Mizpah

Beautiful!  Congratulations!  How lovely and inspiring - and I love the peace signs hahahaha!  Awesome!!!

Serpico, congrats!!!  What a gorgeous place (and lady of course!).  Awesome

I don't think there's anything wrong with you being "not there yet."  It seems you've met this person only once?  Even with lots of communication, that seems only a bit of information (emotional or otherwise) on which to base a conversation about the future together.  In my opinion, see him a few more times before committing yourself even to a conversation on this.  I'd slide out of it by suggesting another date or saying, "For now, let's see where it goes," or something like that.  (For me, it's never worked to "see" more than one man at a time, and if you're not seeing anyone else, there's no harm in saying that, but also that you want more time to have "that" discussion of where it's going.)

But that's just my opinion. 

How did I know?  Like you, my boyfriend and I had texted and communicated a lot before meeting - for months.  When we met, I hadn't foreseen what was coming - it wasn't a date (in my mind).  But that's what it became it seemed, and between our first and second meetings (during which time I was traveling in the Middle East and Europe, and I was surprised by the fact that we texted the whole time), I had a sense of inevitability.  Do you have that sense?  I had a feeling - I'm going to sleep with this man!  It was almost outside myself.  I suppose I wouldn't have had that feeling unless I'd been into him, and now, seeing as we're together three years later, I guess I *was* into him, hahahaha. 

My advice: take it as it comes for a little bit, see where it goes, see if you still really like him after getting together a few times, etc.

I can see this from both sides, as you seem to.  But it also struck a person chord with me (cord?  whatever). 

About a year and a half after DH died, my mom was moving into a new apartment (new to her).  It was being renovated.  She'd mentioned the contractor a couple times - what a nice guy!  Etc.  Then one day she called me to tell me OMG this man just lost his fiancee in a horrible car accident and it really impacted her, obviously because of what I had gone through.  I immediately went into YWBB mode and thought, "What can I do for this person?"  (Person!!!  I wasn't thinking "he man, me woman!")  The next time I was visiting my family, I left some pastries and Gatorade there with a note offering an ear of someone who "gets it."  Over the next few months we were in touch by text, and we met months later (I lived about 3 - 3 1/2 hours away).  He, within minutes of our meeting one another, reached out and touched my hair, and made it very clear he was interested in a "me man you woman" kinda thing.  After a couple hours of talking, we were going to go to another bar/place, but instead drove me to his house.  I avoided the inside and wandered outside by the river, looking at stars (alcohol!).  It took me aback - what I saw as his advances.  I felt really torn - I was attracted and it felt inevitable, and he was a consenting (and forward) adult, and a few weeks later we began a thing.  Over that summer, I did things like always reach out to him.  (I felt guilty at the prospect of lessening contact "just because" we'd slept together, as I had been a support person prior to that.  Right before we began our fling thing, I told him I didn't think it was a good idea because I was the only person "like us" he knew and we should not complicate it.  But.)  When I was in town, I'd bring him "the best cookies in NYC," etc.  I'd always visit him (my family lived there and I visited the area anyway, and he hates the City, had an extremely relentless work schedule, and a son on his days off), and he only came to see me once (everyone who knew him was shocked - "wow he must REALLY like this girl," they later told me they thought).  But still: he only came down once, and I visited him many times.  In many ways, I took on the caretaking role or the pursuer role (depends on the eye of the beholder - see below).  Fast forward.  We now are raising our daughter and in a committed relationship. 

And this is what I'm trying to get to (sorry, long-winded).  His fiancee's family was (understandably) not happy that he'd "moved on" "so fast."  Her mother told me that what she knew about me was just that "some girl" was "bringing him cookies" (I don't know if that's his words or hers, the impression he gave or what she wanted to believe).  What she knew was that I was contacting him.  That I was going to see him.  That I was pursuing him.  Hearing this was so upsetting to me, as I'd contacted him altruistically (ok, probably tainted with a bit of "I'm such a nice person!" (hahaha) but nothing sexual/romantic, initially).  I had no "designs" on him.  I wasn't targeting him in his vulnerability to "be my boyfriend."  I certainly was not pursuing him (he touched my hair!!!!!! he brought me to his house!).  I felt defensive (I was seen how you describe the babysitter - an opportunist throwing myself at him).  I felt misrepresented.  I felt hurt. 

