Lifes unrealistic expectation

[Guest April]

Going through this grief process for myself and helping my children.. I've found that us humans have an unrealistic expectation of how life is "supposed" to be.. Grow up in a picture perfect house.. star to the high school football team.. go to college.. get a great job.. get married.. have children.. live a picture perfect healthy life.. "my Dad was supposed to help me build a tree house.. watch my games.. hug me when I'm sad.. watch me graduate.. walk me down the isle".. Self pitty is a cancer.. get rid of it before it even starts.. There is no cookie cutter script to life.. it's not going to happen the way we picture it.. sickness happens.. death happens.. injury happens.. life happens.. it's going to be beautiful.. ugly.. heartbreaking.. exhilarating.. and it's going to be ok if you allow it.. There will be unexpected roads and road blocks being thrown into our idea of how life is going to go.. if you can't get passed those road block.. you're not going to see other roads being presented.. you're going to be stuck forever.. never moving on.. that isn't how it's supposed to be.. that isn't how your loved one would want it.. we are not fragile beings.. we are not victims.. we are not destined to be sad and miserable for the rest of our lives because a loved one has passed.. we were ment to continue on creating more to our story.. that's what they would want.. something bad happens in everyones life.. no one is immuned to devistating circumstances.. it's important to learn how to get passed the road bumps and blocks.. to move on.. to find a new way to be happy.. being happy isn't promised and not always easy.. you have to want it.. get passed the junk thoughts that are making you not happy.. and be greatful for what you do have today right in front of you.. it's ok to be happy again

[Mizpah]

I've found that us humans have an unrealistic expectation of how life is "supposed" to be..

 

There is no cookie cutter script to life..

 

Yes yes yes yes yes.  We barrage ourselves and each other with ideas of how life should be - some of my friends and I refer to ourselves as being "ruined by literature," i.e., the perfect love story or ideas of happily ever after.  It's movies, too.  It's even paper towel and laundry detergent commercials, for Gd's sake!!!  We've been forced to live lives less ordinary, and accepting that and all that comes with it, oh man, it's a process if ever there was one.  I'm five years out, and thought I was really well-adjusted, but relationship issues have recently shown me that I have major lingering problems, including RAGE, about my life derailing from the road more often taken....  I am really glad you wrote this today.  I really need to let go of the ideas I've adopted since a very young age about how my life will look, what success is, and come to find more joy in this off-script scenario. 

 

[A bit of a tangent, but I've always wondered why our culture has an allergy to the word "victim."  I mean, I know to live as though you're a captive to circumstance is not good, stuck and self-pitying forever, but honestly in objective truth, we were victims of our loved one's deaths.  That's an accurate statement.]

[Captains wife]

Well put - for a long time my sadness was partially related to the fact that my life wasn't working out how I thought it would work out. And I kept comparing my life to the lives of others (or at least how they portrayed them). And I still do that to some extent. BUT  I have been working on letting these things go....and focusing on happiness in the last few years. Its hard to change mindsets but possible when we try.

[Guest April]

Awe.. you are welcome!!

I'm always working on my mind set too.. and yes.. we've been so brainwashed by the commercialization of the perfect family.. the perfect life..  it's so easy to get caught up in!  Nope.. this is my deck of cards.. I can sit and cry about how I seemingly have it harder then someone else.. or I can take control over my obstacles and handle each one as they come.

[SoVerySad]

I understand and appreciate your greater message, however I feel compelled to add that each of us experiencing the loss of our spouses has their own journey to travel. Finding happiness again doesn't follow a single approach that works for everyone. While I realize that everyone in life experiences hardships, I do believe some are more significant than others and would include the loss of a spouse as one of those. I'm not ashamed to say that I do feel victimized by the loss of my husband, as if one of my most precious things has been stolen away from me.

 

We didn't have a perfect married life, but we did have a damn near perfect close marriage. We had a lot of hardships we endured together, starting with finding out 2 months before our wedding he would need open heart surgery right after the wedding. Many challenges followed. We held tight to each other and fought our way through each one, leaning on each other and keeping that positive attitude. We perfected it and people marveled at our ability to keep smiling through it all. That was because we had each other to lean on.

 

Now, I have a whole new set of challenges, worse than any I've faced before, and my partner to lean on to help me cope is gone. That requires time to learn how to find new ways of facing the heartbreak and challenges. I'm always happy to see that people are able to move forward more quickly by thinking positively, etc. Anyone who finds their way through this situation is to be admired. Yet, those who struggle more/longer/less gracefully are to be admired as well. Perhaps even more, because despite their sense of hopelessness and temporary fragility, they haven't given up. They're still trying, finding drive within even when their mind doesn't recognize it.

 

Hugs to all of you finding your way however it works for you... 

[Guest April]

I admire the closeness that you shared with your husband.. my husband and I met in 2000.. both separating from a previous marriage.. we married in July of 2001.. it would be 15 years this July.. We had an unspoken bond... many times he'd do or say something.. I wouldn't say a word.. just looked at him and he'd look over at me and say.. "shut up April" and we'd both laugh.. we knew what each other was thinking.. It's a closeness I don't think I will ever have again.

 

My post is the kind of thinking that helps me get through.. If I find myself down.. I talk my way out of it.. sometimes.. I talk to husband.. we do have 4 children that also help me not to dwell.. I'm just too busy to be down and out.. plus.. I really need to be positive for them.. so they can move on.. I have to set an example for them or they will be depressed adults.. they deserve a shot at a happy childhood.. a happy life.. they've been robbed of their father at a very young age.. these are the things I tell myself to move on.. so they move on.

