arneal

Glad things are going well, tybec, and hope you were able to bring some cheer to your NG despite the nonsense. Yeah, family is a trip! My NG has siblings with issues as well; his mom did a good job of separating her kids into factions it seems, based on their fathers. The brothers who are younger than NG have a different dad and it's like they could do no wrong. I think it was because of the stories he's told me over the past year about their dynamic that made me try to make his birthday a big deal because no one did that for him when he was younger. What a thing to watch your brothers get parties and no one does that for you or your sister? Just ew.

Hope everyone is having or has had a good 4th of July weekend if in a place that celebrates it. I have had an interesting one. I was at NGs Sunday evening; I had planned if the situation to stay arose by enlisting my house sitters to let my dogs out later and on Monday morning. When I got there, he had saved me a parking space and when I drove to it, there were some people sort of in the way. I couldn't hear well but it sounded like he asked them if they would give way as his girlfriend was coming to park. Might have just been my wishful thinking though We had just finished eating dinner and were watching television when I heard my mobile phone. I answered and it was the sitter, telling me that one of my dogs had taken off. She is horribly skittish and the fireworks have been going since Memorial weekend. It seems someone probably set off an M80 and she broke through my gate. I was about 40 miles away. I throw on my shoes, kiss NG, and take off for home. My friends and I drove the neighborhood until 2 am and could not find her. In the morning, I went out again and she came back, a bit worse for wear from breaking through the fence and not sleeping all night, but otherwise fine, thank God. NG had off Monday and the 4th itself and wanted to come over as he was scheduled to work out of town for the rest of the week. I cooked and we did our own indoor BBQ last night, during which time he tells me that he doesn't have to go out of town after all, which was fine with me because when he goes, he always comes home wiped out from the drive and it limits our weekend time because I don't want to be there making him entertain me when he's tired or asking him to drive to my house after he's been on the road all week. He stayed and we hung out for most of today. I mentioned that it would be great to do a beach getaway and he agreed; we are planning it for next weekend. Now here's the kicker: when we decide on the general location, he tells me that he has a pen pal in that area -- a woman who he had met online when he lived up north. She had asked him when he was moving down where she lived, he said he wasn't, but they remained friends. She has since married and so forth but since when he was online dating his profile said he was looking for friends or long-term relationship (just like mine), so there it is -- and that we could maybe meet her and her husband for dinner while we are there. The suggestion actually made me smile because it said to me that he was comfortable enough to want me to meet this friend who might have at one point been more than a friend and her husband. That he wasn't worried that I'd freak out about meeting her. I've been thinking about suggesting he meet my son, which of course is different than this, but to be honest I don't have many friends here that I'd bother to introduce him to purposely. I mean, if we happened to be out somewhere and they were there, of course I'd make the intro, but to make plans? Not so much. Anyway, depending on how things go, I will give the son-NG meet up more thought. Who would have thought I had to actually think about this stuff?

Oh, Monique -- {{{hugs}}}

Glad it went well, trying2. In my case, because my son lives in semi-independent living, I couldn't do an accidental meet up. I have to plan to go out there to meet him or plan to have him brought somewhere to meet me. I could do so and not tell NG my son is going to be there, but that would be a bit too weird to me Someday. I plan to bring up a meet at some point because it seems like the right thing to do. I've met his daughter and her boyfriend, so for continuity and if we are looking to make a thing of this for real, it only makes sense.

You will be okay, trying2. Therapy, yes -- can I come? I need a session too ... On family intro's, I've thought about asking NG to meet my son, who is the only family I have living anywhere near me. I don't want to be weird about it and I don't want to end up feeling some kinda way if he doesn't want to, which I don't envision but you know, that imagine the worst case scenario thing ... So I haven't done it. Sigh.