I'm not saying the babysitter is the same.  Maybe she's taking advantage of a vulnerable man for her own needs/wants.  But no one *really* knows what goes on between two people but those two people, or what he's encouraging and seeking privately.  A situation could give the impression from the outside that one is the pursuer, but the other very well could be, even if she initiated contact.  I was tempted to refuse to engage with my boyfriend because I felt he was vulnerable and not capable of making good decisions, but who am I to decide that for him?  How paternalistic and controlling that would have been.  He's a grown man, who can and should make his own mistakes - but maybe it's not a mistake. 

(As for feeling guilty for being a DGI, I'll admit right now that I felt a tad judgy even about my own situation/boyfriend - I was distraught for years, and he "fell in love" in less than a year....  But that's a whole other tangent.)

*I'm so sorry about your friend. 

Oh gosh, hon.  That's so hard.  So much weight on you.  I've found that things I wouldn't expect to hurt as much because of what we went through in widowhood actually hurt much more badly than I thought they would.  Widowhood didn't give me the armor I thought it did.  I give you so much credit for having the bravery to do the right thing despite the pain of it.  My advice is the same as the stuff I'm reading here: no contact will allow you to heal faster and to disentangle from emotional involvement.  Therapy is the best.  Talk about it a lot - to us, to friends, to yourself in journals or emails to yourself, etc. - get it out.  Do things that make you feel good in a simple way, things that don't have any relation to him or memories associated with him, like going for a run or taking a walk after dinner or before going to work or reading books or taking a road trip to sit by a lake or something....  Sunshine and the outdoors help so many things.  I'm so sorry that you have gone through this and are going through it.  Here for you if you ever need to PM someone, and we're all here for you. 

I'm told myself I would not get upset if this happened, that I'd been through worse, but

I'm so so sorry.  I always feel like I'm so strong!  I've been through something so hard and came out the other side!  But then when upsetting things happen, I find I'm not the stone fortress I thought I was, at all.  This is especially hard though, because we  put so many years and so much of ourselves into our careers.  It's such a huge part of our time and energy and mind and life.  I wish I had awesome advice or you could come over and sit on my couch and yell and cry and hatch a plan.  I'm thinking of you.  You're awesome.  They're so dumb.  Big mistake.  Big big mistake. 

I'm so sorry.  I know that losing parents is in the natural order of things, but I still can't imagine a world without my parents (even after losing DH so young).  Thinking of you.

I'm so sorry.  It's so hard, the first birthday.  The person who witnesses and values your life most isn't there, and life feels sad and empty.  On my first post-death birthday, I left town and got a hotel room on a river in the mountains.  I sat on the balcony in the chilly air under a blanket and stared.  I just stared.  DH died when he was 28, and I had 28 hours of not speaking.  It sounds dramatic now that I'm retelling it, but it felt like exactly what I needed.  (People gave me $h!t too - they even had the hotel send a special fancy dinner up to my room, and paid a local massage therapist to come give me a massage (and not speak to me).  I appreciated it, but also in my head was unable to understand why it was so unacceptable to people for me to just retreat....)  My widow friends and I, in the first few years (I'm at 5+ now) would always say, instead of "happy birthday," just "Birthday!"  Thinking of you.  I hope you're doing as well as you can be, whatever that means for you right now.

Yikes, no!  Sounds like (hopefully) a very isolated and insane incident.  ("At the mall?"  What a b****.  Even insecure, paranoid and/or overly protective people should at least be somewhat polite and compassionate!)

I keep trying to think of how to articulate the feelings I have when I read about him in your words, and about losing him, after already having gone through so much....  And I never can.  Thinking of you and sending love and admiration.