 

Just like what I said about there is not cookie cutter life.. there is not a cookie cutter way of mourning.. I in no way meant to offend anyone.. and am so sorry if I have.. I can most certainly appreciate the different ways we all mourn.. and I respect that.. it does make me sad that people can not get passed it.. I know it's not what your loved ones would want.. If I was gone tomorrow.. I know it would crush my kids.. but.. I hope they don't get hung up on my death.. because if they can't live on then I truly die.. they are my way of living on. I just thought.. maybe I can pass on some of the tools that I've used to get through.. maybe.. it can help someone else.

 

xoxo

[Trying]

I think it's reasonable to expect that most wids will go through periods of feeling sorry for ourselves, cursing how unfair life is, getting angry thinking everyone else's life is perfect.  I know I have and still sometimes do.  I have seen the devestating effects when people stay stuck in this phase so I have made an effort to not dwell in that thinking.  Of course it pops up occasionally, like last night when I was out with 2 good friends and they were telling stories about their families and I felt filled with jealousy and anger.  I was able to keep my thoughts to myself because I recognize them for what they are but let it out in my car on the way home. 

 

I have no judgement of anyone who takes longer than another to get past this phase, we all have our own unique circumstances.  I had promised Tim and myself that I would not allow his legacy to be that his death destroyed me.  I'm making progress towards that promise but some days it's harder than others.

 

There is a lot of space between bitter and happy, sometimes some where in the middle is enough of a goal.

 

 

[Wheelerswife]

I've come to learn that each experience of loss has similarities, but each is also very different.  Different people come to their losses with different resources and under different circumstances, and those can impact the experience of loss.  Those resources/circumstances can be things such as financial stability/instability, faith and religious beliefs, the support of others that surround a person, whether the death comes after a short or long illness or whether it is sudden and unexpected, the manner of death....and so many more things.  People also have different life views.  The reality, though, is that people's reaction to death really isn't very predictable.

 

If I looked only at my experience of the loss of my first husband, I might only "know" that it is possible to grieve heavily for a number of months, to reach out and form friendships with others on a similar journey, and that my heart would become open to new love in a year's time.  My husband's death was predictable for a very long time and the last 16 months of his life were very fragile for him.  When he died, one of my first thoughts was, "This is the day I have dreaded for 18 years."  I had thought about what this moment would be like for a long time.  Back several years ago, I once posted that I was prepared for my husband to die, but I wasn't prepared for him to be dead.  I was somewhat surprised by the depth of my sadness...I had never felt that before and I didn't know how sad I could really be.  But, I somehow managed to pick myself up and I started living again.  I fell in love and remarried when I was 18 months out.  Life was wonderful...with that underlying sadness because I had known great loss. 

 

Fast forward...less than 3 years after remarrying, my incredible husband died without warning.  I seemed level headed about the whole thing for a couple of days, but in reality, I was in shock.  I started having panic attacks.  I worked to try to keep myself grounded.  I continued with school.  My anxiety continued to escalate.  I had a huge lump in my throat.  Sometimes I seemed like I had my act together, but I was probably stuffing down the overwhelming sadness and anxiety.  It didn't help that I had medical problems and had major surgery 6 weeks after he died and I was diagnosed with a rare and aggressive cancer.  But...I am stubborn and resilient and I march onward.  Or so I think I do.  I get reminded on a fairly regular basis that there isn't a lot over which we truly have control. I can try to be strong and positive, but that often isn't the reality for some people.  The bottom line is that sometimes, it just takes time, and it isn't necessarily possible to predict that time table.  I think, too, that we have to acknowledge loss, and nothing, including a positive attitude, can assure that we actually process the loss we experience.  And if we don't process our loss, it pretty much comes to bite us in the backside.  I'm now 2 years and 4 months out since the loss of my second husband and I still feel the sting and I still cope with anxiety, but I am more ready to move forward than I was.  It is sometimes hard for me to believe that at this point after the loss of my first husband, I had been remarried for 10 months already.  Each situation is different.

 

So...just be careful that resiliency and a positive outlook and acknowledging the unfairness of life doesn't stop you from processing the real emotional impact of the death of your husband and your children's father.

 

Hugs,

 

Maureen

[SoVerySad]

April,

 

Please know that you didn't offend me, so there is no need to worry about that. Yes, I was really blessed to share such a connection with such an amazing man. It sounds like you were really blessed as well. I also talk to my husband all the time.

 

Hugs...

[Portside]

So...just be careful that resiliency and a positive outlook and acknowledging the unfairness of life doesn't stop you from processing the real emotional impact of the death of your husband and your children's father.

 

You had me up until this statement. I would submit that a positive outlook very rarely interferes with a normal processing of grief – even that of a person that might be derisively called ‘incurably optimistic’. It’s been my experience that those that hold positive thoughts throughout all of their trials, no matter how ugly they may be, seldom are unaware of what has truly transpired. They simply face the hard truths of their experience squarely and decide to try to concentrate on all for which they have to be thankful.

 

On the other hand, a negative and ‘woe is me’ outlook, while understandable for a time, will, invariably, drag one down into a deeper hell than that which has already been visited upon the poor soul who experiences it. Mental health professionals have rough but well thought out guidelines upon which to compare the parameters (length is one measure for instance) of grief to see if falls into the area where intervention is necessary to return the griever to health.

 

While it is true that each of our experiences while being widowed is unique - that does not mean that each of our reactions to the death of our spouse can be considered healthy or even ‘normal’. I believe that idea to be a fallacy and potentially very harmful.