Lindsay -- so sorry to hear of these added difficulties. My prickly issue is my LH's daughter. So, I've been widowed twice; first time when I was very young (my son's father) and then last year from my second husband. LH was open about not wanting me to be that sad widow, sitting round, not connecting to the world. He had been sick for a long time and we both knew it was a matter of time even though neither of us voiced it. Before he died, he told me that he didn't want me to be alone for the rest of my life. He even told my pastor that his biggest fear was that I wouldn't try to meet anyone else. I was so surprised to know that he had considered my happiness in this way. Anyhow, I was ready to explore dating just a couple of months after he died because I'd started mourning a year earlier when he'd been hospitalized and given a 50% of survival; after that, it was doctor's visits every week, wheelchair bound, oxygen, surgery toward dialysis (he didn't live long enough to get on it ... the issue was his heart just was no longer strong enough to run everything), and so on. I met NG about four months after LH died and we are still together as it were. I told a few people close to me the first time we went out (more for safety reasons than anything else). I told my mom, who was thrilled and still is. I told I think one person in LH's family, who is about my age and has also been widowed more than once. She gets it. I finally told my son toward the end of last year (he is 22, is on the autism spectrum and lives in semi-independent living) and he was thrilled. LH's daughter is an only child as well like me and my son but I think she feels guilty because she didn't keep in touch with her dad. Plus she is more of a stereotypical daddy's girl She is 30 and still calls him daddy (I know a number of women older than her who use mommy and daddy, but even as an only child I wasn't brought up that close to my parents. They kept feelings pretty close to the vest so it's tough for me to get). He's been gone like a year and a half and she has a photo of him and her when she was really little as her social media photo. She hasn't changed it. I have only hinted at having a friend but she feels it should be platonic; one time a while ago I mentioned this 'friend' had offered to repair something around the house but I didn't want to ask since he'd have to get dirty. Her response was that since I have two bathrooms in the house I could ask him to do it and then could let him take a shower, but I wasn't allowed to have him in my bedroom to use the master (!). Right. She mentions him at random times when we talk because she calls still to check on me and occasionally hints at wanting to come here. I've made it pretty obvious that I'm not in a place for that to happen and I think she finally gets it, but somewhere in there she's not accepting that I'm not pining for her dad like she is. I was with him through the tough times and as husband and wife, I know what he said he wanted for me. I'm in that place and think he's tickled pink that I'm happy. Like Metv said, you be happy. Those folks can't live your life. Our LH's are gone; the marriage vow is fulfilled. Time to step into the future.

Mizpah -- that post you weren't going to post digs into a few more of your 'I want items'. It seems that you got accustomed to a lifestyle -- financial security, being the sun around which your LH rotated, being free to do as you wished. As you said, your NG has a different view of life. Questions: did you know that when you all were less entangled? Did it not matter or was the attraction (infatuation, whatever you want to label it) overwhelming the things that now have bubbled to the surface? Did you not desire marriage back then, was it not a topic of conversation, did you assume he wanted to marry? Do you believe, over and above adoring him, you can make this life work, even if it doesn't have the bells and whistles you had with your LH? Is it 'just' the marriage thing? I don't mean that one lightly as being legally together (having the paper that declares you wed) is very important to some people. I hope my questions and comments here are not too far out; I have never been in your previous situation, even though my second husband was probably pretty close -- he was a musician so never were we NOT concerned about how the next bill was getting paid lol -- because he called himself my biggest fan. He was always in my corner and as emotionally supportive as he could be up until the day he died. The first husband was a bus and truck driver, very ill tempered, which is probably what took him from life; my happiness was the last thing on his mind. I am an only child and have always been very independent. Have money, don't have money ... I will work and get what I want. I get tongue-tied when people do things for me as I am not used to it ;D I tell myself I would get married again and I would like to marry my NG, but if it doesn't happen, that's okay too. I hope we remain 'a thing' until one or the other of us meets our end. I look at my mother who hasn't remarried since my dad died nearly 23 years ago: she has her 'friend', who lived with a woman for about the same amount of time and they never got married. My mom says she doesn't want to -- she likes having her own place and whatnot. She stays at his house, he stays at hers, they each go home if they get on each other's nerves or simply have things to do on their own turf. It is what it is. They make each other happy, they look out for each other (they are each other's health guardian so he can make decisions for her and she can make decisions for him). At their ages, they crack me up. Just a late night rambling here. Want to see you come back and post how absolutely ridiculously happy you are, no matter the reason or path to it {{{hugs!!!}}}