Certainly sounds like PTSD.  I think that talk therapy/psychotherapy is supposed to really help.  I definitely had some PTSD after DH's sudden death.  I was in therapy twice a week for 8 months, then once a week for a year more.  I credit therapy with a lot of my fairly healthy (IMHO) way of dealing with his death.  It sounds like not only his death, but the time leading up to it was extremely traumatic and heavy with responsibility for you, and it's coming out in anxiety dreams.  Therapy is awesome.  I love it.  I highly recommend going.  It may help you feel lighter. 

Reading for hours and hours sounds like the right life decision to me.  You said you've taken care of your daughter.  You're back from a big trip, no?  You're maybe going through withdrawals of some sort, or re-integrating into your life, feeling in between still, in a heady space.  It's ok.  It sounds awesome to me. 

I hear this a lot in the old list of common public compliments a man gives his woman.  (Maybe others do, but I haven't heard it as much in a gender-opposite way.... which is a whole other potential thought tangent to explore.)

As many of you know, I've struggled a lot in my first real post-death relationship.  A lot of it was circumstantial and not necessarily about us inherently, about who we are.  Challenges included his very new widow(er)hood, an unexpected pregnancy (no - not unwanted, everyone calm down! hehehe - referring to a former thread that got a bit crazy), a big move for me from urban to rural and from big social life to no social life, very difficult behavior from his son, financial worries, losses of freedom to a baby, and 16 months of interrupted sleep (baby).  We dealt with our strains and challenges - and each other most of all - in a less than graceful fashion, both of us.  I chalked it up to his damage from childhood and widow(er)hood and thought of him as emotionally abusive (and at the worst moments of our conflicts, he absolutely was).  But I refused to look at my part in (destroying) things.   

Finally, I became so unhappy that my life as I was living it felt untenable.  I started with a new therapist.  She listened to me and basically said, "Well, you're not going to change him and you're not going to leave him right now, so you need a plan to be happier and to be closer to the person you want to be, because you've lost your identity and you're acting and thinking like a victim."  Whoa. 

And what I've been realizing is that DH didn't make me a better woman.  He made me a happier woman.  So so happy.  Obsessively in love, and so adored, treated like a queen.  And I worshipped him.  But a better woman?  No.  He thought it was adorable when I was in a bad mood, even when I was nasty about it (confessions!).  He loved and accepted everything about me, even things no person should have accepted (I'm not horrible, but we all have issues, so I'm confessing *mine* - I can be a bit intense, wanting everything to be beautiful and perfect NOW).  Widower BabyDaddy doesn't think it's adorable to be negative or angry - cuz it's not.  DH was so confident and good-natured, nothing got to him, nothing ruffled him, he was so forgiving and accepting of everyone he loved.  I used to accuse BabyDaddy of giving only conditional love, or of being cruel in withdrawing love/affection to basically discipline me.  But you know what?  It wasn't that.  He just doesn't want to bear the brunt of my frustrations.  I wouldn't want to either.  And - call me crazy - I wouldn't feel like smothering someone in cuddles when they were consumed by rage toward me. 

In the past few months, things have changed a lot.  BabyDaddy has been so much more patient, so much quicker to get over anger, has dealt with me with much more humor and sweetness.  It's given me the room to examine my own behavior without feeling like I'm trading my self-respect (I felt too angry at his treatment of me to take any responsibility).  And I've been able to see how my own behaviors bring about a certain dynamic.  I thought I was so self-aware, I thought he was so much in denial about himself and people and emotions and relationships.  And he is in many ways.  But I was wrong about me.  I wasn't innocent.  My dissatisfaction wasn't wrong, but the way I dealt with it (and him - the alleged source of my dissatisfaction) was. 