 

I find it a bit sad that April’s post here where she promotes happiness and the idea that keeping your chin up for your own well-being attracts comparatively few supporters. A few others even caution against her (wonderful) outlook. Sadder still are the numerous other posts over the years where one states “It’s not fair!” or “It wasn’t supposed to be this way!” or even worse, one is jealous of another couple or individual. The response to those group of posts seem to attract a chorus of widespread agreement and concurrence. What are we – seven years old? Not fair? Nothing in life is fair. Why would one think it would be? I’d be ashamed to admit such feelings if I had them.

 

Reinforcing misery does just that – reinforces it. It does nothing to lessen the very real anguish of the person suffering. While it is comforting to know someone else felt similarly at one time, to pile on and say ‘Yeah, me too.” simply prolongs it and does not contribute at all to the eventual return to normalcy. 

 

Best wishes - Mike

 

[Wheelerswife]

I find it a bit sad that April’s post here where she promotes happiness and the idea that keeping your chin up for your own well-being attracts comparatively few supporters. A few others even caution against her (wonderful) outlook. Sadder still are the numerous other posts over the years where one states “It’s not fair!” or “It wasn’t supposed to be this way!” or even worse, one is jealous of another couple or individual. The response to those group of posts seem to attract a chorus of widespread agreement and concurrence. What are we – seven years old? Not fair? Nothing in life is fair. Why would one think it would be? I’d be ashamed to admit such feelings if I had them.

 

Reinforcing misery does just that – reinforces it. It does nothing to lessen the very real anguish of the person suffering. While it is comforting to know someone else felt similarly at one time, to pile on and say ‘Yeah, me too.” simply prolongs it and does not contribute at all to the eventual return to normalcy. 

 

Hi, Mike,

 

Thanks for your perspective.  I think you and I have both been around long enough to see the gamut of young widow/widower experiences.  Sometimes, yes, it is good to know that someone else is having an experience similar to one's own; just knowing that one's situation is not so unique confirms some degree of normalcy, especially for people in the earlier days of grieving.  That extends not only to "negative" experiences, but to "positive" experiences, such as feeling resilient in spite of the unfortunate circumstances in one's life. 

 

I never did figure out just why I was graced with a shorter grief track after my first husband died.  Believe me, there were many people, widowed and non-widowed, that questioned whether I had just glossed over all of the emotion that loss of a spouse brings.  Personally, I don't think I did, although a fellow widower (not affiliated with this site) recently questioned me as to whether I was still "stuck" in the loss of my first husband. (Umm..I don't believe so.)

 

I do know others who were able to pull their chins up, find some version of a silver lining, and make the best of the circumstances of their lives.  I keep in touch with a fair number of folks who are doing very well.  I also know of others who approached widowhood in the same manner as I did early out who eventually realized they had to face their grief.  Sometimes, this was after situations in which they would say they made fairly "expensive" decisions.  I've never been one to hold to the "don't make big decisions for a year" advice, but I suppose that advice was doled out for a reason.  Maybe it should be: "Consider whether making big decisions in the first year is truly best for you as a young widow.  Some others wish they had thought about it more carefully."

 

So...my last line was really just meant to be a bit of caution only.  We are all different and we can all own our own experiences.  If someone who is finding themselves to be struggling finds optimism from someone's story of resilience and positivity, I think that is wonderful.  Do we need to hear more of that?  Perhaps we do, lest those reading here may hear a lopsided version of the experience of young widowhood. 

 

Maureen

[Guest April]

Although I can not wrap my head around mental illness.. depression.. drug addiction etc.. I do recognize and respect that it so very real for so many people.. including some of my own loved ones.. I don't understand why people chose to be sad.. chose to be addicts etc.. it is a darkness I don't understand and pray to God I am never shown first hand.  I feel so bad for people that can't bring themselves out of sadness.. out of grief.. I've been in grievance.. it's exhausting.. it depletes you're very essence.. I just can not stay there.. we weren't meant to. I know I am not immune to that kind of deep sadness.. I don't think anyone is.. I know one day my circumstances may change.. I hope if I ever do find myself within those dark shadows with no will to go on that I take the proper steps to get myself help.. life is just too short to waist being sad for a long length of time or to dwelling on something we have no control over.. that we can't change... that we can't bring back..  no amount of crying, begging or praying can bring someone back. 

 

I will say.. I don't think I could ever handle the death of one of my children.. I think that would be my utmost breaking point... but I know it can be a reality.. it is for so many people..  it happens.. my oldest is graduating high school this year.. he wants to go right into the military.. the very calling that my husband succumbed to.. I have to support my son even though it's my biggest nightmare.. even though it killed my husband and so many others.. this is his journey and it's my job to support him and help him reach his goals.. no matter my fears.. life is full of uncertainties.. yes he could die in combat.. he could come home hurt, physically and mentally damaged..  he could also get hit by a car on the way to school.. death is inevitable.. someone has to die and someone has to grieve for that life lost.. one day it will be our turn to be on the opposite end of grieving.. I pray to God I give my children the right tools to get passed my death so they can move on, live and be happy.. I would hate for my death to take someone elses life..  we have to find the strength to move on.. we do what we have to do to survive or we die.. maybe not our physical bodies.. but we die inside.. and that's no way to live.

 

I lost my Dad when I was only 24.. At a very young age.. still learning a lot about life.. I had to decide weather to keep him on life support or let him go.. a decision I still wonder if it was the right one or not.. but I own it.. because I know my brother and sisters can't..  I miss him.. I miss the sound of his guitar.. of his laugh..  I am so lucky to have been able to sit across the table from him and watch and listen to him play.. I never got tired of it.. I loved it.. so many lose their fathers sooner then I did or they were abused by theirs or never even knew who their father was.

 

I lost my husband to suicide 4 days after I turned 40.. but I am lucky to have experience love and marriage and the children, happiness and wonderful memories it brought to me.. it taught me so many lessons.. of tolerance.. forgiveness.. teamwork and loyalty.. I have been blessed with his children.. a part of him I will always have.. I have been given the honor to raise his legacy.. I hope I make him proud.

