I asked my step mom if she was ok with his wishes.  Her response was "It doesn't matter to me.  It's just a burial spot.  He's not really there"  She visits much more frequently than I do, as they are in my hometown about 3 hours away from where I live.  She puts flowers on everyone's graves, she once told me she was grateful for my mother, the love she had for my Dad, and was not looking to replace her, but add to Dad's life. 

 

Due to my brother and sister fighting her over my Dad's will and assorted other issues, she's actually given me those two plots now too and moved to a different spot in the cemetery to prevent and other nastiness from my siblings.  I was adamantly against this, it wasn't what Dad wanted, but again she said "I won't really be there either".

 

I'm of the opinion cemeteries are more for the living.

 

My name is next to my husband's on his tombstone.  I didn't ask for it, the headstone people just put it there.  I don't plan on remarrying, but who knows what will happen.  I was always against cremation.  But have now thought more about it and dividing me if I do.

[serpico]

Lots of good feedback here.  Yes, my wife has some insecurities, but as I've asked someone here before... who doesn't?

 

If I die tomorrow, she will be the sole caregiver for my three kids, and I know two of the three would chafe a bit under her reins.  She's no doubt thinking about that plus the fact that she would have a huge burden in explaining to the kids, in-laws, former in-laws, etc. why she is burying me NOT next to my first wife, but in a separate plot, presumably next to her.  I think I'm going to put something in writing and throw it in the safe just in case.

 

I also told her from experience that on the off chance I die tomorrow she'll have 99 more important things to worry about, but I think it's just one of those things she's having trouble shaking.  I also told her all this talk about my death is making me want to check the brake lines on my car  ;D

 

By the way, I discovered yesterday that Catholic cemeteries DO allow non-Catholic family members to be buried there, so that helps tremendously.

 

Thanks to everyone who responded!

[Mizpah]

plus the fact that she would have a huge burden in explaining

 

I think most of us know from experience - good or bad - that anything you can do to lessen the potential for this is a great act of kindness and love. 

 

You just never know what will become an issue.  Sometimes it's the big, expected stuff, and sometimes it's the seemingly minor, random nonsense.  Good move in easing her potential burdens.  (Your brakes are fine.  You're stuck with us and our morbid little club.)

[Wheelerswife]

By the way, I discovered yesterday that Catholic cemeteries DO allow non-Catholic family members to be buried there, so that helps tremendously.

 

Good for you on this one.  My first husband and his family, being Jewish, would never have allowed this consideration; hence, the town cemetery became our best option.

 

I also think that time may make a difference for all of you.  In the unlikely (yet possible) situation that your life is much shorter than statistically expected, you may need to consider what your own children might need.  Perhaps that document you place in the safe can have contingencies...for now...and for consideration after "x" number of years.

 

However you work this out, I wish you the best for you and your wife and for all of the children you have together.

 

Maureen

[Abitlost]

Lots of good feedback here.  Yes, my wife has some insecurities, but as I've asked someone here before... who doesn't?

 

 

Serpico,

 

Secure people don't have insecurities such as you describe in your marriage. (Relationship insecurity is not on par with being insecure about one's love handles.) 

 

I recall you speaking very early on in your relationship about your now-wife's issues when you referred to your late wife, and that she expressed dismay that you had photos of your late wife in your house. You stated that even now she struggles with memories of your late wife being brought up. To me, your combined posts read as though she doesn't respect your life before her. I am guessing that her issues are not specific to marrying a widower (referring to your recent post), but more of what seems to me to be her anxious attachment style.

 

There is a book I would recommend called "Attached: The New Science of Adult Attachment and How It Can Help You Find - And Keep - Love" which might help you both.

 

"...each of us behaves in relationships in one of three distinct ways:

 

- Anxious people are often preoccupied with their relationships and tend to worry about their partner's ability to love them back

- Avoidant people equate intimacy with a loss of independence and constantly try to minimize closeness.

- Secure people feel comfortable with intimacy and are usually warm and loving.

 

In this book Levine and Heller guide readers in determining what attachment style they and their mate (or potential mate) follow, offering a road map for building stronger, more fulfilling connections with the people they love.

 

http://www.attachedthebook.com/about-the-book/

 

abl

[Mizpah]

Lots of good feedback here.  Yes, my wife has some insecurities, but as I've asked someone here before... who doesn't?

 

 

Serpico,

 

Secure people don't have insecurities such as you describe in your marriage. (Relationship insecurity is not on par with being insecure about one's love handles.) 

 

I recall you speaking very early on in your relationship about your now-wife's issues when you referred to your late wife, and that she expressed dismay that you had photos of your late wife in your house. You stated that even now she struggles with memories of your late wife being brought up. To me, your combined posts read as though she doesn't respect your life before her. I am guessing that her issues are not specific to marrying a widower (referring to your recent post), but more of what seems to me to be her anxious attachment style.

 

I respectfully disagree.  I don't know Serpico's wife personally of course, but secure people can feel insecure in certain types of scenarios.  That doesn't necessarily mean they're not a secure individual in general or that they form anxious attachments or that they don't respect their partner's former life or feelings or late spouse.  I know from my own experience.  I have never felt insecure in any of my relationships before.  But now I'm with a widower, and I have relationship insecurities.  It's not as simple or simplistic as it seems, or as I used to believe it to be before I was in my situation.  It is very hard to be with someone who will always love someone else.  I say that as both a widow and someone who is with a widower.

[Abitlost]

 

I respectfully disagree.  I don't know Serpico's wife personally of course, but secure people can feel insecure in certain types of scenarios.  That doesn't necessarily mean they're not a secure individual in general or that they form anxious attachments or that they don't respect their partner's former life or feelings or late spouse.  I know from my own experience.  I have never felt insecure in any of my relationships before.  But now I'm with a widower, and I have relationship insecurities.  It's not as simple or simplistic as it seems, or as I used to believe it to be before I was in my situation.  It is very hard to be with someone who will always love someone else.  I say that as both a widow and someone who is with a widower.

 

Obviously what I wrote is based strictly on what Serpico has expressed; my interpretation is that her insecurities are mounting and affecting her happiness. I suggested that book because it offers tools for relating with people of differing attachment styles.

[hachi]

I had an interesting conversation this morning with a cemetery caretaker about the oddities that she has seen over the years as a custodian. Family plots with more than one spouse are more common than you might think, and people completely unrelated to the family as well.

 

Personally, I don't think my husbands or my remains will ultimately reside there. It is more of a place to mark our existence. I have offered NG (albeit a bit tongue-in-cheek) a spot there as well if he wanted. He's keeping his options open.

 

I have told my children that if they choose to, they can bury my remains there if it is a place they would be inclined to visit. If not, well, disperse me and the rest of my DH's remains someplace beautiful and leave it at that.

 

I do think it is the kind thing to do to take care of your details ahead of time, and in writing.