Thanks Forgottenwife -- I hope so as well!

klim's post brings up an interesting issue about differences. The responses to her post seem to suggest that many of us have been going about this dating business in ways that might be different from how we were in our previous relationships or that we are navigating our 'new normal'. Ultimately, I would be so bold as to suggest that none of us are willing to settle this go as we continue in our new situations. I had an interesting experience with NG (sorry, Metv ... 'new guy' feels better to my brain that identifying him by chapter since he would be my Chapter 3 I guess, since I've been widowed twice ...) this weekend. His birthday is today and I enjoy spoiling the person I'm with on their special day. Such spoiling usually begins with me asking what they'd like to do as it gets closer and involves getting little special gifts. I went to his place yesterday to take his gift and a cheesecake (which he asked for since his daughter was making dinner). He was surprised about the gift because he said it had been years since anyone had given him a gift. I had no words and it made me sad. His daughter and her boyfriend ate dinner and didn't call NG to let him know it was ready ... we had snacked before she finished but later he went out and saw that the meal was finished so then we made plates. I was sad again that she didn't have us all come to the table to eat together to celebrate her dad's birthday. Maybe it's just me being sensitive to the differences in how families work. This whole spoiling on birthdays thing was something that I started doing during my time with LH. I wanted to create new traditions that weren't specifically based on anything I'd experienced or that he'd experienced and have carried on doing it again now that I am in a new situation. It feels all the more important because no one has done things to make NG feel special. He texted me later in the morning to thank me for making it a good day. I replied that I'd be a pretty awful signif, girlfriend, partner in crime, or whatever term he'd like to use as I wasn't all that good with knowing how the label thing works; we'll see how that goes On a fun note, he broke the 'house rule' of no sleep-overs and I stayed the night again It's the first time in their new place and the second time ever. It was tough saying good-bye this morning but he had things to do and so did I, like get home to my dogs and my work day lol! It's such a process of navigating all this relationship stuff. Whew!

Well-said, Bunny and Metv. While the dating scene and early relationship life is very junior-high, we are adults and can use our words It's never easy but creates a much better space. Love that 'give me time to miss you', Bunny -- I read that on a relationship blog several months ago and it's always a great reminder!

Seems the ability to 'like' a post is gone again : CaptainsWife -- consider what you said 'liked' ;D

Forgotten -- thanks for sharing. The fact that you and your NG had your discussion at the three year mark; it helps put things such as time in perspective. I remind myself in my case that although my NG and I have been connected for just around a year, we've only spent weekends together for the most part. If you count it in days, we've spent a total of maybe two months in each other's presence. Not a ton of time at all. trying2 -- I agree with you; I never thought I'd fall head first like this at my age. Or any age as I too tend to be not particularly emotional, probably because the first marriage beat the possibility out of me ... I am still learning the art of open communication and am grateful because NG is good at it. Life is about learning and when it comes to this thing called relationships, the more we work at it, I hope the better we get Have I said lately how much I appreciate each of you? Yes -- I do.