 

I held my youngest sister as she was grieving for the loss of her infant.. her heart ache ripped through all of us.. a couple years later we rejoiced with her when she brought 2 more beautiful lives into this world.

 

I watched in horror as two of my sisters and my only brother battle a heroin addiction.. I've cried for them.. I've cried for my Mother who's babies fell to this self destructive monster.. but.. I have been blessed to have siblings at all and to have 2 of them in addiction remission.. to be given a second chance to have them in my life.. I know that can change in an instant and I can lose them again.. maybe for good.. but for now.. I have them and am making memories with them.

 

I watched my grandfather kneel in heart ache before my grandmothers casket.. an image I will never forget.. an endless love I am blessed to have witnessed and be a product of.

 

I am watching my other grandfather wither away to alzheimers.. a self made millionaire born during the great depression.. worked his way up from nothing and now he needs help taking a shower.. I miss the days I could listen to him go on about his wonderful life.. a life he loved and lived to the absolute fullest every God given moment of it.. I am honored to have known him and to have learned from him.. and to still be able to hug and kiss him as he slowly forgets who I am.

 

My toughest battle so far is watching my children hurt for the loss their father.. to see them hurting so bad and not be able to fix it.. but I know they will be ok.. every day is a little better then the next.. we are getting there.. learning to live and rebuild.

 

I have an infinite number of the most truly amazing events that happened in my life.. I have loved and I have lost and I know I have much more of both to come.. and I can only hope and pray that I can continue to handle each and every one..  I do not ever dare to compare my losses to someone elses.. and every time I hear of someone elses loss I think.. "I just can't imagine".. because every life is precious.. and you know what.. that's including our own.. cherish it.. we don't get another.. focus on the wonderful.

 

xoxo

[LTSLforever]

We are all different and we experience our grief in different ways.  Regardless of what anyone on here thinks, I do NOT choose to be sad. Am I sad, am I depressed?  YES 

Depression is an illness that I have and, believe me, no one would choose this illness.

 

I think we all need to be a little more understanding of other people's pain.  We don't all have the same support systems and that makes a difference in how we handle our pain.  I also feel pain for Steve's parents; they have lost both of their children.

 

SoVerySad and WheelersWife - thank you for your posts

April - I am happy that you are able to focus on the wonderful. 

 

 

 

[SoVerySad]

Portside,

 

I really wish you'd have just stated your opinion without adding this statement:

 

"I’d be ashamed to admit such feelings if I had them."

 

I find it to be inappropriate in this forum where we try to provide a place for people to share what they are feeling. No one should be shaming another for doing that here, IMO. Who are you to say what is right for another to feel? And if people add that they feel the same as another, that is their right as well.

 

I think if your positive approach to looking at the situations you've faced in your life has worked for you, it is wonderful. You've found what works for you and that has clearly served you well. It is good for you to post your experience as often as you would like to as someone else might benefit from it. But telling another member they should be ashamed of sharing their feelings is reckless when you have no clue what unique experiences the person has had in their lives and is currently going through. There is no one size fits all approach to anything in life. I suspect we approach life very differently. I don't think you are wrong in your approach. You don't have to be wrong, for me to believe my approach is right for me. Each person needs to find what works best for them.

 

April, depression is not a choice. People who are depressed are not just choosing to "be sad". It is a real medical condition, just as other conditions such as diabetes, heart disease, etc. are. Our society's lack of understanding of this places an extra burden on those suffering. I can see that it is hard for someone who hasn't experienced it to understand it.

 

 

 

[Jen]

We are all different and we experience our grief in different ways.  Regardless of what anyone on here thinks, I do NOT choose to be sad. Am I sad, am I depressed?  YES 

Depression is an illness that I have and, believe me, no one would choose this illness.

 

 

April, depression is not a choice. People who are depressed are not just choosing to "be sad". It is a real medical condition, just as other conditions such as diabetes, heart disease, etc. are. Our society's lack of understanding of this places an extra burden on those suffering. I can see that it is hard for someone who hasn't experienced it to understand it.

 

 

Telling a person with depression to stop being depressed is like telling a person with diabetes to "just make more insulin." Like any chronic health condition, depression has to be actively managed every single day. It can be exhausting and debilitating. Grief exacerbates it, makes it that much harder to cope with. I would no more wish this condition on anyone than I would wish for them to develop diabetes or COPD or breast cancer. It's an endless fight, and compassion and gentleness are much appreciated.

 

[Trying]

Portside, I have to agree with SVS. 

 

Taking positive actions and choosing to focus on today and my future has been helpful for me but I do recognize that it's not always possible for everyone. Depression, physical illness, lack of support, financial insecurity, PTSD and a host of other reasons can complicate the grief process and there is no shame in that. 

 

I think it's important to share positive stories to lend hope to those earlier in their grief process but for someone who is suffering with depression these stories can be triggering. For those who feel hopeless, depressed or just plain stuck I encourage you to seek help. Don't give up if your first few attempts to find help are unsuccessful, keeping trying a different therapist, a different medication, alternative options. There is no shame in needing help or extra time to manage your grief and managing your grief and finding contentment in your life is not disrespectful to the spouse you lost.

 

 

[hachi]

 

About feelings and being ashamed of them if you have them....

 

 

 

I have always believed that you can't control your feelings, you can only control what you do about them. So don't be ashamed of them, just face them and see what you are supposed to learn.

 

I found this article interesting, though pretty long and hard to get through.