We just had a really busy, hectic, stressful family weekend, and perhaps for the first time ever, we didn't turn against each other - not even for one quick second, not at all, not one tiny bit.  (That whole "you can't change him thing" turned out to not be so correct.  By being more patient with me, he changed my reactions.  And by changing my attitude toward him and blaming him less, he got sweeter.  We changed ourselves AND each other - we changed the dynamic.)  And I find myself in love with him in a way I never expected.  Not infatuation.  Not "everything's perfect and you make me feel like the only person on earth" (like I had with DH and like I believed was the only true happiness), but in a deep appreciation for what we share - with our significant individual and relationship flaws, because we easily could have given up, and I'm so so glad that neither of us did.  And I can honestly say that, against my will, he is making me a better woman. 

(He'd never admit it, but I'm also making him a better man.    )

I took mine off on his birthday immediately after I looked at my hand and thought, "I never want to take this off."  Then I did.  It was a weird disconnect between brain and body.  I had been wearing a simple locket with his photo in it, and eventually put the ring on the chain.  I wore it every day (until I moved in with my current boyfriend - I took it off out of respect/compassion/consideration).  I put the ring on every year on his birthday as a little "gift" to him/his memory, because he was very possessive (in a sweet, big, loving way - not a controlling, scary way). 

I hear you.

I'm way out, but back when DH first died, I immediately started sleeping on his side.  I felt like I wanted to be as close to him as possible.  I wanted to be him.  I wanted to be near him. 

I went to my first post-death wedding about 14 months after DH died.  It was really really hard.  I didn't allow myself to have any feelings until it was over.  I put on a crazy plastic smile and clapped and danced and loved love, but the second - The Second - I got in the car at the end of the night, I sobbed my heart out.  (My poor brother and his then-girlfriend, now-wife, driving and sitting in the front, while I scream-sobbed - reaching back to awkwardly pat my knee every few minutes....)  My only advice as someone 5+ years out, face your feelings.  Process them.  Allow them.  I know some disagree, but in my opinion, feelings denied eat you alive.  (My DH was 28 and was killed by a car accident that came up onto the sidewalk where he was standing, so I know the feeling of still being stunned and in disbelief - even still, though I was never "in denial," I feel that this incident was too improbable to even have occurred, though it did.  How could he be healthy and young one day and the next non-existent?)  My thoughts are with you. 

Yay!  Fun!

Aw, yayyyy!!!!  That's lovely.  Congratulations on finding someone you adore. 

Back when I was about 15 months out, I forced myself to date someone who was nice but didn't interest me in any passionate way.  It felt safe and I needed to make myself face the social world again. 

When I was ending it, I told him that I couldn't let myself feel anything for him, because if I felt anything, I'd feel everything.  He thought I meant that if I felt anything for him, I'd feel everything FOR HIM.  I didn't correct him, because he was nice and I didn't want to take that away from him.  But what I meant was that if I let myself feel anything for him (or any man at that time), I would feel everything - for DH - about DH - about another man being the man in my life/future who wasn't DH - the depth of my grief that I *couldn't* feel being "single."  I had been ready to delve deeply into my grief - on my own in the world, but not the complexities caused by loving a man who wasn't DH. 

It's like a whole new world of firsts, and you know those grief firsts are intense.  So much more so when it's love again, and the player is not DH/DW, but a person you never would have met/known/loved had it not been for death.  It causes so many intense conflicting simultaneous emotions. 

Also, Tofinoman: wow! 

Yes, you can definitely do it!!!  You know you want/need to and you know it will benefit you, and you will find it in you, you will muster it.  "I don't know how to change it."  I keep saying this to my therapist.  We're going to figure it out.  Little by little, inch by inch, moment by moment, reaction by reaction, choice by choice.  <3