klim -- it is interesting, this 'me time' navigation and what we do with it. I went through a spell early on that I wanted to spend every possible second with NG (and still do, even though I've never told him that and try not to act like it lol). It was different because we both work so seeing each other during the week is impossible for the most part. It was the joy of being with someone healthy in my case; it seems rather harsh to see in writing but still, it is what it is ... I'd spent less time being a wife in the last half of our time together than being a caregiver and it was nice to be in relationship again. However, as time has gone on (we passed our year mark at the end of May; interestingly, I was listening to a replay of a presentation by a relationship guy who said that two people can't really know each other in just a year, which put it in perspective), I've found myself in a better place and am back to my own schedule. That said, the way it happened was because NG went about his life. He kept his 'me time', even though it took a few months for him to get to a place of saying something to me like 'I need to take a day to myself -- the week has been brutal'. It made me focus back on all the things I love to do. Now, I go about my time and try not to be the one who texts first and so on. I love my freedom. Always have. I think the 25 years I've spent in marriage or something similar between two people has rubbed off on me, in that I also love being part of a two-some. It's a balancing act, isn't it, trying to be part of something whilst being us in total. Might it be possible to sit him down and have a talk? Might it be possible to pull back a wee bit, not to the point of not being in touch but just to more strongly indicate that you need your own space? Maybe taking your children off to do things, just the bunch of you without NG every now and again? Be loving and very present when you are together. Be who you need to be for yourself otherwise ... On the long goodbye's thing ... as Trying wrote, that's a tough one. Maybe if you conquer the first point, this will correct as well. Hope I didn't ramble too much there {{hugs}}

Yes, yes, and yes, Mizpah! Appreciation! We all are so different which is what makes the human mosaic so interesting. On another thread we've had lots of discussion of what I guess we could call love language -- how do you say I love you versus the other person. Some folks just blurt it out all over the place, others plant gardens of flowers, others use touch or looks, and on and on. It sounds like you are either already in or are standing at the precipice of a good place for yourself. And that's what counts

Mizpah: first, {{{hugs}}} Second, your post makes me think about why we want things sometimes. You mentioned that you had a certain type of relationship with your LH and the one with NG is very different. Might it be that your litmus for what a relationship looks like is based on what came before? This question is not to diminish the rest of your post by far but is offered as food for thought. I am only a year in with my NG. He is more affectionate in some ways and less in others than LH. I go back and forth with thoughts of marriage to him but have no idea if he does the same. We don't talk about it; while his previous marriage did not last long, they courted for quite some time, and in the end the relationship was damaging to him. He remains hurt and for this reason our conversations about marriage tend toward the esoteric. He has never said he was against marrying again and neither have I. We don't refer to ourselves as a couple, but I don't get that either of us came from families that used labels in relationships a lot. But I'd like to -- similar to you, I'd like to be the difference maker However, and thanks to 'talking out' my thoughts and feelings here, amongst people who have been or are in similar straits, as well as reading several dating blogs (because between two marriages, both of which left me widowed, I have spent nearly half my life married and don't know how to date) has helped me come to terms with going with the flow, not expecting this man to be what I've created in my head and accepting him as he is. That said, acceptance and settling are two very different things. More food for thought, so no answers expected: are you and he in this because you've gotten comfortable? Is the idea of trying to build relationship -- any form of loving, close, intimacy -- seem like too much work or too impossible to seek out elsewhere? Do you love him and does he love you, as individuals -- not as the other parent of the child you had together? Are you in love with one another? Maybe I'm just a beach hippie, but I believe where I live is sanctuary. There should be peace for everyone who shares the space. Arguments don't happen here. Do we disagree? Do we drive each other crazy with our habits and quirks? Surely! But fighting? Nope. I know what soul-discord that causes from my first marriage and knew I never wanted to live like that again. My second husband helped me work toward this notion of sanctuary; despite how crazy we made each other from time to time, we never fought or had a cross word in 16 years because we talked about everything, no matter how hard it was. So what do you want? Can you get it in this relationship? Not without a serious set of conversations. Courageous conversations where you are willing to hear your guy and he is willing to hear you, without judgment or expectation beyond honesty. Where you both identify what it means to move forward, either on the same path or on complementary ones where you can be good together but not together for your child. You deserve every happiness in the world. Life is too short to settle for not having it. But it's what you make it. If you can make it with this man, great -- life is about compromise after all. If you can't, what does that mean? Only you and he can figure that out. Sending love and light ...