 

http://pathwork.org/lectures/the-self-regulating-nature-of-involuntary-processes/

 

 

About depression and choosing to be sad. I am not sure if this is an unfortunate choice of words. April said that she can't understand it and that is pretty clear in this statement:

 

" I hope if I ever do find myself within those dark shadows with no will to go on that I take the proper steps to get myself help.. "

 

In my experience, when you are in this place, you can't get out of bed, let alone seek help... 

[LTSLforever]

So Very Sad, Jen, Trying, Hachi

 

Your comments made me cry - in a good way.  You all understand.  After reading some of the earlier posts, I started to believe this forum was a very unsafe place for me.  I have depression, anxiety, PTSD (from watching Steve die) and complicated grief.  There are lots of issues surrounding Steve's illness and death that have completely destroyed me.  There are days that just getting out of bed or making a phone call is difficult for me. There are days when filling my feline kids water bowls seems like too hefty a task.  Thankfully, I have days when the pain is not as severe and I am able to function fairly well.  But when it hits, it hits so hard I just can't take the pain.  As Steve was getting sicker, my mom was also very sick. Shortly after Steve died, my mom was diagnosed with leukemia.  Unfortunately, I can't see the wonderful in anything right now because there is no wonderful in my mind.

[Guest April]

"Although I can not wrap my head around mental illness.. depression.. drug addiction etc.. I do recognize and respect that it so very real for so many people.. including some of my own loved ones.. I don't understand why people chose to be sad.. chose to be addicts etc.. it is a darkness I don't understand and pray to God I am never shown first hand.  I feel so bad for people that can't bring themselves out of sadness."

 

My first paragraph.. I'm in no way belittling anyone or their feelings.. I'm stating.. I don't understand.. and wish to never experience it.

 

What I don't understand is the sensitivity and defensiveness.. There are lots of diseases that are misunderstood.. for instance Type I and type II diabetes (my sister, niece and great nephew have type I).. they do not get offended when people don't understand that it's not their eating habits that gave them the disease.. that they were born with it.. that it's an autoimmune disease..  it simply gets explained.. some people are open to listen and eventually understand.. some people still don't get it and say treat it with better diet and exercise. .. I am open to listen.. what brought you to such a darkened place.. I've heard the place being described.. but never your road to it.. does it start with sadness and just steam roll to a state of non-functioning? Or is it something you are predisposed to or born with?

 

I know all these mental conditions are real.. my husband suffered from war related PTSD (he would never in a million years admit it.. because to him that would be admitting weakness).. He would have night terrors.. flinch in his sleep because he was dreaming he was being shot at.. he felt the lives he took haunted him.. he felt the lives he couldn't save haunted him (he was a combat medic).. He had flashbacks and warned me to never wake him up when they happen because I was not a part of that scenario and he is afraid of what he would do.. he stashed knives EVERYWHERE!!  I had to call before coming home so I didn't get greeted at the door with a 12 inch machete.. I made sure that I entered the house before the kids because I didn't know what they could be walking into.. he struggled.. tried to mask his mental pain and anguish with pain killers..  refused to get help real help.. it eventually consumed him.

 

Two of my sisters and my brother battle addiction.. my grandmother for the life of her can not understand why they just don't stop.. why they chose to destroy their lives and the lives around them.. she will never understand it.. I have a hard time understanding it.. but I do.. I see it.. I see their daily struggles..  I get it.. I've sat and listened to my 6 foot 3 brother cry.. saying the only way he's beating this thing is through death.. he breaks my heart... I just want to shake him and scream.. "JUST STOP TAKING DRUGS!!!".. I know it's not that simple.

 

I used the word "chose" because like diabetes or any other disease (as you compare it to).. there is help, there's medication, there are ways to treat it..  I see that this is a very sensitive subject.. I obviously can not compare depression to my grievance.. but it's the closest thing I've been through that I can compare to a level of sadness that is described in depression.. and I have chosen to not stay there.. I could have very easily stayed in my curled up position on my couch and allow it to consume me.. I imagine that is how depression starts.. I could be dead wrong... and if I am..  I'm sorry.. I'm trying to understand..

 

So many people don't understand learning disabilities.. my oldest son has ADHD.. one time one of his football coaches asked me if he had a learning disability because he just wasn't grasping onto the plays.. but the way he said it was so derogatory and smerky.. did I snap at him.. was I offended.. no.. a little taken back but not offended.. I explained that he has ADHD.. some people get it.. some people don't understand it.. "he's just bad.. you don't discipline him.. you must not make him study.. don't you work with him?! don't you dare drug him up".. it is a chemical imbalance in his brain.. it can be treated with diet and routine.. or medication.. but there are options to help.. and we chose.. we chose to treat it.. or we chose not to treat it and live with it.

 

I'm sorry if I have offended anyone.. I have a feeling nothing I can say here will be right.. I hope you get better and can live a happy life.

[Wheelerswife]

First, I want to say that there has been expression of some opposing thoughts and opinions on this thread and I am happy to see that people are expressing their differences with civility.

 

As much as I am a resilient person, I also struggle with what is essentially PTSD myself.  Did I ever expect to find myself in this position?  Absolutely not.  Who would have thought that I would be paralyzed and shaking, with my heart racing and trying to beat itself outside my chest?  Certainly not me.  But I sought immediate help for my panic attacks and I went to a grief counselor and I tried several medications unsuccessfully, as the side effects such as blurred vision and tachycardia were intolerable.  I now live with a service dog at my side 24 hours a day and that intervention has helped me tremendously.  I now can catch my triggers much more quickly and manage my anxiety more easily, although I often need time to process what have experienced.  My biggest triggers are related to not having control over what happens to me.  No surprise, eh?