Jen, I'm so glad that you're doing this for yourself and that it seems to be a departure from your earlier experiences with therapy!  I hope it continues to be beneficial.  I asked my old therapist once what the point of therapy was and she said, "To identify, understand and change patterns of thought and behavior that make you less happy than you could be."  I come back to that a lot.  It sounds like your therapist is really going to help with that.  And it's so strange - this is the 3rd or 4th post I've read on here this morning that has made me think, "Wow, that's EXACTLY what I dealt with/am dealing with!"  I just started with a new therapist (I had someone in the initial stages of grief but moved and have been a bit adrift - finally I was just feeling too bad about things to continue the way I was and had to find someone).  Her approach is way more practical than I'm used to (I used to see a psychoanalyst, and could've spent decades analyzing things and "thinking my way" around things), and I too have found through talking with her that the problems I'm facing now are not sourced in what I thought they were.  I had to face things I didn't want to face.  So I have no wisdom, but I'm walking a sort of similar path in my thought/mental/emotional life.  Solidarity!  I think it's awesome that you decided to do this, that you could recognize that you had hit the point where you needed to take action, and took it.  Maybe you'll find your new anchor within yourself....  I don't know.  But I'm sending love!

After getting home from the hospital without him, my most immediate urge was to phone him to say “you’ll never believe what just happened”.  It was heartbreaking to know I no longer had that someone to share the details of my day with.  And so I decided I would write him a letter every day to tell him those things. 

Oh, Kate.  From 5+ years out, so much of what you said brought me right back to where you are now, and where I was for the next year and a half or so of my own "journey" from my own 29th (DH was hit by a car while standing on a sidewalk on the 29th - severe brain injuries - and I knew he was gone on the 30th).  I too was consumed by a need to talk to him about what had happened to him/us.  I too wrote him letters (I also, at the same time, filled other journals with all the memories and unique characteristics about him I could remember).  I too also felt as though I died when he died (as I'm sure we all feel we did).  I too was childless and so had the oyster world you have before you. 

I'm really glad for you that you have this next year to protect you in a way from "having to" make big decisions about next steps and big changes.  It's almost as if this summer is a little microcosm of that "empty" or blank time that you have the task and the privilege (albeit a privilege you never wanted) of deciding what to do with your life, your time, your energies, your body.  I hope you'll find some kind of either routine or activity that will bring you solace and a bit of inspiration.  Are you somewhere with good hiking?  It could be awesome to summit some mountaintops and to walk through the woods.  My advice: things that get you out in sunshine and the outdoors and get you some physical exertion are great ideas.

We all only know our own experiences, and I'll tell you that the thing that brought ME back to life was traveling on my own.  I was in a foreign place, my mind got fed, my imagination got fed, I got a huge influx of vitamin D, I found some admiration for myself - navigating things on my own.  It was a meaningful trip for me, a pilgrimage of sorts - to Israel, where DH was born.  And what I found was that I expected to feel him all around me, but I had never felt further from him than in the city where he was born.  It hit me that I needed to stop searching for him and live within ME, that the closest I could get to him was me, the person he loved and chose.  I suddenly craved a huge change.  And "be careful what you wish for," because I soon got it - had an intense summer fling with a widower that turned into a serious relationship and now we live together (I moved hundreds of miles from NYC to a very very rural village to join him) and are raising our daughter together. 

I wasn't mindful in my choices - I took things as they came.  There are great upsides and downsides to this.  You will do what you will do, and no one can learn other people's lessons, but my advice for what it's worth and I'm not saying it's worth a thing: once you find life bearable again and once you find yourself awakening to life and possibilities and your future, really think about what you want from life.  (I just threw myself in to very huge choices - like I said, there are great upsides to this, and maybe THAT's the advice I should be giving you!  Follow your heart!  Follow your gut!  Go where your heart takes you and do wild crazy things without regard for caution!)  We didn't choose what happened to us, but we can, to a certain extent and maybe it's more limited than I currently believe, we can choose what to do with our lives.  Make good choices, not the choices of the lost.  Stand firm within yourself - you are the one he chose, there is nothing greater than you. 

I hope you'll keep writing - to him, to yourself.  I hope you find peace and direction, and joy again one day.  I'm thinking of you! 

Oh Marian!  I'm so sorry!!!  Thinking of you

MrsT he looks so proud!!!  <3  Congrats!  Awesome!