I hear you, tybec! NGs dad died tragically when he was young and his mom was in her early 70s at most when she died, so he has not had to experience the sick parent thing. My dad died in a car accident when I was in my 20s and my mom is in her mid-70s, dealing with dialysis and so on. Longevity tends to run on both sides from what I can tell, but health? Not so much. I would dare say I am in the best shape I've ever been in; lost 60lb over the past couple of years (I was on that journey before LH died but afterward I realized I'd spent so much time caregiving for others but not caring for myself) but I too am 48 and my body knows it LOL! I can't do yoga because of past injuries I never cared for properly I now have limited mobility in one leg. I've never been flexible or graceful, so classes like Zumba will never see me and my uncoordinated self. NG also likes women with a bit of meat on their bones, but I doubt he would have been as interested when I was at my largest. Heck, I wasn't interested in me then either Anyway, I pray for good health for the both of us because I don't want to be a caregiver again and don't want someone doing all that for me either. Maybe we could end up being that cranky old couple, living in the retirement place where they take care of us, driving the nurses crazy together LOL.

Very true! I've had it with going alone lately. There's no one around me who doesn't have someone ... spouse, kids, something. Right now, life is work for me. That gets old too. Oh, well. I guess we all have those varying seasons of life

Thanks, trying2. I do a little something exercise-like each day as well; I think I am in generally good health but as you mentioned, you just never know. NG hasn't had a spouse/partner die so I think about this. I don't want to be a burden. I honestly wouldn't want anyone to have to be a caregiver for me and worry at the same time that no one would want to.

Hi, all! I am not sure if there is a post like this anywhere; if there is, please let me know and I'll try to delete this one So I know we've got an area for extreme caregiving, but this didn't seem appropriate for that. Here goes ... I dare say there are quite a few of us here who were caregivers for our spouses/partners/signif's before they died or at least were here to watch them go through some things. Now, for those on this thread, we are moving forward into new relationships or are at least seeking them. The question is, how do you navigate your own health, that of your parents or other relatives? I live on the other side of the country from most of my family; my mother (been widowed from my dad for almost 23 years but has a companion) is on dialysis, my uncle just older than her (married to a woman who is not consistent about her feelings for him, I think because she is more about herself) has been dealing with prostate issues, my 22-year-old son who lives about 40 miles from me was in hospital for pneumonia and had to be placed in ICU and intubated for a while, and I have my own possible issues (asymmetry on the last mammogram, menopause, possible vision related issues ...). I just passed the first-year mark dating NG and am mortified that I'll be the dangling health participle in this relationship should it continue to grow and advance as I'd like. I think part of my angst is related to the emotional roller-coaster of menopause, but there is a certain reality about changing health. I am 48, NG will be 53 on Monday. Not old by far, but still beginning to feel that half-century. It's a concern, even though I do my workouts, am active (somewhat) with outdoor activities, and have good bloodwork results for the most part. Paranoia? Perhaps How about you?

Well said, calimom -- Switzerland! While there are some points that should be clear (where's the line), for the most part, being out of it is best. I talked with LH and didn't engage with the ex at all during our living together and married years. I spoke civilly when we'd go to her house to take prom pictures of the daughter but stayed in the background. When LH's dad died, the ex wanted to ride in the family car to the funeral. We weren't married then so I drove myself to the church and greeted family and friends who arrived before the 'family'; however, when it was time to process in, LH and I walked together, while his daughter and ex walked in together. Learning to navigate this thing isn't easy, but it can be done with dignity.

Yes, Sugarbell! Not that anyone would ever label me as hot, but intelligent, certainly But yes, this is similar to what my LH was getting at. His ex was feeling some type of way about what she'd lost. In recent years, she'd even told their daughter that no one had ever treated her like LH did. She's never remarried or held a long-term relationship from what I understand since they broke up.