 

It is my opinion that it is important for all of us to have a safe place to express our experiences.  Most of you don't know me from my earliest days of loss over 6 1/2 years ago, but for a short period, I also had a sense that if people just had a positive outlook, they could overcome their grief.  Some people gently and not-so-gently educated me to a different level of understanding.  I still believe that some of us grieved before our spouses died, especially those who faced a long-term physical or mental illness with our late spouses.  For some of us, there was an element of relief when our spouses died, and expressing that reality is not always appreciated by some others who might not be able to imagine that the death of a spouse had any "positive" elements. 

 

Just as anyone can join our club at any time, any of us can also be hit by some life experience and we can find ourselves reacting to that experience in ways we never would have expected.  People react very differently to things such as losing a house in a fire, receiving serious injuries, or like me, losing a second spouse.  I think the important lesson here is that we have to understand that people aren't choosing their reaction to their losses.  I didn't choose to be anxious.  Others don't choose depression.  Some may be able to tap into healthy resources better than others early on.  For some, recovering from loss seems to be easier, others, quite difficult.  I think this board has a mix of people and their experiences.  Perhaps we need more people to post about their day-to-day successes and struggles so we all can know the reality out there.  We can't be afraid to show all sides of this journey because feeling too positive will make some people feel worse, or because feeling less positive will bring judgment.

 

Maureen

[Jess]

I've been reading this thread and have considered saying something several times but was concerned anything I would say would upset someone so let me begin by saying that is not my intention and I have much genuine love and respect for all.

 

All perspectives, experiences, and journeys should be welcome here. I will freely admit that forcing myself towards positive thinking bit by bit as I processed my loss was essential to my healing. And by that sentence, I mean ME. The struggle to do this has been immense. This is my story, not a roadmap to follow or a judgement of those with a different story.

 

When I watched Joe have the first and only seizure of his life, hearing him scream, trying to help him as he thrashed in pain and landed punch after punch to my body, I thought that would be the most difficult thing I had ever done. When the doctor at the hospital told me he was dead, I thought that living that experience was the most difficult thing I had done. Those things affected me deeply and have left me with panic, uncertainty, fear, and profound sadness, but they were not the most difficult thing I have ever done. They were the most difficult things I have ever experienced. Instead, I would say finding a reason to keep going while existing in the deepest pits of despair is by far the most difficult thing I have done.

 

At first, there was no reason whatsoever to want to go on. I didn't have children to take care of to stop me going off the deep end. Even today, I cannot tell you with absolute certainty why in those early days I didn't just end it all. I wanted it to end more than anything, even more than having him back, which in hindsight while understandable feels like a twisted thought. I thought a lot about what would happen if the roles were reversed and he was the one left behind. He had issues with depression and stress so I felt like there was a good chance he would end it for himself (he had said as much a few times), and that thought filled me with so much sadness I knew I couldn't do that to him. So, the way I saw it, I had two choices- find a reason to want to live again or allow myself to wither away over the years and die. I knew he would want me to do the first option, so that is what I set out to do.

 

I started counseling at 11 days out. I kept attending counseling for a year. At first I went every week, then every two weeks, then every month. It helped me immensely. I joined this community. I remember when I first found all of you feeling like I had found my tribe, even though I had trouble even acknowledging I was a widow. I read and read and read. The dark places my mind went were the same places other people's minds went. Thank God. And I read a lot from the people that picked up the pieces of their broken lives and built a positive future. It WAS possible, and just knowing that gave me a small spark that somehow I could figure out a way to not always feel so overwhelmed with despair.

 

At my counselor's suggestion, I wrote down one positive thing that had happened every single day, much like the 3 Good Things thread we have in General Discussion. At first, the good thing of the day was pretty lame. It would be something like "My dog chased her tail and that was cute." It felt so futile, but I kept doing it despite some days just the idea of doing the exercise was daunting. As time went by, it was easier to think of something good that had happened. My mindset slowly but surely was shifting. I also made a conscious decision to say and write the sentence "I will get through this somehow." Sometimes it would be said to myself in the fetal position with words punctuated by sobs, but I still did it.

 

I feel like something it is hard for people to understand is that although I did my best to adopt a positive mindset, it did not mean that I did not struggle. It was three months before I could even try to sleep in the bed we shared. I worked partial days from home for the first 6 weeks that I returned to work. I left the house so seldom, my puppy had a Pavlovian response to me putting pants on because that meant I was leaving and when I left the house, it meant she was getting a treat. I didn't have the energy to do laundry so it piled up and I just would order new underwear from Amazon. I probably had 75 pairs of underwear at one point. People stopped calling and stopped checking on me. Offers to help evaporated. I was alone.

 

It was during this time I realized that I was indeed dead already. I had died just after midnight on July 26th, 2014 when my husband was pronounced dead. Who I was was gone and I had been trying to live as though I was still her and that all I had to do was face my grief, work through it, and find her again. I realized that she would never be back, just like Joe would never be back. So in reality, I had been offered a blank slate. How did I want to fill it? If I can't be the me I have always known, then who should I be? I decided I wanted to be kind, less prone to anger, more giving of myself, patient, and adventurous. I wanted to take chances and follow my heart wherever it lead me. I pictured some day being able to see Joe again and how he would want stories of all the adventures I had, and I couldn't have these adventures from my sad spot on the couch. This revelation propelled me forward.

 

I know that some people view grief as a monster trying to claw them down into the pits of despair. I have always viewed it as a companion. At times, as we walk together, it grabs me by the arm and has me sit with it a while, sometimes days or weeks. Sometimes it slows my pace. Sometimes, I appear to be walking normally among those that do not have this sort of loss to process and they are not even aware of my companion. The thing is, no amount of positive thinking will ever dispatch that companion from where it came. Even when others don't see it, I know it is always still there.