{{{hugs}}} Yes, open communication will be key in this situation. Feel free to share my story or parts of it if it might help. You could always start off with 'I know this woman whose former husband's ex ...' so as not to get too deep in where you got the story

So been there! LH and his ex were legally separated when we met and eventually moved in together. I think I was finally a real threat; he had dated and lived with other women during all the years they were apart (he admitted that the reason there had been no divorce was he wanted her to cough up half the cost since their being apart was because of her in the first place). Before his health got really too bad to keep it up, he taught an African Dance class. She and his daughter danced. I tried it and it made me cry because I am so not coordinated enough; the only reason I did it was to be in class too. However, I got over myself She would come to class in these tight leggings and fawn all over him; he would look at her and be like, What are you doing? I didn't say a word and he told me that she had was acting like that because she knew he was happy and was trying to cause problems. From that conversation on, I ignored her. They finally got divorced and as soon as the paperwork came through that it was final, he and I were 'engaged' (we had lived together for about four years by then); of course she got angry when she found out (daughter told her that her dad had given me a ring; actually, he told me to buy the ring I wanted since he had no clue about what I might like as I have strange and always changing tastes lol) -- called him up and asked him if he couldn't wait until the ink was dry on the divorce. He told her that it should even be a thing since they had been legally separated for like 12 or 13 years or something. After he died, she was suddenly like a sister-wife or something, telling me that she loves me and all this. : Even now if LH's daughter calls me she's often in the background, saying that she's here for me if I need someone to talk to. As if. I keep it kind because in her own wacky way, she loved him as well. She is the mother of his only child. She carries his last name. But we ain't gonna be best buddies. The difference here is that LH stood up to her. If there is a way that your NG can come to an understanding that he is allowing her to use the children as weapons, that being nice to her is not going to change that, maybe it will be ugly for a minute but then life goes on. It is a tough place to be in. My NG is estranged from his eldest daughter (24? 25?) because the mom did a great job of brainwashing her into thinking he was the worst person on the planet. His youngest (23?) navigates them both and lives with him. They have a decent relationship. But the eldest won't come around at all, having swallowed all the crap that was fed to her. Yes, it's tough to accept, but the kids are their own people. If he keeps steady, doesn't talk bad or treat their mom bad but creates and maintains boundaries, they will see it. They may not accept it, they may fully accept it. There is no telling. But giving in to her? That doesn't help them. It keeps the ex in a place of power.

trying2 -- this is absolutely therapy for me I have one cousin who has been married three times and all three husbands have died (she was married to the first and third when they died and divorced from the second one when he died) and she's only about two or three years older than me. However, she is on a much different path and I don't talk to her about relationship stuff much. I mention NG and she is happy that I have him, so we leave it at that. Yes, daysofelijah, it is a fact of life. However, the moment it fell out of my mouth yesterday it felt disingenuous. I am binging on the show This Is Us and in one of the episodes I watched last night, the 70+ year old widowed doctor was just over a year out from the death of his wife from cancer; he still had all her stuff around, clothes in the closet, medications in the bathroom cabinet. He talked to her at breakfast. His son was on him about moving on because he and his wife were worried. The doctor went to the cemetery and talked to his wife. He told her that he wasn't sure he could go on doing what he had been doing and wasn't sure she wanted him to. He got rid of all her stuff -- a truck came and took the wheelchair, he folded and packed her clothes, cleaned out the bathroom items. The last scene was him having dinner with a widowed woman he knew from the neighborhood who had expressed interest in him. Of course I cried. I want to just get on with it. I wish I had the ability to pack up all the stuff LH's daughter wants and send it to her instead of having it out in the garage. I want to pay off the loan I have on the SUV (that's broken and not running anymore) he always drove so I can get it out of my driveway. I know it will happen, but I feel like I'm ready for it to be done, now. It's probably more of the menopause moments and worry about my own health and will settle once I know whether I have any issues going on with my eyes and what's up with the asymmetry they found in my mammogram ... sigh.

So much for moving beyond widowhood: got a sales call and told the guy trying to get me to buy the all inclusive trip that I was in no position to travel as I was still trying to get myself together after the death of my husband. Not a complete untruth but I felt horrid after I hung up.