 

I have shared all of that to say for me, fighting tooth and nail to find a positive outlook was the right path. It may not be the right path for others, but it also should not be construed as not struggling as much or worse yet, avoiding grief in the first place. Sharing these stories and outlooks should also not be viewed as an attack or an insult to people that walk a different path. As humans in general, we understand our own experiences and view the world through a specific lens. It is hard to really understand why someone is on one path or another when it doesn't match the one we have for ourselves. Not understanding it is fine, but it is also important not to view our own paths as the cookie cutter solution. If things were really so simple, we'd have no need for forums such as this in the first place.

[Portside]

Portside,

 

I really wish you'd have just stated your opinion without adding this statement:

 

"I’d be ashamed to admit such feelings if I had them."

 

I find it to be inappropriate in this forum where we try to provide a place for people to share what they are feeling. No one should be shaming another for doing that here, IMO. Who are you to say what is right for another to feel? And if people add that they feel the same as another, that is their right as well.

 

 

SVS, I am sorry you have misunderstood me. I meant my 'ashamed' comment to be limited to those acts of folks who exclaim "It's not fair" and the like. I stand by it – I feel it is childish to put forth such statements. My comment was not directed to anyone suffering from any degree of mental stress. Further, you’re right – each of us are free to say whatever we wish within the guidelines of the board. However, that doesn’t mean a reader must agree with that statement.

 

And thank you to the others attempting to help me understand the trials of depression, etc. Seriously, I mean it. But it is truly unnecessary - as you may remember, my late wife died as a result of her depression of 18 years. I, like many of you, have seen firsthand what it can do and what it’s like to live with. I was lucky in that I could fall back on my training after my combat tours (Navy Corpsman attached to elements of the 1st Marine Division) provided by the Bureau of Navy Psychology Training Programs at Bethesda Naval Hospital. After that, I was stationed at Yokusuka (Japan) Naval Hospital providing psychiatric services to Navy personnel and their dependents. Much of my work consisted of working with patients with what is now called PTSD. I saw enough of it in the field and in psychiatric wards in the Navy to last me forever.  I know both what it is, and also, what it is not. I completed my service and training at Balboa Naval Hospital (San Diego) providing the same type of care.  I don’t claim to know it all. I am always open to learn something new or be pointed in a different direction by anyone. Please reach out to me at any time to help me along. I welcome your input.

 

Ladies, look – I know I come across as a bit of a hard ass sometimes – especially when we discuss feelings or mental issues here. I may in fact be. But it troubles me greatly when any one does what I consider to be whining (here or IRL) and then receive what I term the ‘tea and cookies’ type of treatment from the untrained. My professional experience, although dated, has led me to believe it simply doesn’t help the one suffering. I hope you’ll excuse me for pushing back. Poor therapies offered by unskilled, although very well meaning, folks can be harmful.

 

I’m afraid we will have to just disagree on many of these items. 

 

I am simply sharing what I know in hopes that it may be of use to someone else here. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

April, I understand what your husband experienced and, as a fellow medic/corpsman, I hold his spirit close to my heart. He was a healer in the field and provided tender care to those that needed it the most and gave his life in service to others. No matter the branch of service, we all lived and died by the motto “Leave no man behind.” May his memory be Eternal.

 

Best wishes - Mike

 

[SoVerySad]

Mike, I didn't misunderstand you in the way you think I did. I find nothing wrong in pointing out that life is unfair. Trust me, I learned very early on that life isn't fair. Still, there is nothing wrong with a person sharing their pain that comes from the unfairness that we know exists in the world. The term whining has a really judgmental negative aspect to it. If you are in the position of being able to compartmentalize anything that happens to you as just the realistic result of an unfair world, that is good for you. I genuinely mean that. I'm not a black and white person. I find degrees of "unfairness" if you will.

 

Hard ass approaches can benefit a person, but so can tea and sympathy (and even virtual hugs ;p ), even if it might not benefit you personally. We all respond differently. There is no one on this board, even some members with whom I have established relationships and real friendships outside this community, whom I feel I know enough about their life experiences and all they are going through to see myself taking a hard ass approach to someone else here.

 

The training you may have received might work for some and not others. I don't believe much of the mental health community would support the notion that one approach to treatment will best benefit everyone. You may want to view the members here who haven't been through professional mental health training as being less qualified to respond to posts than you with your training, but there is value in experience as well as training. It is why support groups for so many situations exist and why we look for both education and experience in filling job positions. We may not have degrees in mental health, but we've earned honorary degrees in understanding having the challenges of being widowed at a young age thrust upon you.

 

I recently started counseling and I can tell you that the counselor I was assigned to would differ greatly from your approach, just as my other healthcare providers differ from each other and sometimes hold opposing opinions on what treatment plan would be best. I don't see our roles here as professional counselors in any way. I feel we're here to provide a safe place for someone to share their honest feelings, to offer support and understanding if we feel moved to do so. Even if your assessment about one person's situation seems fitting, there are likely many others reading posts here none of us know anything about, because they don't feel comfortable posting. Some may likely never do so if they feel this is an unsafe place to do so. That saddens me when I know the important role this forum and the ywbb played in my recovery thus far. I have had plenty of perhaps well-meaning family and friends in my real life who act horrified if I share what's on my mind at times. Having this safe space to do so has meant a lot to me.

 

Even my counselor has told me she cannot fully grasp the anguish I've been through as she has never been widowed herself, but she will do her very best to help me sort out my feelings and reorganize my thoughts to find the best path forward I can find.

 

I'm not saying you shouldn't share with others what has worked for you or suggestions that may be helpful. I really just only took issue in classifying people as "7 year old whiners" for stating their struggling with the unfairness of life. While unfairness exists, it doesn't mean it doesn't suck or that there be an expectation that everyone just needs to find it acceptable and get over it. For some that may take longer than for others, and years later the sense of unfairness may revisit with events and triggers for some people.

 

I do appreciate the discussion of differing thoughts. I recently realized that actual real discussion with others on greater than superficial issues is lacking in my life since my husband's death.

 

Take care...

 

 

[Guest April]

My husband went in Navy.. and was a combat medic for the marines.. He was stationed in Okinawa Japan.. He served in the first gulf war..

 

My oldest son completed 4 years of Navy ROTC for his high school (they just did the change of commands last week.. he finished an officer.. 3rd rank down).. he was also Captain of the football team and captain of the wrestling team.. My husband passed away the end of his Junior year.. my son took it really hard.. all my kids did.. but his grief was different.. he was much older then the my other 3 (at the time my younger ones were 11, 9 and 2 yrs old)..  my son fought with him before.. which created a snow ball events that was forcing my husband to seek help.. which he took his own life the day before counseling was going to start.. so he blamed himself.. It was/is just too much for a kid to carry.. but after all he has witnessed he still wants to join the military.. I had to call emergency services for him because I didn't know how to help him and he was breaking down.. The grief counselor said his death has reaffirmed my sons decision to join.. 

 

he still hasn't decided what branch.. he didn't score all that great on his ASVAB test.. Marines want him as a mechanic or infantry.. I originally wanted him to go Navy (nice and safe on a boat for 4 years.. as long as he doesn't go into special forces).. but they want him as a bomb detonation specialist.. He plans on speaking with an Army recruiter.. I know most kids already have this figured out.. but he has to wait for a knee injury from wrestling to heal 100%.. which has given him time to think about what branch he wants to enter.. he was dead set on Marines.. but now he's second guessing..

 

I went to the recruiters with him.. this was something my husband was supposed to do with him.. I didn't know what I was doing.. I heard infantry and I just started crying lol .. my ears just went numb.. after the recruiter tried to tell me that infantry wasn't what I thought it was.. and it would be the best thing for him to go in for my sons long term goals.. I tried so hard not to lose it.. I knew every word out of his mouth was complete bull shit.. my husband warned they will tell you anything to get him to sign.. then once you sign you are theirs and they can ship you wherever they want.. I think I kept my composure pretty well.. but of course my son said I embarrassed him.. I cried.. but I wasn't a basket case.. I think it's pretty normal for a mother to get upset when their baby is getting ready to sign a blank check for an amount of up to and including his very life .. and especially right after my husbands battle with depression/PTSD ended is such a horrific way.

 

My heart will always bleed for our soldiers.

 

Jess.. I think you are very brave to take those steps to well being.. they are hard steps.. impossible for some.. like my husband.. who would rather face death then face a councilor.. maybe that's part of my reason for not understanding.. it was right there.. he was going to see a councilor the next day.. why was it so hard for him to take that step?  Why were we not worth it?  I don't know if I will ever understand.

 

I respond to the "hard ass" approach.. maybe it was because I was married to a soldier.. or maybe that's just because it's who I am.. and it's how I'm raising my kids.  Am I too insensitive.. maybe for some.. I will empathize to a degree.. our grief counselor said.. if you want me to sit here and ask you.. "so.. how does that make you feel".. "then.. I'm not your guy".. 'I'm going to push you.. I'm going to ask you questions that you are not going to like".. and he most certainly did.. but it opened my eyes.. to negative thinking.. he called it "junk thoughts".. and how to counter act those junk thoughts.. he asked me how I could put up with my husbands behavior for so long (15 years).. I thought I was doing my "duty".. he said.. "please teach your daughters to have more respect for themselves then you have for yours".. that was a hard one to take.. it hurt.. but.. it was true... I thought I was being strong for them.. but I was in survival mode.. putting up with things no one in their right mind would.. and in doing that gave my children the wrong message.. At our very last session (about 9 months ago).. he said.. I felt bad for you when you first came in.. but.. I don't anymore.. you can and will be ok..  you have the tools to help yourself and your children.. please call me if you ever feel like you can't handle it.

 

xoxo

[Tatianakm]

Thank you, SoVerySad, for YOU and being a voice for some of us who just don't have enough energy to spend on this healthy debate of how one should grieve. After reading this thread, I thought, just like another member, that perhaps this forum was not what I needed after all. It sadden me, because I grew to like some of the authors.

 

Portside, it was me who posted that " life is not fair- jealous of other couples- ashamed to admit" post some time earlier.  I did point out that it was not my proud moment. I own it, no matter how silly or childish this might sound. I don't battle depression, not that I have spoken to someone in the professional field, as I have very little faith in the medical community and it's ability to make any significant impact. I am a true believer of " we are in charge of our own destiny and can influence outcomes". Let me correct, I was the believer; that all has been shattered. I do not find fair that my husband dropped dead, literally, 3 weeks after our daughter joined this world. I think it was a reasonable expectation for me to raise this long awaited kid together with her father. I am a straight laced person and on the outside my life looks OK; during the day I am just a regular can-move-mountains-feel-so-in-control overachiever corporate America demands. But then, when my happy and nothing suspecting baby is soundly sleeping in her bed, I allow myself some comfort in reading this board and exposing my most honest feelings, in crying myself to sleep, in talking to him and asking why did he have to leave now...I do not need anyone to tell me to suck it up; I do this well enough on my own.  Call it whining, but I am so thankful for some supportive members of this forum who can find empathy and offer that virtual hug without judgement. Who else will understand me and sympathize, if not the people who have been through similar situations. After all, the only person with whom I shared all my highs and lows is gone...